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Rozalin1780

Rozalin1780

Good? Bad? I'm the one with the fans
james1926 said:
So, are we aware that b14 db2 connects only if Kitana is on the left side of the screen?

Click to expand...
Well that’s shitty... does it still whiff if you switch stance while on the right side? Not at home to test myself. Figure it probably will still whiff if both sides whiff on Cetrion, but worth a shot, right?...

Damn it, NRS. Getting really sick of your inconsistent hitboxes! :mad:
 
james1926

james1926

Noob
Rozalin1780 said:
Well that’s shitty... does it still whiff if you switch stance while on the right side? Not at home to test myself. Figure it probably will still whiff if both sides whiff on Cetrion, but worth a shot, right?...

Damn it, NRS. Getting really sick of your inconsistent hitboxes! :mad:
Click to expand...
Yes I tried switching stance and got the same results.
 
KriegerOfLucent

KriegerOfLucent

Embrace Walkback™
Since the last patch, the game has just become a nightmare. I thought she was bad before, but at least she was fun to play. Now there is nothing she stands out though.
They removed the staple fan juggles (the ones in the corner don't count really since you have to commit to a DB2) and this has made her frustrating to play. And no, I don't think DB2 being safe was too much.

Before the patch, even with the horrifyingly unsafe strings, I was able to write off the junk ones (like 21, 21343, 21222 and B321343) and I could work something out.

Before, the projectile trade with Sub Zero was in her advantage. Now there is no way to bypass them and that matchup has become close to unwinnable. I am aware there is the absorb, but that is just too weak, since by the time you get to throw something out, it is already expired.

I would have expected to have combos with Ex fan conversions now, but not even that is possible. We have absolutely no reason to spend meter, not to mention the second ex fan is now a HIGH! What the actual? Why ?

I really think the fan is the worst projectile in the game now. 15f startup? Why 60 damage then ? Why -2 on hit? Why are both versions unsafe on block?

By playing I have realized that we don't really need the strings which were made safe. The really useful ones are still unsafe. I
Now I really don't understand anymore what differentiates her from the rest of the cast that does everything else better. Whose bad matchup is Kitana now ?

I was thinking of giving the sai variation a try (even though I don't like it), but now, the sai cancel costs a bar of meter, while the ilks like Erron Black have both their stances free to cancel.

Erron Black is also a bad matchup, since her projectile is useless and she gets even severely outzoned by him.
I really hope I am plain wrong and stupid and just a bad player and I would be more than happy to have you guys prove me wrong.

I have been waiting for this game just to play Kitana, but I have never expected she would end up in such a state. Shame, I love seeing her on screen.
 
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anheirtothethrone11

anheirtothethrone11

Noob
KriegerOfLucent said:
Since the last patch, the game has just become a nightmare. I thought she was bad before, but at least she was fun to play. Now there is nothing she stands out though.
They removed the staple fan juggles (the ones in the corner don't count really since you have to commit to a DB2) and this has made her frustrating to play. And no, I don't think DB2 being safe was too much.

Before the patch, even with the horrifyingly unsafe strings, I was able to write off the junk ones (like 21, 21343, 21222 and B321343) and I could work something out.

Before, the projectile trade with Sub Zero was in her advantage. Now there is no way to bypass them and that matchup has become close to unwinnable. I am aware there is the absorb, but that is just too weak, since by the time you get to throw something out, it is already expired.

I would have expected to have combos with Ex fan conversions now, but not even that is possible. We have absolutely no reason to spend meter, not to mention the second ex fan is now a HIGH! What the actual? Why ?

I really think the fan is the worst projectile in the game now. 15f startup? Why 60 damage then ? Why -2 on hit? Why are both versions unsafe on block?

By playing I have realized that we don't really need the strings which were made safe. The really useful ones are still unsafe. I
Now I really don't understand anymore what differentiates her from the rest of the cast that does everything else better. Whose bad matchup is Kitana now ?

I was thinking of giving the sai variation a try (even though I don't like it), but now, the sai cancel costs a bar of meter, while the ilks like Erron Black have both their stances free to cancel.

Erron Black is also a bad matchup, since her projectile is useless and she gets even severely outzoned by him.
I really hope I am plain wrong and stupid and just a bad player and I would be more than happy to have you guys prove me wrong.

