MK10 & This communities cry for early patches.

[YOMI MITYEAP]

We are on the same page here, you acknowledge that what we complain and laud is read by the NRS patching team, and that the multiple patching system is flawed. Unless I am mistaken, in which case feel free to correct me.

What I find fault in, if anything, is that across the entire gaming community, solely the NRS community is held accountable for what characters are nerfed or buffed within the first few months of the game, which I feel is morally reprehensible. All communities, casual, NRS, developers, SRK, anime, should be held accountable accordingly.

Yeah we are on the same page here and I get what you are saying, we arent the sole reason something is patched for sure.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

So many people look at Capcom as if they're milking their customer base, but lets look at the business model they use:
Somehow, this business model works and helps a game mature. Instead of releasing a brand new game every 2 years, refining it seems to be the way to get customers to not only continue to spend money but to complain less about the game changing so drastically so often.

If I had to guess though, I'd say NRS/WB have made far more money from selling a new game to 3-4 million people every 2 years, than Capcom has made getting a smaller percentage of their game buyers to purchase a smaller update every couple of years.

Obviously from our perspective, whichever option favors our competitive scene is best.

But from a business/money perspective, NRS is king of the hill in fighting games and it'd be hard to convince their publisher to change in a way that brings them millions of dollars less overall.

 

[Jimmypotato]

It will happen, and it won't be the communitys fault, it will once again be a select few "top" players with loud voices that do it.

Well, for most of them the are now just "known" players, lets be serious here.

 

[VenomX-90]

Damn players already want patches, nerfs? etc. Damn ppl let the bitch breathe for a lil bit, shit the game is not out the Pussy yet. It needs to breathe before it gets Raped with updates, smh. Baby back bitches I swear.

 

[ando1184]

Hotfixes would be nice throughout the entire game's life cycle. Actual patches need a 4-6 month window before coming out imo.

 

[Mr Aquaman]

Seems to me like most fighting games on release are pretty bad balance wise on launch. Look at vanilla marvel3 or Street Fighter Iv.

vanilla sagat and gief were not utterly unbeatable or glitched or broken with infinites, frame advt, resets, inescapable pressure, ect ect, they just either did good damage and had a shit load of life. And vanilla marvel? F@#% MARVEL! :]

 

[Eric The Scruffy]

vanilla sagat and gief were not utterly unbeatable or glitched or broken with infinites, frame advt, resets, inescapable pressure, ect ect, they just either did good damage and had a shit load of life. And vanilla marvel? F@#% MARVEL! :]

Fair enough, but what about SFXT then? I remember hearing about infinites in that one for sure (never played it personally).

 

[Srryimwhte]

I despise when online is used as a reason for someone to be nerfed "yo ds dominates online", "yo kano upball to good, just spam it" smh haha

all we really have to say is mad people online refused to block in general and try to dash after being hit with a staggering projectile how the fuck would you not guess something hitting you causing stagger made you negative for one and most general players really only looked at the damn frame data months after

 

[Mr Aquaman]

Fair enough, but what about SFXT then? I remember hearing about infinites in that one for sure (never played it personally).

That game lol.... yeah there was super broken stuff, agreed.

 

[TaffyMeat]

MK has lasted for 20 years. This is the tournament scene phase. But it will go back to casual fun gamers at some point. Then people will be crying that it's gone casual, NOT REALIZING that it's because of their crying that make NRS have enough of trying to please everybody.

 

[iShinnok03]

MK10 will have utterly broken shit just as MK9 and Injustice did, just wait and see. I see two problems here, NRS releasing games in alpha state and the community demanding nerfs without analyzing first.

 

[Mortal Komhat]

I'm kind of laughing internally at some of the shit said in this thread but for reasons I'm not gonna get into here.

Seriously though, you know you're getting at least 5 patches, right? At least, if we follow MK9/I:GAU patch format.

Patch 1 : Day 1 patch, patching out stuff that was found in-between going gold and deadline before game launch
Patch 2 : First DLC character
Patch 3 : Second DLC character
Patch 4 : Third DLC character
Patch 5 : Fourth (final?) DLC character
Patch 6 : Fifth DLC character (I:GAU)
Patch 7 : Sixth DLC character (I:GAU)

With a potential Patch 6/8 if the game's still busted/they feel like it. Whine as you want, moan as you must, but that's the MINIMUM amount of patching the game's going to get. Even if NRS commits to not patching the game any more than necessary, that's at least 5 patches you're eating to the face regardless of whether you feel the game needs it or no.

