General/Other - Hat Trick Kung Lao Hat Trick Variation General Discussion

[Youphemism]

B321~spin, hat trap, b12~call back, jump back jk, dk, b12,2+4
44, b12, b12~spin, jk dk, 21
44, 12~spin, hat trap, b12~call back, jump back jk, dk, b12,2+4

I like the B3 one but I always go for this combo off of 44 since it's max damage afaik:

44, 44, D4~spin, jk~dk, 21 = 37%


Edit: however.......using your combo route as inspiration you can also do:

44, 4~spin, hat trap, B12~callback, jump back jk~dk, 21 = 37%


If you end my combo with B122+4 instead you get 39% and the one using yours as inspiration gets 38%

 

[DR.Innuendo]

Can we talk about Hat Trick Vs any Mileena. I know this one is etchy to say with everyone hoping on the Mileena Train lately. but hear me out.

I hate her Ball Roll, why do I hate her normal Ball Roll? simple that damn thing goes through every damn move Kung Lao has, Ignores it completely you would be liucky to get 5/10 converts in practice vs her Ball Roll.

I am so sick of it, It goes through his best moves: B321, F3, F14, F21D1, all of them, Call back hat trap misses even Metered version except last split fraction of it, and thats assuming you are half screen away from it. if she is close up, you are never stuffing this thing.
I am a firm believer that moves should not ignore setups and OKI. When i want to pressure my opponet with Traps, I should have the option to. With Mileena its not an option, this tool alone gives her the ability to dictate what you do the entire match. I have to constantly worrie will he/she roll? is he gonna go through my gap? Its not even viable to set trap behin d her because she can just go through all my normals with that Ball Roll.

what i was thinking if everyone agreed it was a problem, I have a suggestion that might make us happy and make Mileenas happy as well. Normalize that hurtbox on her roll and normalize the hitbox on that roll, then make it a low. as long as im able to stuff it when i time it right and have the advantage to do so. Mileenas can have a low ball roll. Seems fair to me. they just wont be able to mash that special whenever they want and get away with it.

What does everyone think of Hat Trick vs Mileena and her Ball Roll mind games? is it dumb? is it fair? am I just not timing write even in a full hour in LAB? if so post a video and show me how you do it consistantly and would love to learn how other deal with it. I'm always down to learn.

 

[DR.Innuendo]

OK I am using Hat Trick possibly the most favorite variaiton of mine on game release. and its great no complaintes here. but if you wanna buff him, Look at what @Eddy Wang says about that. this guy is not only very knowledgeable when it comes to Hat Trick, but he has stuck with HT since Day 1. Talk about Dedication.

back to my 2 worst matchups and my question:

Mileena and her roll, specifically Ethereal & Takeda SR.

The reason I am having so much problems is, Takeda's online do nothing but Jump and Takeda has a shit ton of options in the air and cover quite a bit of ground. That NJP and that Spear. well he can basically jump out of all my setplay and Hoparounf the stage likle a mad man trowing everything near full screen and converting into high damage.

Any Tips with Hat Trick Lao. I want to win with this variation no switching.

then we come to Mileena, It has been my experiance Online that every Mileena is her own, and I Know she got Nerfed but that was to her Mixup games with EX roll being knockdown without 2 bars.

This didn't do anything to her Obnoxious Hitbox on that normal Ballroll. why do i Hate it so much. where to start:
She goes through all my normals and Specials, and by doing this breaks the core that is Hat Trick with one single Special move that is 8 frames on startup, faster than any mid i have which automatically means if i had Psycic powers and could React to a move that is 8 frames which i can not, I have no move that is fast enough to come out. Well I herd someone say before what about your 7 frame punishers, Well those are highs and highs are not touching this move if Mids, Lows (which are designed to stuff wakups) and Overheads don't skim it.

F1
F12
F14
F2
F21
F21D1
F3
F4
B3 (this is Laos best mid bar none) best hitbox
B32
B321
11
11212
112124
B12-2+4
D3
D4
D1
D2


All of these Miss it and Roll goes through nomatter how i time it, i can not get a 10/10 stuff ratio even on pratice.

Now for the specials:

He has:
DF1 (spin)
EN DF1 (Vortex) thes two kinda work but are mad punishable and only struff half the time.

Teleport & Teleport + BLK and the following options:
Hammer Punch (BP/2)
Teleport Kick (FK/3)
Drop Kick (BK/4)
Teleport Throw (FP/1)

all of these wiff or I lose trade.


then there is:

Hat throw
Hat Up: [Hold] Up
Hat Down: [Hold] Down

Hatarang also misses and roll goes right under.


Hat Trap:
and Hat Trap Low these two have no hitbox on way ouy

But they do on call back and EN call back!

the problem is they miss as well.

Dive kick, works 50% of the time.

Muti Kick, 60%

So because of this dilemma i have with just one move of hers: It is taking away all that Hat Trick is for me:

Trapping opponent and using a bar to Frame trap them in corner with Chain Fists, 4, F23, F21, B12 and EN Call back. into more pressure, but Mileena just goes under it. before i can get it setup. and if not does it somewhere else.