I have been waiting for this game just to play Kitana, but I have never expected she would end up in such a state. Shame, I love seeing her on screen.
Click to expand...
I feel you man, she's utterly boring to watch, to play as ... besides the fact she's still lacking a lot of tools ... me too, I've been waited for this game to come out with anticipation, mostly because of Kitana ... but ... now it's just ... meeeeh ... really hope NRS will realize and answer to this frustration of ours , hopefully with the next patch .
 
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armani

armani

Noob
I can't even lie, I'm liking Limited Kitana but ONLY with the edenian twist, up fan, and ground war abilities. that's probably the only thing that's keeping me from not going completely insane. as it stands, she is fun in matches though. I do feel like she has strong tools as a character, and doesn't really lack in the damage department but I just wish that there was more things to do with her. MK11's archetype is a simple, footsie based system and I see the same simplifications in other characters but she just feels superrrrr barebones right now.

if you took Kitana's fans away she'd just be a divekick character. lmao
 
xKhaoTik

xKhaoTik

The Ignore Button Is Free
Kitana Fan said:
In the Her Highness variation, you do. That's the one I mainly use. Though, to be fair, I haven't gotten into her custom variations yet.
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That’s not a competitive variation so idc about it.

Her fan fare variation has her ground ass.
 
Reactions: 7L
Rozalin1780

Rozalin1780

Good? Bad? I'm the one with the fans
Am I the only one who feels that ground ass is a wasted slot considering instant-air ass is still possible without it? All you’re really gaining from it is an ender for b34.
 
KriegerOfLucent

KriegerOfLucent

Embrace Walkback™
Yes, I agree. This would not have been the case if b34 sould have linked in anything else, like df2 for instance. Not to mention that b34 does not link with db2 in the corner.
 
EMPRESS_SunFire

EMPRESS_SunFire

Regina George of discord
KriegerOfLucent said:
Since the last patch, the game has just become a nightmare. I thought she was bad before, but at least she was fun to play. Now there is nothing she stands out though.
They removed the staple fan juggles (the ones in the corner don't count really since you have to commit to a DB2) and this has made her frustrating to play. And no, I don't think DB2 being safe was too much.

Before the patch, even with the horrifyingly unsafe strings, I was able to write off the junk ones (like 21, 21343, 21222 and B321343) and I could work something out.

Before, the projectile trade with Sub Zero was in her advantage. Now there is no way to bypass them and that matchup has become close to unwinnable. I am aware there is the absorb, but that is just too weak, since by the time you get to throw something out, it is already expired.

I would have expected to have combos with Ex fan conversions now, but not even that is possible. We have absolutely no reason to spend meter, not to mention the second ex fan is now a HIGH! What the actual? Why ?

I really think the fan is the worst projectile in the game now. 15f startup? Why 60 damage then ? Why -2 on hit? Why are both versions unsafe on block?

By playing I have realized that we don't really need the strings which were made safe. The really useful ones are still unsafe. I
Now I really don't understand anymore what differentiates her from the rest of the cast that does everything else better. Whose bad matchup is Kitana now ?

I was thinking of giving the sai variation a try (even though I don't like it), but now, the sai cancel costs a bar of meter, while the ilks like Erron Black have both their stances free to cancel.

Erron Black is also a bad matchup, since her projectile is useless and she gets even severely outzoned by him.
I really hope I am plain wrong and stupid and just a bad player and I would be more than happy to have you guys prove me wrong.

I have been waiting for this game just to play Kitana, but I have never expected she would end up in such a state. Shame, I love seeing her on screen.
Click to expand...
I honestly gave up trying to play her as a zoner against almost any character lol, she can zone a very few characters well OR when she has a lifelead she can play lame runaway, but otherwise her fans are good in the midrange just as a check, she is more of a neutral heavy character.
Also... I disagree, the strings that were made safe are a BLESSING, B231U2 is her main string and it’s amazing for mind games... this is probably her best string to get some damage off her opponent with all the good staggers it has + the krushing blow on the end, not to mention it’s hit confirmable and has amazing range, I think this string itself having those changes Is what made her a treat, considering B142 and b131 were already safe.
 
