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Kitana General Discussion

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
Ehh fuck it. These are the changes I’d like for kitana:

General:
- better dash speeds. Not asking for Cetrion, Rain, Fujin, or Mileena dashes, but honestly her dash speed is infuriating. Just something so she actually moves when she dashes.

Move specific changes:
- low fan: flawless block gap removed (noob already has his without a gap with his low slide; why can’t kitana?)

- retreating/advancing flutter: inputs changed to regular db and df + attack button. Literally no reason you should have to do an aerial command grab to air dash when Kabal doesn’t have to.

- royal protection: allow this to be held and absorb multiple projectiles; obviously would have extensive end lag. Even make it so you can hold it if it’s enhanced if that’s what you so prefer. Alternatively, allow her to spend a defensive and offensive meter to activate a buff without absorbing a projectile.

- Up fan: bring back pre-patch recovery etc, with increase combo scaling.

- edenian razors: ex razors made +5 on block

- Edenian fade: made 1 customs slot


I’m ready to be blown up and told how broken this would make Kitana.
The biggest change edenian fade needs is doing more damage on hit than block. 7% on block, and 5% on hit currently
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
Also I personally want her back throw to have more hit advantage.

Currently you can just barely can meaty with b2 but some characters like jadenor Rain can just walk back out of it.

It'd also look so cool because her back throw is stylish.
 

xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
I don’t see the point in Edenian Fade when Half-Blood Stance accomplishes the same thing, more or less.

It’s there because NRS had to give Kitana another custom move. Welcome to the variation system.
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
I don’t see the point in Edenian Fade when Half-Blood Stance accomplishes the same thing, more or less.

It’s there because NRS had to give Kitana another custom move. Welcome to the variation system.
Use it after a low fan toss ender, fall down a bit so you're safe at -11 and they eat 7% chip damage after each combo. You can also use the close dive to punish an invincible wakeup

Its nice but not worth the 2 slots since its dependent on low fan toss.
 

xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
Use it after a low fan toss ender, fall down a bit so you're safe at -11 and they eat 7% chip damage after each combo. You can also use the close dive to punish an invincible wakeup

Its nice but not worth the 2 slots since its dependent on low fan toss.
I can see that, but you’re giving up so much utility. Even if it was one slot I can’t justify giving up Half-Blood.
 
"Kitana players have lied to us all for the longest, shes potato" -Foxy-

Thoughts?
I just want to be objective here really. I don't play the same variation he does(mostly because I don't enjoy it), nor do I play Kitana as extensively as I did before..

Edit:I want to stress this. I am NOT bashing Foxy or attempting to take him out of context. Its just he is a pro player and most of us are not, so I want to hear what everyone thinks since I don't play her that much rn.
 
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Vhozite

Jade Worshipper
Is potato in this context supposed to mean really good?

I’m fine with that being the case but I really hate when big names drop these big takes on Twitter with no context. I don’t care if she’s broken good or unplayable just explain why.
 
Is potato in this context supposed to mean really good?

I’m fine with that being the case but I really hate when big names drop these big takes on Twitter with no context. I don’t care if she’s broken good or unplayable just explain why.
I asked him a few questions on stream he said her zoning is strong, which I slightly agree with. In my experience regular fan toss goes toe to toe with Cetrion from full screen if you ignore her teleport.
 

Pan1cMode

AUS FGC represent!
Premium Supporter
I asked him a few questions on stream he said her zoning is strong, which I slightly agree with. In my experience regular fan toss goes toe to toe with Cetrion from full screen if you ignore her teleport.
Uhhh ummm.

“If you ignore her teleport”

Upgraded Jacqui is fine if you ignore her leap.

I know that’s not what you meant, but I’m just pointing out it’s a pretty big thing to ignore. Kitana’s zoning is strong, but in a meta game that heavily de-prioritises full screen spacing, that doesn’t mean much.

Robocop has really good zoning, but that doesn’t necessarily make him a top tier.
 
Uhhh ummm.

“If you ignore her teleport”

Upgraded Jacqui is fine if you ignore her leap.

I know that’s not what you meant, but I’m just pointing out it’s a pretty big thing to ignore. Kitana’s zoning is strong, but in a meta game that heavily de-prioritises full screen spacing, that doesn’t mean much.

