LBSH about kenshi

[Big Pampering]

this delayed tele 3 on block has more to it than I thought. I'll be home by friday and I will research this thoroughly. it actually makes sense though that delayed tele 3 is+ on block if instant tele 3 is neutral.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

The thing is, the threat of spin after tele 3 keeps auto-punishes in check.. but spin is also punishable. So it's a game of reads. Delayed 3 is punishable before it even hits. There's nothing free about any of it, it just depends on who makes the better read.

 

[Big Pampering]

2,1 hits after 23 frames and 1,1 after 25 so yes.

do you know the most advantage lao can get off of a delayed tele 3, like the lowest point? and is it true that it only jails on standing block?

The thing is, the threat of spin after tele 3 keeps auto-punishes in check.. but spin is also punishable. So it's a game of reads. Delayed 3 is punishable before it even hits. There's nothing free about any of it, it just depends on who makes the better read.

there are a lot of situations where the opponent will block if they are to slow on the teleport punish. like if the teleport already came out and you arent confident in being fast enough to punish it with your move, the tele 3 kick comes out at 5 frames, so when he is already behind you that kick will be even faster than his spin. when I am slow on the punish I will just block it because you are risking 43% if that tele 3 hits.

 

[LaR]

If it's done low enough that you can link a either 1, 2, 3, or 4 off of it, then the cancel advantage will take effect.

The block stun it creates would still be the same, the only difference is that the chained move doesn't connect.

i was talking about interrupting on crouch block seen as delayed 3 has c/a of +9 that would mean kl 12 and 21 wouldnt jail as the 1 and 2 wiff and second hit of 12 (23f) and the second hit of 21 (17) meaning there is a 14 and 9 frame gap

 

[Somberness]

do you know the most advantage lao can get off of a delayed tele 3, like the lowest point? and is it true that it only jails on standing block?

It's actually always +10. I just checked and it isn't 9, but 10. The jailing term doesn't really affect the situation. If it whiffs then something doesn't jail.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

Ok let me put it this way, delay 3 gaurantees an attempt for a blockstring, no matter what, you can ONLY be d1'd out of it simply because his strings are high. Instant 3 has a much bigger gap between the tele 3 and the blockstring, go test it yourselves.

 

[RYX]

My problem with Kenshi is that he just generally negates all footsies, period. I would actually be fine with his get off me move being armored and +8 on block if his zoning moves weren't armored too.I wouldn't go as far as to say he's cheap, maybe not even OP.

Aside from that he's boring to watch and makes me lose my interest in MK after I play him online.

 

[Rip Torn]

It's actually always +10. I just checked and it isn't 9, but 10. The jailing term doesn't really affect the situation. If it whiffs then something doesn't jail.

I think what he was asking was; if they block a delayed 3 while standing, will they be forced to block 2,1? From what you and others have said, the answer seems to be yes and the term "jailed" would be applicable because there is nothing you can do but block the next 2 hits.

 

[MortySeinfeld]

Whoa, this is confusing as hell. Not that I can doubt you, but:

People interrupt with D1 all the time. Pig was doing it to Tom in the video they've posted, and I've been playing Lao for a year now under the premise that it CAN be interrupted and has been interrupted numerous times.

In fact, someone just demonstrated how you can interrupt it with Smoke and linked a video to it in this very thread. I'm pretty sure UsedForGlue has talked about how it can be interrupted for a while now as well.

Hopefully the confusion can be clarified, and thanks for the input.

People interrupt with d1 before the Kung Lao lands or if the Tele xx 3 whiffs (aka: opponent was never put into block stun).

Once Kung Lao has forced you to block the option, you have to respect the next block string.

The teleport itself isn't safe, but there are various teleport mixups Kung Lao can use to open someone up.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

Whoa, this is confusing as hell. Not that I can doubt you, but:

People interrupt with D1 all the time. Pig was doing it to Tom in the video they've posted, and I've been playing Lao for a year now under the premise that it CAN be interrupted and has been interrupted numerous times.

In fact, someone just demonstrated how you can interrupt it with Smoke and linked a video to it in this very thread. I'm pretty sure UsedForGlue has talked about how it can be interrupted for a while now as well.

Hopefully the confusion can be clarified, and thanks for the input.

It jails the person to whatever block they started in when they block the delayed 3.
Big hitboxes cant poke it.

 

[HGTV Soapboxfan]

Kenshi is a dumb character by design, but it takes a smart player to abuse the dumbness, if that makes any sense. Often times kenshi players will hold kenshi back. He also requires a lot of matchup experience to learn to fight imo which is hard to come by.

 

[ZigZagGamer]

He's not cheap, So easy to beat an average/Fairly trained kenshi still with most characters.
I find it's only the Pro's who make him look cheap, Obviously Pig is practically the only guy who can do this, There is nothing cheap about Kenshi, I don't think he's cheap compared to most characters.

Cheap character #1 Johnny Cage. Especially ESPECIALLY online!

 

[IKizzLE]

Kenshi is broken game design. Pig of the Hut is a phenomenal player.
No I will not pick up Kenshi because I don't like the character.

Doesn't mean I can't speak my mind.

