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MK11 Johnny Cage General Discussion

LarSanity

Who hired this guy
Been on a little hiatus lately due to this site going South of Heaven fast but I need to rant...


Really enjoy the fact that shit like this exists yet we can barely get 1 KB (let alone fucking 3) in an entire match! To me this is where he struggles the most, and of course the absurd whiffing issues but he's not the only one struggling with that. One thing that we have going for us at least is JC literally has a female crouching hit box.

F3 doesn't need to me a mid, he doesn't need an overhead. I'd definitely take a few frames off F4 start up but I can live with it. In my opinion his frames could be better for sure but they're not terrible.

But my fucking God these Krushing Blows!! What the fuck were they thinking? The whole game to me revolves around Krushing Blows and Fatal Blows and both of JC's are trash. The FB cancel is ok I guess but in comparison to some others it's trash LBH.

KB wish list:
-KB activates on 3rd Amp Nut Punch
-KB activates on max distance Shadow Kick
-Throw KB, how the fuck does he not have a Throw KB? His entire game plan revolves around throws.
-F2,1,2 last hit of the string triggers a KB, kinda like Cassie's B2,4,3


People that think this game is balanced is either a heroin addict or they play Sonya/Geras. Injustice 2 may have not been for everybody and may have been boring but it was the most balanced NRS title to date. I know it's early and things will change but they really took a step back with the balance of this game.

I play Cassie, Kabal, and Scorpion as well and though they are effective they're all boring AF, yeah they get W's but they're not as gratifying as JC.

Rant over, blow me up IDGAF.
Yea the character playstyles get kind of boring besides Johnny.
In injustice 2 I played mainly GA and red hood after that I played robin, deadshot and cyborg they all played differently and the game plan is different.
This game I look at the many characters ive loved over the years like liu, jax and subzero and their so boring.
I'm hoping for good dlc characters, maybe some telekenisis rip kenshi
 
Been on a little hiatus lately due to this site going South of Heaven fast but I need to rant...


Really enjoy the fact that shit like this exists yet we can barely get 1 KB (let alone fucking 3) in an entire match! To me this is where he struggles the most, and of course the absurd whiffing issues but he's not the only one struggling with that. One thing that we have going for us at least is JC literally has a female crouching hit box.

F3 doesn't need to me a mid, he doesn't need an overhead. I'd definitely take a few frames off F4 start up but I can live with it. In my opinion his frames could be better for sure but they're not terrible.

But my fucking God these Krushing Blows!! What the fuck were they thinking? The whole game to me revolves around Krushing Blows and Fatal Blows and both of JC's are trash. The FB cancel is ok I guess but in comparison to some others it's trash LBH.

KB wish list:
-KB activates on 3rd Amp Nut Punch
-KB activates on max distance Shadow Kick
-Throw KB, how the fuck does he not have a Throw KB? His entire game plan revolves around throws.
-F2,1,2 last hit of the string triggers a KB, kinda like Cassie's B2,4,3


People that think this game is balanced is either a heroin addict or they play Sonya/Geras. Injustice 2 may have not been for everybody and may have been boring but it was the most balanced NRS title to date. I know it's early and things will change but they really took a step back with the balance of this game.

I play Cassie, Kabal, and Scorpion as well and though they are effective they're all boring AF, yeah they get W's but they're not as gratifying as JC.

Rant over, blow me up IDGAF.
lol F3 has to be a mid.
 

lionheart21

Its Game Over, Man
Premium Supporter
Been messing around with Johnny, and I like him a lot.

Anything I should know?
Johnny's game centers around footsies, stagger strings and throws, using his F3 and F4 to create space. Cage players need to play patiently and make good reads, which is easier said than done.

Johnny relies heavily on movement and dashes, having some of the fastest dashspeed in the game. His straight forceball is also a solid projectile that should be incorporated into his footsies game, since its not only a quick projectile but its Amplified version gives plus frames on block.

Even though its -6 on block, his D4 has such good reach that unless your opponent also has long-reaching normal like Noob or Scorpion, they really can't answer it if you do it from sweep range.
 
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lionheart21

Its Game Over, Man
Premium Supporter
I'm still holding my opinion strong that all Johnny needs is his KBs to have less rediculous requirements and the universal hitboxes to be more consistent. Nothing else needs to be changed property wise.
What about framedata-wise? F4 is too unsafe on block.
 

LarSanity

Who hired this guy
I'm still holding my opinion strong that all Johnny needs is his KBs to have less rediculous requirements and the universal hitboxes to be more consistent. Nothing else needs to be changed property wise.
If his kbs became easier it would make less work of things lol, watching as scorpion presses 2 button kb 300 is annoying.
If they dont fix them I want a faster mid just like the rest of the cast.
 

Name v.5.0

Iowa's Finest.
Siiiiiiigh...Johnny's D4 goes under Shao Khan's F34 string intermittently. Completely unreliable in a poke war. Good thing Shao isn't great in the rest of the MU.

I know this isnt the only character that steps over it. It just kind of pisses me off.
 