Histrionik

Histrionik

Wake-Up Rolls, bitch.
Alright, fellow Edenians, let’s get a real dialogue going here for what we’re working with. Here’s a synopsis of my hand written notes.

Unfortunately, I feel like Fan-zoning accomplishes damned near nothing at this point. We really need that second hit of EN Fan to be a mid for that to work.

We’ve lost control of air space with Fans catching an airborne opponent. What’s even good for anti-air?

So, what do we have? Some safe on block strings that cover a good chunk of space and a decent quick punish as well as an easy KB off off DF2. We also have some good corner carry using F22222. To be honest, I haven’t messed around in the corner enough to know what to do with that. Haha. D2 KB combos into B14, so we can get a good chunk of damage there.

B231 is great for poke.
12 is the fastest punish.
B14 was my go-to punish but it seems like it’s not reliable.

—

What am I missing? She seems basic AF. But so does most of the cast.

Still, when comparing her tools to, say Geras, The Kollector, or Raiden, it feels like we’re missing part of a kit.

Thoughts? Questions? Snide remarks?
 
Rozalin1780

Rozalin1780

Good? Bad? I'm the one with the fans
The only thing that really stands out with her to me when compared to other characters is her staggers and the sheer number of them. People are really unsure of when to let go of the block button if you keep changing things up. This is complimented with good pokes as well. Her damage is good, but some characters are just as good or better. Sonya comes to mind.

I think she just needs another variation, honestly. But then, every character does, truth be told...
 
armani

armani

Noob
I’d be happy if they gave her an up fan, edenian twist, and ground war variation. it’s the closest to classic kitana (midscreen fan toss conversions & combos) I don’t think it’s too insane of a request.

the only thing I’d say is that if they made that a tournament variant, edenian twist should be made mid OH vs. double OH - I think her stagger pressure would be too much. she already has a mixup with the b231d2 string, but you can pull off b231bf3 and edenian twist will come out right after the low. just my two cents lol.

the more I play her I do like her a lot but coming from a tekken & soul calibur player... I just wish there was more to do

edit: given how MK11 plays as a whole though, something tells me that the original intent was to have 3 tournament variations per character. but time constraints said otherwise. there isn’t a character that I look at where I feel like they’re “complete” lol.
 
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Rozalin1780

Rozalin1780

Good? Bad? I'm the one with the fans
armani said:
the only thing I’d say is that if they made that a tournament variant, edenian twist shouldn’t be made mid OH vs. double OH - I think her stagger pressure would be too much. she already has a mixup with the b231d2 string, but you can pull off b231bf3 and edenian twist will come out right after the low. just my two cents lol.
Click to expand...
Not true because Edenian Twist requires you to be in the air just like base Square Wave does. If it didn’t, then yeah, it would be a bit much.

What Edenian Twist would provide though is a reliable long range overhead in the neutral since you can instant-air it like Fan Toss or Square Wave. With the real time frame data turned on in practice mode, the lowest startup I could get is 12 frames. Mind you, that doesn’t account for the first few frames of the jump because when I recorded this, I was still able to stuff it with a 15 frame poke. I could not with a 17 frame poke, however.

So, if you got the input down on the first available frame, you would have an unsafe midscreen overhead that starts up in 16-ish frames. For comparision, Jade’s f2 overhead starts up in 28 frames, has roughly same amount of range (Edenian Twist is slightly longer) and has the same block disadvantage -18. Obviously Jade’s is more safe due to not being in the opponent face.
 
KriegerOfLucent

KriegerOfLucent

Embrace Walkback™
qcevolution said:
It REALLY feels like the buff from royal protection doesn’t last long enough. I can barely get anything off before it ends. It makes the reward not feel worth the effort.
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Definitely. That is my feeling exactly. Not to mention you canot absord double projectiles, from Baraka or Cage for instance. Basically it is a guess whether the opponent meterburns the projectile or not.
Not to mention that it does not work on sub zero's wall of ice projectile thingy which is seen as physicial for some reason.

By the time you absord a projectile and you have ducked the followup from your opponent, the buff is already gone.
I thought this would be a great counterzoning move given the fact that she has bad zoning herself and gets zoned out by literally everyone else with a projectile, but nope. I would rather have something else there instead of royal protection.
 
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