It's not the amount of patches, but what they do with them.

 

[TaffyMeat]

Then there's day 0 kombos and kombos posted to YouTube that can't be done anymore because that shit's been patched bro.

 

[Mr. Mileena]

I think some people over exaggerate things too. We have our top tiers in this game, but then you get the toxic members of the community crying about Zatanna, Deathstroke, Killer Frost, etc. I mean it's okay to complain, we all have our characters we hate, but some people no matter how many times you play them, legit think some characters are broken. That's a huge problem.

Luckily, Injustice isn't left with such broken characters as MK9 had. I think every character except Joker can compete in tournament. that's 1 character in my opinion, that cannot compete, compared to MK9 where a large portion of characters could not be considered tourny viable.

I hope when MK10 comes out, we address things that may seem broken and just take note of them, but try and find ways around it, loopholes, search for other characters that may have dirt, etc.

As soon as some people see something they can't deal with, they cry nerf.

There's a difference between not being able to adapt and something being broken.

 

[KH StarCharger]

The thing is if we had an active arcade scene like Japan does to loctest new versions of games before they are mainstreamed, about 80% of the problem is taken care of when it comes to people making their voice heard about a busted aspect of the game. With that, the kinks are worked out for the most part to the point where the only things the finished/shipped/console ready product may have to have changed are the obligatory housekeeping items (small glitches, move problems, load times, etc.). Or what can happen since that's not quite an option for the mainstream here in america, NRS (and I'm not aware of their budget or assistance from WB for that matter) could release FTP (Free to play) versions of their games about a year or so before their console versions are released to clean up any problems/balance issues/glitches/etc. for their titles ala Namco Bandai and Tekken Revolution. So to be fair, having some of what Japan has in terms of the above resources could aid in the problem of early patching/hotfixing and not jumping the gun on issues. But on an overall scale I agree with your point scar to an extent.

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

I'm kind of laughing internally at some of the shit said in this thread but for reasons I'm not gonna get into here.

Seriously though, you know you're getting at least 5 patches, right? At least, if we follow MK9/I:GAU patch format.

Patch 1 : Day 1 patch, patching out stuff that was found in-between going gold and deadline before game launch
Patch 2 : First DLC character
Patch 3 : Second DLC character
Patch 4 : Third DLC character
Patch 5 : Fourth (final?) DLC character
Patch 6 : Fifth DLC character (I:GAU)
Patch 7 : Sixth DLC character (I:GAU)

With a potential Patch 6/8 if the game's still busted/they feel like it. Whine as you want, moan as you must, but that's the MINIMUM amount of patching the game's going to get. Even if NRS commits to not patching the game any more than necessary, that's at least 5 patches you're eating to the face regardless of whether you feel the game needs it or no.

It's not the amount of patches, but what they do with them.

I already said, if they did change their patching system, we wouldnt have as many patches but yeah they could do more with the patches as well

 

[DevilMaySpy]

Lol, do you even remember vanilla F23 breath?

 

[Under_The_Mayo]

How about patching a majority of things from the jump? Then hotfix things that were missed. There is a reason capcom does things in a way like this, look at what happened to mk9.........

We are the community full of people who, after Evo 2011, were saying "Well Evo was fun, when is MK10 coming out?" I'm not saying you were one of them. But MK9 was on a death spiral, requiring several patches from the get go, and then WB isn't gonna fund it anymore. It's not street fighter where huge numbers of people will buy multiple iterations of the game. We don't have global scenes, and 1,500 at EVO, countless players with sponsors, etc. We're not that big, and the purchases of our games buy the game, and they're not gonna buy a new version. I just don't think it would work. I'm not saying I don't wish it were different.

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

We are the community full of people who, after Evo 2011, were saying "Well Evo was fun, when is MK10 coming out?" I'm not saying you were one of them. But MK9 was on a death spiral, requiring several patches from the get go, and then WB isn't gonna fund it anymore. It's not street fighter where huge numbers of people will buy multiple iterations of the game. We don't have global scenes, and 1,500 at EVO, countless players with sponsors, etc. We're not that big, and the purchases of our games buy the game, and they're not gonna buy a new version. I just don't think it would work. I'm not saying I don't wish it were different.