And because every Mileena is Different online ranging from Good player to total Noob. every single one of them Roll on different things, and different times at different ranges. causeing me to question when should i block, Can i even Followup every in this matchup? will she roll, will she blow up gap in Chain fist since she has small hurtbox, and will she punish my only low starter?


Does anyone haver any Hat Trick tips for these two Matchups?

 

[The PantyChrist]

D1 a 7f mid

 

[Saltea Moonspell]

I started to play hattrick in January when I started to play the game. One of my buddies, a Tekken player mains Piercing, been playing Millena since MK9. I've always been losing this MU. As you mentioned a lot of Hattrick s stuff won't work. I gave up. To win is to outplay Millena s operator forsee his play and by punishers You can take this challenge. That's what I think. Your tool won't work , they are nullified by the almighty roll.

 

[PhenomenalX2]

Hey guy's, been reading your post's.
After every confirmed combo, you must end it with a 2,1 for the hard knockdown, this gives you enough time to get a mete hat set up and start the 112124, this string stop's mileena's raw roll and armor breaks the ex roll into full combo

112124 hcb, 1, b321 spin, njp, jik dk, 21

Hat trick also has a 1 frame link in corner - 112124 hat call back, 3 hat throw front, b12 hat call back, 4 spin, jump in kick, dive kick, 21
The 1 frame link is the b12 part, can also use d1 since they are both 7 frame start up, using 1 whiffs due to it being 8 frames

Happy hat tricking guys
PhenomenalX2 (Competitive Hat trick lover!!)

 

[Saltea Moonspell]

The armor breaking setup is very risky

Hey guy's, been reading your post's.
After every confirmed combo, you must end it with a 2,1 for the hard knockdown, this gives you enough time to get a mete hat set up and start the 112124, this string stop's mileena's raw roll and armor breaks the ex roll into full combo

112124 hcb, 1, b321 spin, njp, jik dk, 21

Hat trick also has a 1 frame link in corner - 112124 hat call back, 3 hat throw front, b12 hat call back, 4 spin, jump in kick, dive kick, 21
The 1 frame link is the b12 part, can also use d1 since they are both 7 frame start up, using 1 whiffs due to it being 8 frames

Happy hat tricking guys
PhenomenalX2 (Competitive Hat trick lover!!)

Hey!

Stuffing Millena Roll is a quite risk shit ma man if you ask me.

The one frame link, I think I never saw it. Is it worth it ?

Other then that, welcome on board! You on EU or US server ? What platform ?

 

[Eddy Wang]

The armor breaking setup is very risky



Hey!

Stuffing Millena Roll is a quite risk shit ma man if you ask me.

The one frame link, I think I never saw it. Is it worth it ?

Other then that, welcome on board! You on EU or US server ? What platform ?

Its just juggle s3 from call back due the height, i preffer doing 44 instead.
We all know the only Link Hat Trick has is ex tp from almost all his strings, but that cost meter.

 

[Saltea Moonspell]

I see. Since we're talking about 44 I like to go for 44 ex call back d2 follow up, thats wicked sick! This works well on stages where you can hide your hat in the corner - like Destroyed City. Its swaggy as fuck and brings hella damage.

 

[SpecOps2013]

Hi Hat Trick players! Recently I matched up against Scar again and had trouble fighting his Hattrick. Footage can be found here:

I will be greatly appreciative towards anyone who helps me. @EddyWang since u r so knowledgeable on Hat Trick can u help me out here and tell me where his gaps, minus frames etc are? Thank you to whoever helps me

 

[Invincible Salads]

i know hattrick is mostly gimmicks....tbh tho, i don't know what those gimmicks are, care to help me out? xD

 

[Eddy Wang]

Hi Hat Trick players! Recently I matched up against Scar again and had trouble fighting his Hattrick. Footage can be found here:

I will be greatly appreciative towards anyone who helps me. @EddyWang since u r so knowledgeable on Hat Trick can u help me out here and tell me where his gaps, minus frames etc are? Thank you to whoever helps me

When HT uses 112124~hat trap he is at -6 on block, your best option out of that is to poke out of followups with d1, which he can block to gain advantage again or backdash to reset the neutral, so use a 11f string all the time as soon as you can and nulify every his other options, including jump into dive kick and backdash.

When he starts to respect your 11f string then you should start to grab him.

Also, whenever HT call backs he is a -7, he has a terrible backdash and can't jump out of -7 frame traps as well, if your character has a 6f D1 like scorpion does, poke out of every meterless call back which will be a punish and then throw him. if you don't have a 6f d1, use a mid hitting string with 11f startup at the very least, so you an avoid d4, d1 low profiling and jump into dive kicks to counter attack.

All jump call backs are at least -14 on block at the very least if meterless, if KL call back from very high spots he will be very negative on the ground if you block the hat.

Those are the main things, you seemed to try to press buttons mostly on 11212 strings, don't do that, wait for the traps to poke out or armor.

You lost mostly because you didn't punish him on call backs on block and those were plenty, you also didn't punish him for running with 11212 string, if you can anticipate those Hat Trick will get very limited options to approach against you.

