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Video/Tutorial - Cyber Sub-Zero Optimized Meterless Knockdown Vortex with 5-way Mix-Ups (42%+ Meterless Combos)

JDM

Warrior
I mean, CSZ will have multiple top eights most likely at FR alone lmao. REO and SonicFox will be using him.

:3
 

Gesture Required Ahead

Get on that hook
I said devs (as a whole) nowadays are lazy (by constantly patching and not having a final product on release) and there was no mention of me saying they should be fired or anyone single handed. I meant back in the 2000 era, employees would get warned for missing broken stuff and would get fired if it continued throughout their performance reviews but now everything is rushed out and patched.
You're failing to see the fact that at least nowadays there is the option to find broken stuff post-release and fix them. And with better tech, more bugs there are to find.

If you think what people find post-release are broken could you imagine the state of the games beforehand?
 

its_ezie

Apprentice
Optimized knockdown vortex off pretty much any hit or starter example:


Mix up combo starter options:

- Unreactable Overhead - (Instant Dive Kick)
- Unreactable Low - (B+3)
- Unblockable - (Throw) (It doesn't matter if they tech the throw, they will still be frozen for a full combo)
- Psuedo Unblockable - (B+3,D+4)
- Anti Wake-Up - (single attack + EX Slide) (works on just about every wake-up that's not 2 hits armor, invincible, etc.) (VIDEO BELOW)

REO pleeease riddle me this. how do you deal with people that want to hold down instead of getting right up? thats what majority of players will do especially online to throw off my timing.
 

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
I mean, CSZ will have multiple top eights most likely at FR alone lmao. REO and SonicFox will be using him.

:3
Sonic Fox is on the Butcher LF train because apparently no one cares about one touch leading to 35% half screen carry double restand combos that end in frame traps leading to another free 50/50 attempt that ends in the corner.

Nah, that's perfectly fine. CSZ is all that matters.
 

Nerobianco

Mortal
So let them use him. Let's see how it turns out, people have no idea how to play against it YET. If REO found this stuff in three days what does it say about the people who created it and left it in the game? He has the tools but still, someone must pull it off in versus.
 

JDM

Warrior
Another thing
Sonic Fox is on the Butcher LF train because apparently no one cares about one touch leading to 35% half screen carry double restand combos that end in frame traps leading to another free 50/50 attempt that ends in the corner.

Nah, that's perfectly fine. CSZ is all that matters.
It's cause he didn't make a video!!!!

Also the pseudo unblockable always has the same timing am I wrong @YOMI REO ? It's low mid overhead instant low. And it's punishable. Seems risky to do on someone who might actually know the matchup. Full combo punish on a block. And it doesn't seem that hard to block either.
 

JDM

Warrior
REO pleeease riddle me this. how do you deal with people that want to hold down instead of getting right up? thats what majority of players will do especially online to throw off my timing.
Read it and blow them up. Holding down is extremely risky against someone with a 50/50. Meaty them with a small move on normal wakeup timing (like a D4 or something) and if they don't get up, do a free 50/50. That's what I do at least.
 

TheIrishFGCguy

Pew pew pew
7 new characters + huge balance patch = incredible amounts of exaggerating, downplaying, and just general misinformation.
I think I'm going to temporarily retire from MKX and TYM until the dust settles and everything calms down. This is all too much for my tiny brain :|
 

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
Also the pseudo unblockable always has the same timing am I wrong @YOMI REO ? It's low mid overhead instant low. And it's punishable. Seems risky to do on someone who might actually know the matchup. Full combo punish on a block. And it doesn't seem that hard to block either.
This is the funniest part of all of this. I'd bet money 99% of people have not labbed this yet. When I visually saw it I was like "wow wtf? Impossible to block!" Then I went to the lab and found it was very easy to block. Borderline gimmicky. I dunno why it's so easy but it seems the inputs come out extra smooth on block making it easy, nothing like Quan's. Almost as if they programmed something in to make it easier to block.

But instead of even checking it one time, people visually saw it and demanded nerfs. Unbelievable.
 

JDM

Warrior
Yeah of course man. That's how this community is. I saw people sharing that 100 percent reset unblockable Cyrax stuff saying "omg this game this is why I don't play this game".

Like bruh, you can get out of it pretty easily, and it's nowhere near that difficult to just sit there and block. Training mode is your friend.

I don't know what it is with NRS games, but they command absolutely no respect from like 99 percent of the player base. Characters in SF4 had fucked up shit and no one trashed the game and the company like people do for NRS games. It's weird to me.

But yeah, it's pretty damn easy to block. I'm sure I'd get hit with it every once in a while, but there's a very static timing to the mixup from what I can tell. And full punish on block.
 