I see what u meant, fair enough indeed. Honestly I think we all hope mk10 lasts for a while.

 

[STRYKIE]

While I wasn't really playing the game during the pre-patch Superman shitstorm, it always seemed too much of a coincidence to me that the pitchforks weren't actually directed at him until v1.05. I mean, yes, he was a top tier character either way, and still might be, but I think part of it is exactly that, we're just seeing the next best character, hypothetically, take the rap sheet in subsequent patches.

Even if MK9 received 2 or 3 more major patches in an alternate timeline, and Kabal, Cyrax, Kung Lao, (and whoever else is relevant to the example) were stripped down so hard that there's no way they wouldn't be in the bottom half of the tier list, we most likely would've seen the same conjecture applied to some other character.

Design oversights are subjective to NRS's resources for MK10, but in the grand scheme of things, yes, addressing them should still take the front seat in patches/new revisions.

/2 Pence.

 

[EMPRESS_SunFire]

I hope people don't cry for buffs or nerfs early in MK10 but i also hope NRS doesn't make stupid ass stuff just like F23, Black Adam's backdash or other stuff.... Which made a lot of people quitthis game early as hell.

 

[Chuckychuck]

The underlying issue IMHO is that NRS fighters have cool characters scattered throughout the tier levels and people want to play characters they find cool.

In fighting games you have a spectrum of archetypes where the left holds the greatest zoner and on the far right the greatest rush down character. In between these two ends are the jack of all trades master of none characters and all sorts of varieties within the spectrum.

Tiers determine which level of power each character design has and thus the issue with NRS games. Since, unlike other fighters, NRS actually has cool fighters it suckers people into playing the character they enjoy rather than play the archetype and default to the character sitting at the highest spot on the tier list for that archetype. You see in a fighter with a dull roster the zoners, for example, just play the best zoner and be done with it. Not so easily done in IGAU because the zoner they like has some dirt, but not the best dirt. For this reason, they complain since they aren't the best and want nerfs and buffs because they want their character to be on the higher tier level rather than in the middle of the pack or below. They do this because they do not want to play the best zoner design but rather a character they find cool who is a zoner.

For further information regarding the spectrum of character designs and tiers see this excellent tier listing: Excellent Tier List Link

 

[Eddy Wang]

While I wasn't really playing the game during the pre-patch Superman shitstorm, it always seemed too much of a coincidence to me that the pitchforks weren't actually directed at him until v1.05. I mean, yes, he was a top tier character either way, and still might be, but I think part of it is exactly that, we're just seeing the next best character, hypothetically, take the rap sheet in subsequent patches.

Even if MK9 received 2 or 3 more major patches in an alternate timeline, and Kabal, Cyrax, Kung Lao, (and whoever else is relevant to the example) were stripped down so hard that there's no way they wouldn't be in the bottom half of the tier list, we most likely would've seen the same conjecture applied to some other character.

Design oversights are subjective to NRS's resources for MK10, but in the grand scheme of things, yes, addressing them should still take the front seat in patches/new revisions.

/2 Pence.

Kabal was practically untouched, the only thing fixed in him was the F32~NDC block infinities, other than that, he stayed basically the same.

Among those 3 the most affected one with the nerf and IMO the character who definitely change the most since the first build was definitely Kung Lao.
From Vanilla, his Low hat was +24 on block, his spin had pushback on block putting him away from punishing range, he could to over 6 dive kicks in one combo, had an insane damage output with X-rays combos, the vanilla juggle system helped him to perform combos with ex hat over 2 times.

Before the final build, his X-Ray used to put the opponent into stun state on hit, that allowed a free jump in combo starter, ex Low Hat didn't require meter.

Cyrax was the most patched character in this game, yet he stood resilient and didn't gave a fuck how many times he was nerfed, his resets didn't went away lol.

 

[WayoftheFist]

When it comes out everyone will react the same as they did in mk9 and igau. Some characters will suffer for it while a few keep ridiculous shit to the end. I will try to remind everyone that scorpion and kano died for our sins, but it will be to no avail.

 

[Shadow316]

The problem is that when MK9/INJ was released, there was crazy stuff found like every two weeks or so. You'd find something dumb, demand a patch, fix it, then find something else. There'll always be 'patch worthy' stuff found. Lack of continued support is what hurts these games the most imo.