Robocop has really good zoning, but that doesn’t necessarily make him a top tier.
Hmmm, well you can't really take me out of context lol. That's EXACTLY why I worded it that way. Fans are still really good. Extremely plus compared to a lot of other characters I have played which makes her win in straight fan trades due to hitbox and start up. Judging by Foxy's statement, I don't think potato means top tier either.
 

cannoli_kahn

Avid Devs Hater
Those changes look pretty fair to me, though I’d also like to see her get oki off at least one of her throws. No KB and no oki makes them feel pretty trash.

Also what is Edenian Fade good for? I’m in the lab right now and it seems totally ass. I wouldn’t even use it if it was a free base kit move. What am I missing about it?
Nothing. It's a useless move just like Dancing Fans. Remove both from the game and it'll make no difference.
 

cannoli_kahn

Avid Devs Hater
Ehh fuck it. These are the changes I’d like for kitana:

General:
- better dash speeds. Not asking for Cetrion, Rain, Fujin, or Mileena dashes, but honestly her dash speed is infuriating. Just something so she actually moves when she dashes.

Move specific changes:
- low fan: flawless block gap removed (noob already has his without a gap with his low slide; why can’t kitana?)

- retreating/advancing flutter: inputs changed to regular db and df + attack button. Literally no reason you should have to do an aerial command grab to air dash when Kabal doesn’t have to.

- royal protection: allow this to be held and absorb multiple projectiles; obviously would have extensive end lag. Even make it so you can hold it if it’s enhanced if that’s what you so prefer. Alternatively, allow her to spend a defensive and offensive meter to activate a buff without absorbing a projectile.

- Up fan: bring back pre-patch recovery etc, with increase combo scaling.

- edenian razors: ex razors made +5 on block

- Edenian fade: made 1 customs slot


I’m ready to be blown up and told how broken this would make Kitana.
Not broken at ALL. I kinda mastered advanced fan flutter's input so lowwwwkey I don't what them changed cuz it took me too much time labbing already lol. I'd also suggest making it one slot instead OR making groundwar basekit.
 

gitblame

Noob
I think foxy is right about Kitana if that potato phrase he used is more about how simple Kitana is. Well she is. She is one of the simplest characters in the game who can use that simplicity and be effective. Also I am not suprised f0xy thinks she is good, because this character suits him a lot. She has really good projectiles. She is safe. Excells in defence. And has one of better throw ranges in the game. No, I don't believe even f0xy has her in like top 10, but she kinda is around top 15-top 20 spot which makes her solid mid tier. She is potato.
 
I think foxy is right about Kitana if that potato phrase he used is more about how simple Kitana is. Well she is. She is one of the simplest characters in the game who can use that simplicity and be effective. Also I am not suprised f0xy thinks she is good, because this character suits him a lot. She has really good projectiles. She is safe. Excells in defence. And has one of better throw ranges in the game. No, I don't believe even f0xy has her in like top 10, but she kinda is around top 15-top 20 spot which makes her solid mid tier. She is potato.
If they straight up fixed Kitanas b2 string I would never ever complain about her ever again.
 

armani

Noob
The overhead f234 & b231d2 isn't only flawless-blockable but also can be eeeeeeaaasily shimmied. Having low fan does not make either of those strings 50/50 at all against more scrubby players. Low-fan is good to counter pokes, which is especially useful even if it's only safe after amp. And I don't see how 21222 is good for pressure or corner combos, especially if you meant using the full string. The string ends at like -7 and it doesn't return distance the opponent. In the corner, other strings or even just 4 produce more damage out put. So what exactly do you do to make 21222 a pressure/corner combo tool?
using f243 and b231d2 with low fan and hbs cancels requires a great deal of conditioning. I never said they were guaranteed, bonafide options and I’m well aware of the risk.

21222 (which will now be called beyblade) works in the midscreen as a stagger, cause a lot of people don’t expect to see the string. the animation has a brief pause after 21, and beyblade sends Kitana forward enough to clip the opponent if your just outside of advancing mid range for most of the cast.

after d3 & d1 on hit, b1 & 2 jails so there are some set plays you can start up if you want to play mind games

if 21 hits you can start a combo or finish the beyblade, +35 on KND. if the string is blocked you can stop and be +1, continue pressure. if you see that the 2 string is being respected you can stagger and throw, or block and wait for a counter poke into mid, catching the opponent from their negative poke frames. 21 is -7 on block: safe against some of the cast, and 21222 is -6 on block: safe against all of the cast. what will end up happening eventually is a throw attempt which you can quick hop 2 or nj2 into combo easily, or they will just hold crouchblock until they feel like they can poke again.