 

[SpecOps2013]

When HT uses 112124~hat trap he is at -6 on block, your best option out of that is to poke out of followups with d1, which he can block to gain advantage again or backdash to reset the neutral, so use a 11f string all the time as soon as you can and nulify every his other options, including jump into dive kick and backdash.

When he starts to respect your 11f string then you should start to grab him.

Also, whenever HT call backs he is a -7, he has a terrible backdash and can't jump out of -7 frame traps as well, if your character has a 6f D1 like scorpion does, poke out of every meterless call back which will be a punish and then throw him. if you don't have a 6f d1, use a mid hitting string with 11f startup at the very least, so you an avoid d4, d1 low profiling and jump into dive kicks to counter attack.

All jump call backs are at least -14 on block at the very least if meterless, if KL call back from very high spots he will be very negative on the ground if you block the hat.

Those are the main things, you seemed to try to press buttons mostly on 11212 strings, don't do that, wait for the traps to poke out or armor.

You lost mostly because you didn't punish him on call backs on block and those were plenty, you also didn't punish him for running with 11212 string, if you can anticipate those Hat Trick will get very limited options to approach against you.

Thanks for the very informative reply

 

[Eddy Wang]

i know hattrick is mostly gimmicks....tbh tho, i don't know what those gimmicks are, care to help me out? xD

He has a few moves that are legit tech it doesn't matter if you know what the odds are, the outcomes are so many that its makes you doubt your own reads for a few frames, which he takes as advantage for mixups and frame traps.

S4~hat trap is probably his best mixup right now. due the dive kick threat since is probably -5 on block its scary as hell.

If this character had just frame traps at -1 on block he would have a 9f mid with round trip, which would frame trap 11f mids and throws would be a lot more relaxing and fun to use.

 

[Invincible Salads]

He has a few moves that are legit tech it doesn't matter if you know what the odds are, the outcomes are so many that its makes you doubt your own reads for a few frames, which he takes as advantage for mixups and frame traps.

S4~hat trap is probably his best mixup right now. due the dive kick threat since is probably -5 on block its scary as hell.

If this character had just frame traps at -1 on block he would have a 9f mid with round trip, which would frame trap 11f mids and throws would be a lot more relaxing and fun to use.

i see, i still don't feel as if i understand this variation, ill need to reread what you said in that earlier post.

 

[Saltea Moonspell]

i see, i still don't feel as if i understand this variation, ill need to reread what you said in that earlier post.

I suggest taking HT to lab and go through. It's really simple, there isn't much really man. Good luck anyway.

 

[Saltea Moonspell]

@Invincible Salads

On another thought, if you want I can walk you through. I Am not as good as Eddy but I can give you a decent mu experience. I own both, US and EU version of the game. I dont play a lot cause I lack the time but I can figure out an hour here n there to prepare you. So in case you into it, you know what to do!

 

[AcMilan91]

Hello guys, i dont have expirience with hattrick, when i am in corner and he pressures me, and put hat and then get his hat back he is -7 i try to poke and i get hit by mb airdivekick? Is this possible or i am doing sometjing wrong, i can even do s4(8f) with jaqcuie?

 

[Youphemism]

Hello guys, i dont have expirience with hattrick, when i am in corner and he pressures me, and put hat and then get his hat back he is -7 i try to poke and i get hit by mb airdivekick? Is this possible or i am doing sometjing wrong, i can even do s4(8f) with jaqcuie?

Then you're timing it too late, callback has pretty much no blockstun at all.

 

[AcMilan91]

Then you're timing it too late, callback has pretty much no blockstun at all.

Is airdivekick mb always punishable or in corner its on plus?

 

[Eddy Wang]

Is airdivekick mb always punishable or in corner its on plus?

If blocked is punishable, the only way to make dive kick plus on block is by making it whiff, but requires precise timing and is higly unlikely that it will work.

 

[Youphemism]

Is airdivekick mb always punishable or in corner its on plus?

Divekick is always punishable, the only way it's ever safe is if the first couple of hits of MB divekick connect on block but the last hit whiffs. It's pretty difficult to space it for that to happen though.

 

[AcMilan91]

Divekick is always punishable, the only way it's ever safe is if the first couple of hits of MB divekick connect on block but the last hit whiffs. It's pretty difficult to space it for that to happen though.

I was playing with my friend and somehow when i am in corner and he is crouching and insta mb airkick and makes it plus, i cant punish it, he just goes 112 string somehow

 

[Eddy Wang]

I was playing with my friend and somehow when i am in corner and he is crouching and insta mb airkick and makes it plus, i cant punish it, he just goes 112 string somehow

If your friend is making the last hit of ex dive kick whiff after make you block a dive kick he is definitely plus on block and he is a god damn Jedi master.

 

[Youphemism]

I was playing with my friend and somehow when i am in corner and he is crouching and insta mb airkick and makes it plus, i cant punish it, he just goes 112 string somehow

Well A. Do you have footage of it we can look at? Maybe from the in-game recorded match footage?
B. Was this online?