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

Kenshi is broken game design. Pig of the Hut is a phenomenal player.
No I will not pick up Kenshi because I don't like the character.

Doesn't mean I can't speak my mind.

you can speak your mind, dnt mean that kenshi is a "free win" like alot of ppl have said and keep on saying.

 

[MagicMan357]

But kenshi is cheap though. Of course you may be able to beat pig which is great, but that didnt change the fact of all his broken frame data

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

I actually think the way to play Kenshi with Lao is the way PL does it, not CD Jr. In other words, be as freaking mobile as you can't and completely overwhelm him. The problem is, at the highest level, a split second or a bad/good read can make all the difference. PL plays at a different speed to everyone, and understands how to use Lao's mobility (especially tele 3) better than anyone, which is why he's so good at match-ups where Lao has to be very mobile (Kenshi, Smoke, etc...) while struggling with match-ups where Lao has to be more patient (Cyrax, Cage). Find footage of PL playing against Kenshi and study them. Not that we're ever going to fully replicate that but at least we'd get pointers.

Tom plays the Mileena match-up better than anyone I've seen, but for all the talk about him playing Kenshi right (and he does most of the time), all he was doing was tele 3/late 3, 1,1,2,1 and cross overs. Not once did he use the 2,1 string, and not once did he get a read on Pig's D1 to blow it up with spin. He was barely even using 2,4. It's unlike Tom to play with such predictable patterns but everyone has off days. Pig was playing insane all weekend though, and funnily enough, more so than ever when he was drunk against Tom.

Oddly enough when drunk I played the MU best

 

[Big Pampering]

Oddly enough when drunk I played the MU best

lol, maybe youre more risky when youre drunk which is good. kenshi has to take risks against lao, trying to be safe only results in a slow death for kenshi.

 

[Under_The_Mayo]

Yaaaaaaaawn.

 

[aldazo]

Pig Of The Hut, a.k.a., Uncle Bernie, you can join in on this.
Alright i dnt know how many times i hear, "oh kenshi is cheap", or "anyone can win with him, just use bf2", and etc. Now me and others hear these things all the times, and I just wonder, if he's so easy, why dnt the haters pick him up? Kenshi requires one main thing: PATIENCE. Ppl act like he just takes bf2 and you'll win for free, that's a lie. Also the only kenshi who has top 8'd at all the majors is Pig, so how in the world is this character so "cheap" and no one else is doing what Pig is doing with him? Well i'll let yall discuss and tell me why he is so cheap or not and why there aren't more kenshis in top 8s.

Cause people have blood in their faces. nobody wants to play a braindead pussy char.

All people who hate kenshi just pick up one of his bad MUs or 5-5 MUs and outplay me

#peace

You have no shame, don't you? bad MU? Really? Shame on you... shame on you.

It's supposed to be, but you think you are Kenshi.

#IamMuffinMuggers

Fixed.

 

[Treadmill]

Fixed.

mmkay...

 

[RYX]

i don't like the argument of "well if kenshi is so cheap why don't you just counterpick him" because you still have to commit to learning that character as well as the MU itself, in which case why not just learn to overcome the MU if you're on the short end of the stick?

Or am I looking at this wrong? :S

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Cause people have blood in their faces. nobody wants to play a braindead pussy char.


You have no shame, don't you? bad MU? Really? Shame on you... shame on you.



Fixed.

i don't like the argument of "well if kenshi is so cheap why don't you just counterpick him" because you still have to commit to learning that character as well as the MU itself, in which case why not just learn to overcome the MU if you're on the short end of the stick?

Or am I looking at this wrong? :S

Both of u have a loser's mentality

Sorry NRS didn't create jade and all other things equally but they included 6-7 options to beating kenshi so it's up to YOU to grow up

Cause right now it's N.M.P. (not my problem)

If 16 bit can almost conquer kenshi in a 8-2 MU then I'm sure u guys could muster a victory as well seeing how u guys play FaRRRRRRRRRR better options vs kenshi

Time to look in the mirror

#peace

 

[RYX]

snip

so asking a question that has nothing to do with my personal views is a loser's mentality?

I'm pretty committed to learning how to beat Kenshi with my characters who lose 4-6 or worse to him. Even if it's online.

k thx

edit: i have a loser's mentality because i know i'm bad, not because of MUs lol

 

[Zoidberg747]

Both of u have a loser's mentality

Sorry NRS didn't create jade and all other things equally but they included 6-7 options to beating kenshi so it's up to YOU to grow up

Cause right now it's N.M.P. (not my problem)

If 16 bit can almost conquer kenshi in a 8-2 MU then I'm sure u guys could muster a victory as well seeing how u guys play FaRRRRRRRRRR better options vs kenshi

Time to look in the mirror

#peace

I think RYX is saying you should just stick it out with your character instead of learning a whole new one, because like you said 16 bit almost beat you in an 8-2 matchup.

Personally I feel like I know enough about Kenshi now to be competitive with Baraka, but if you really struggle sometimes it is necessary to have a counterpick ready.

 

[Illmatix]

Ermac is basically a more unsafe kenshi with no armor, more gimmicks, and more swag combo potential

............................................................................................................ no.