2 also creates enough space on block to quick hop 2 if the opponent is throwing out low pokes. 21222 also works as an anti air if you predict a jump-in after both throws. and the string is also good for chip damage & when stacked with b231d2 KB


using beyblade is really just a pressure strategy and is me just making the best out of what we have the string must exist for a reason lol

combo time! using beyblade in combos are for two things: more frame advantage on wake up and a way to prevent side switching from the neckslice kb.

midscreen combo (lol):

b231 gutted KB! 21222 - 29%

corner combos:

jik b14 lift jik jik airfan MB 21222 - 30%
d2 KB! b14 lift jik jik airfan MB 21222 - 42%
b231 gutted KB! jik b14 lift jik jik airfan MB 21222 - 43%
d2 KB! b321 lift jik jik fan MB 21222 - 43%

if anyone has anything to add please do!
 
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M2Dave

Zoning Master
Royal Contributor
foxy, koisy, tweedy, are all picking up Kitana because she's "broke."

I give it a week.
Where is the evidence that she is "potato" and "broke"? Because Foxy is beating players inferior to him in the European Kombat League? LOL. By this logic, is Robocop "potato" and "broke" too?

The irony is that when she was arguably top tier pre-patch, every high level player with the exception of Tekken Master ignored the character.

Nonetheless, it will be interesting to observe how this Kitana up play develops, although you and I already know how.
 

cannoli_kahn

Avid Devs Hater
Use it after a low fan toss ender, fall down a bit so you're safe at -11 and they eat 7% chip damage after each combo. You can also use the close dive to punish an invincible wakeup

Its nice but not worth the 2 slots since its dependent on low fan toss.
That does not sound viable or nice at all?? I'm trying to figure out if you meant using it ending with just low fan or amp low fan.... and both option still does nothing to give Kitana an advantage. Many characters can instantly punish, if not just rolling forward or u2 get up attack. Am I missing something or you're reaching a bit with that set up?
 

cannoli_kahn

Avid Devs Hater
using f243 and b231d2 with low fan and hbs cancels requires a great deal of conditioning. I never said they were guaranteed, bonafide options and I’m well aware of the risk.

21222 (which will now be called beyblade) works in the midscreen as a stagger, cause a lot of people don’t expect to see the string. the animation has a brief pause after 21, and beyblade sends Kitana forward enough to clip the opponent if your just outside of advancing mid range for most of the cast.

after d3 & d1 on hit, b1 & 2 jails so there are some set plays you can start up if you want to play mind games

if 21 hits you can start a combo or finish the beyblade, +35 on KND. if the string is blocked you can stop and be +1, continue pressure. if you see that the 2 string is being respected you can stagger and throw, or block and wait for a counter poke into mid, catching the opponent from their negative poke frames. 21 is -7 on block: safe against some of the cast, and 21222 is -6 on block: safe against all of the cast. what will end up happening eventually is a throw attempt which you can quick hop 2 or nj2 into combo easily, or they will just hold crouchblock until they feel like they can poke again.

2 also creates enough space on block to quick hop 2 if the opponent is throwing out low pokes. 21222 also works as an anti air if you predict a jump-in after both throws. and the string is also good for chip damage & when stacked with b231d2 KB


using beyblade is really just a pressure strategy and is me just making the best out of what we have the string must exist for a reason lol

combo time! using beyblade in combos are for two things: more frame advantage on wake up and a way to prevent side switching from the neckslice kb.

midscreen combo (lol):

b231 gutted KB! 21222 - 29%

corner combos:

jik b14 lift jik jik airfan MB 21222 - 30%
d2 KB! b14 lift jik jik airfan MB 21222 - 42%
b231 gutted KB! jik b14 lift jik jik airfan MB 21222 - 43%
d2 KB! b321 lift jik jik fan MB 21222 - 43%

if anyone has anything to add please do!
While I def occasionally use the beyblade (glad I'm not the only one who saw this lol) to catch people offguard since it's rarely used, I wouldn't call it a pressure tool.

On your corner combos, while they are flashy, don't isn't the most optimal. The highest damage out put is even simpler and doesn't require as much work w your thumbs.

For example, Instead of
jik b14 lift jik jik airfan MB 21222 - 30%
you can do
jik b14 lift jik then ground 4 to fan toss, then d3 poke to fan toss again. It also costs you no MB.

Same goes for your other corner combos, instead of double jump kick and MBurning you could just do ground kick 4 to increase the damage scaling.

The best use of that is just using 2 as pushback stagger which I also do, but yeah... beyblade is still useless.