DrFolmer

AKA Uncle Kano
As good as our D4 is, I just kinda sit there like "WTF" when I see Sub and Scorpion throw out D4's. The range is annoying by itself, but I hate how much pushback they have on block. I like to abuse people who do multiple pokes despite being minus with either reversal throws or d4 into f344, but these two guys are SO safe if they want to be. It's just annoying that they can use a d4 and it doesnt matter whether or not it's blocked - they get out of throw mixups anyway due to the pushback. It's like a get out of jail card for free. Sure if they keep doing them we can just f4 their asses. However, if they space it properly so it hits at the furthest range of the normal, they can back away in time to avoid f4. I don't know it's just stupid to have pokes on block work as excellent shimmy tools in my opinion.

I just need to grind more Scorps and Subs to learn their tendencies
 
As good as our D4 is, I just kinda sit there like "WTF" when I see Sub and Scorpion throw out D4's. The range is annoying by itself, but I hate how much pushback they have on block. I like to abuse people who do multiple pokes despite being minus with either reversal throws or d4 into f344, but these two guys are SO safe if they want to be. It's just annoying that they can use a d4 and it doesnt matter whether or not it's blocked - they get out of throw mixups anyway due to the pushback. It's like a get out of jail card for free. Sure if they keep doing them we can just f4 their asses. However, if they space it properly so it hits at the furthest range of the normal, they can back away in time to avoid f4. I don't know it's just stupid to have pokes on block work as excellent shimmy tools in my opinion.

I just need to grind more Scorps and Subs to learn their tendencies
Scorpion shouldn't be allowed to have 4 teleports. That's what makes him unbalanced. Raiden has teleports where he can appear on either side of you, but it's balanced because he cant hit you afterwards. Noob has a teleport, but it he's forced to hit you with it. Scorpion can teleport on either side of you, or he can amplify it, or simply just hit you once to where you let go of block. His teleports are a mixups game on their own.And he can chain two crushing blows if one hits you. It's ridiculous
 

DrFolmer

AKA Uncle Kano
Scorpion shouldn't be allowed to have 4 teleports. That's what makes him unbalanced. Raiden has teleports where he can appear on either side of you, but it's balanced because he cant hit you afterwards. Noob has a teleport, but it he's forced to hit you with it. Scorpion can teleport on either side of you, or he can amplify it, or simply just hit you once to where you let go of block. His teleports are a mixups game on their own.And he can chain two crushing blows if one hits you. It's ridiculous
Especially the variation where he can cancel. It essentially makes it a 33/33/33 LOL.
 

Mikemetroid

Who hired this guy, WTF?
Moderator
Premium Supporter
What about framedata-wise? F4 is too unsafe on block.
d4 covers almost the same distance and grants you a free f3.

f3 is a dope whiff punisher, so are forceballs.

If you need to punish something with f4, it goes into exnp/whatever. Just have to know when to use both? Shrug.

What do YOU want f4 to be? MK9/MKX f3? Scorpions f3 double kick string? eh
 

lionheart21

Its Game Over, Man
Premium Supporter
d4 covers almost the same distance and grants you a free f3.

f3 is a dope whiff punisher, so are forceballs.

If you need to punish something with f4, it goes into exnp/whatever. Just have to know when to use both? Shrug.

What do YOU want f4 to be? MK9/MKX f3? Scorpions f3 double kick string? eh
Just want it to be a bit less negative on block is all.
 

DarksydeDash

With my best, I will defeat your best.
As someone who plays Kitana, Johnny feels right at home with how she plays.

Lots of staggers and whiff punishing, but with a lack of KB.
 

lionheart21

Its Game Over, Man
Premium Supporter
As someone who plays Kitana, Johnny feels right at home with how she plays.

Lots of staggers and whiff punishing, but with a lack of KB.
Pretty much, yeah.

Basically to echo what has been said a lot already: Fix the hitbox issues, make his Krushing Blows easier, and give us a mid that's safe or slightly less negative on block (like F4), and we're cool, we really don't want or need anything else but that. The character is quite solid, and that would help him compete with some of the top-tier characters.
 

Vastly

Mr. Hollywood
Premium Supporter
F3 being a mid would definitely make him pretty busted.
I don't think it would be busted at all but I definitely think it would put him in the A tier range. Not at the top of that range but he would be a lot better.
 

Rip Torn

ALL I HAVE IS THE GREEN.
PSA:

D3 is Johnny's longest poke, goes just a smidge further than D4. It's also 1 frame slower than D4 and gives less frame advantage on hit.
 
Despite maining cage and erron I have no idea how the matchup goes. I haven't encountered any good errons online and have only ever seen one decent cage. If anyone else has any matchup knowledge that'd be neat
 

Wrath0594

Steam profile: 76561198102032134
I'm still holding my opinion strong that all Johnny needs is his KBs to have less rediculous requirements and the universal hitboxes to be more consistent. Nothing else needs to be changed property wise.
He’s defending Johnny, get him!

Tryna say my losses are my fault? I don’t think so...
:DOGE