JDM

Warrior
Maybe videos like this shouldnt be shown without showing viable ways out as well. Then people wouldnt go ape shit.
He really shouldn't have to downplay his character in a tech video so people don't instantly cry nerf... I mean you can SEE ways to get out or reads that are taking place on both sides fairly easily if you play fighting games at a decent level. Or... ya know.. you could lab it yourself if you're really worried about it (Which anyone who has even implied he should be nerfed already should have done. No excuse.)
 

TheIrishFGCguy

Pew pew pew
Training mode is your friend.
THIS. The amount of times I have seen somebody say something about a character, usually right after someone new is released or a balance patch, only to go into the lab and find out that they were completely wrong is ridiculous. Too many people like to feel qualified to give their loud opinions on characters and changes without actually bothering to lab, or at least lab extensively.

Note: I'm not talking about Cyber Sub Zero because, funnily enough, I haven't actually taken him to the lab yet so I have no concrete opinion. I'm just talking in general terms.
 

Name v.5.0

Iowa's Finest.
He really shouldn't have to downplay his character in a tech video so people don't instantly cry nerf... I mean you can SEE ways to get out or reads that are taking place on both sides fairly easily if you play fighting games at a decent level. Or... ya know.. you could lab it yourself if you're really worried about it (Which anyone who has even implied he should be nerfed already should have done. No excuse.)
I see your logic, but TYM doesnt...
 

looktotheluna

Apprentice
You're failing to see the fact that at least nowadays there is the option to find broken stuff post-release and fix them. And with better tech, more bugs there are to find.

If you think what people find post-release are broken could you imagine the state of the games beforehand?
I'm not failing to see anything and of course, I know there is an option to fix stuff post-release nowadays and I welcome that.

My original comment was taken out of context and with some getting the wrong end of the stick.
 

Samsara

Resident Cynic
This is the funniest part of all of this. I'd bet money 99% of people have not labbed this yet. When I visually saw it I was like "wow wtf? Impossible to block!" Then I went to the lab and found it was very easy to block. Borderline gimmicky. I dunno why it's so easy but it seems the inputs come out extra smooth on block making it easy, nothing like Quan's. Almost as if they programmed something in to make it easier to block.

But instead of even checking it one time, people visually saw it and demanded nerfs. Unbelievable.
What does all this remind you off? You know, people crying about corner setups before actually labbing them?

Tom Brady was right.
 

FROST_

KH | DsV BLOODxGOD
It seems Like he might need some adjustments, specially the dive kick should be mid. I've mained SCZ for over a year in MK9 and even though he was trash I was still able to pull of some of his hardest matches. I am happy to see him finally as strong character after years. It seems Like he has deep meta game that will deliver amazing free style swag Gameplay, all viable. The days of corner ice clone rape are coming to an end - Fuck You Grand Master.
Why make it a mid? Just like quan their where ways out. Just like Tanya their where ways out. Just like GM corner their are ways out. YOU have to explore them. Instead calling for a nerf on 1st week. If you main CSZ you know these setups have to come from a knockdown. So tell me what type of player would (in the neutral) allow you to throw a ice ball then dive kick? The only guess is "should I block L the OH or OH then low." It's pretty fair. And you can't say "well I can throw a bomb the run up and b3" because a little term called (recovery) and no good player will allow you to run up and do a b3. You can only get these setups off a knockdown unlike Cyrax who can leave you standing with a net, then throw a bomb to force your low block and either do 1 or 2 things... #1 b2 for L - OH or OH - L. Or #2 for throw to where you can tech it and end up in the same position. So please tell me which is worse... Having a character having to knock you down or one whol leaves you standing with no way out.?

I'll wait for answer and explanation
 

Cossner

King of the Jobbers 2015
I think your under estimating people a little bit there. This game really isn't that hard to play at all. Some variations with run cancels and harder juggles sure, but when I can teach my 4 year old cousin basic bnbs (with Goro, Tremor and Kitana) in less then a week and specials in a day I'm hard press to believe that. My sister and mom and can do specials and this is the only video game they play due to them just wanting to get involved with something I enjoy. Everyone of my casual friends can all easily do specials and combos and they don't even own a single mk/fighting game.
Your 4 year-old cousin (wtf), your mom and your sister are not high level players. They're not going to the lab with CSZ to find tech. Don't confuse pressing buttons with actually knowing what they're doing. No the 99% of the people buying this don't care about CSZ corner setups they just see the character and think the moves are cool. How is this even an argument lol
Thing is about the testing is that REO and others have only had these characters for two and a half days yet they've found these np, so whats the excuse for the professional testers who have had them much longer?
Why do you assume they don't know this? What if they found ways around it or decided to keep it for a reason? I'm willing to bet you haven't even played a single decent CSZ player yet and you're already making judgements.