Match-up Discussion Killer Frost In-Depth Analysis for Match-Ups

[RiBBz22]

sweet jeebus good shit Konqrr

 

[Konqrr]

sweet jeebus good shit Konqrr

I hate that douche known as Sodium Grundy and want to help my fellow KF players know how to beat his ass back to the grave.

 

[xKhaoTik]

RiBBz22 GGA 16 Bit Jer Claude VonStroke xKhaoTikx
Specific punishes and information vs Grundy's trait used in his blockstrings:

You can jump out of his trait and get a full combo if he cancels any string into his Trait grab. Be aware that he can also cancel into his Cleaver Spin to hit you out of any jump attempt. If you read that he will do a Cleaver, you can punish with 111~Black Ice.

This is where Frost does much better than most characters against Grundy. She can parry both options, Trait and Cleaver, with the same timing.

If you do decide to jump out and get a full combo, here is what to look for and what the best combos are:

- Block 1~4 [NJ]
-- (You can Jump out in any direction or backdash)

- Block d2~4 [NJ] (you can punish d2 with 22~Black Ice, but not if he cancels to Trait)
-- (You can Jump out in any direction or backdash)
-- (You can d1~Black Ice)

- Block d1~4 [NJ] (watch out for d13)
-- (If low blocking, you can only d1~Black Ice)
-- (If high blocking, you can d1 or 111~Black Ice)

- Block f13~4 [NJ]
-- (You can Jump out in any direction or backdash)
-- (You can d1~Black Ice)

- Block 112~4 [NJ high block] [UF low block]
-- (For this particular string, you cannot Neutral Jump (NJ) if you block the 112 string low, you can only jump forward or back. What you can do if you block the first hit low is to stand block the last two then you can NJ.)

Neutral Jump punishes:
1a) NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, Sweep (38%) then combo "1c"...
1b) NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, u3, 1~Iceberg MB, Sweep (46%) then combo "1c"...
1c) Flash Freeze MB, NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, u3, 11~Iceberg (45%)
-- (Combo "1c" cannot be avoided after the sweep in either of the previous combos if timed properly unless they do a wakeup attack.)

2) NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, u3, 11~Iceberg (46%)

3a) NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, 22~Flash Freeze MB, NJ2~f113~Frozen Daggers (47%)
3b) NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, f113~Flash Freeze MB, NJ2~f113~Frozen Daggers (50%)
3c) NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, 22~Flash Freeze MB, NJ2~f113~Frozen Daggers (51%)

Forward Jump (UF) punishes:
4a) J1~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, Sweep (36%) then combo "4c"...
4b) J1~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, u3, 1~Iceberg MB, Sweep (44%) then combo "4c"...
4c) Flash Freeze MB, NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, u3, 11~Iceberg (45%)
-- (Combo "4c" cannot be avoided after the sweep in either of the previous combos if timed properly unless they do a wakeup attack.)

5) J1~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, u3, 11~Iceberg (44%)

6a) NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, 22~Flash Freeze MB, NJ2~f113~Frozen Daggers (45%)
6b) NJ2~f113~Black Ice, u3, f113~Flash Freeze MB, NJ2~f113~Frozen Daggers (48%)
6c) J1~f113~Black Ice, u3, u3, 22~Flash Freeze MB, NJ2~f113~Frozen Daggers (49%)

<3

 

[RiBBz22]

I hate that douche known as Sodium Grundy and want to help my fellow KF players know how to beat his ass back to the grave.

I do pretty well against him now, but I didn't know all of the nj punish options. I usually will just jump out to avoid the trait grab and then go back to staying outside of WC range where I can throw knives and whiff punish.

 

[Konqrr]

I added some info about Dead Air to my post.

 

[Gh0sty]

Here is my day 2 Killer Frost (I know there's a lot more I could have done..but I'm still learning her) vs my friend who seems to be taking to Bat Girl very well.

Leave it up to Akromaniac27 to be a beast with Batgirl right out of the gates. Your KF shows a lot of potential, bro. Thanks for posting!


KILLA_xGHOST

 

[Konqrr]

Here is my day 2 Killer Frost (I know there's a lot more I could have done..but I'm still learning her) vs my friend who seems to be taking to Bat Girl very well.

Nice to see you playing KF too.

That Batgirl plays hella unsafe, but I liked it as well. Glad you started to punish her more as the matches went on.

 

[xKhaoTik]

I didn't like that Batgirl at all Lol. So unsafe. But good job picking up Killer frost RunwayMafia! Can you drop Hawkgirl now? She's not classy at all.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Lol I just figured out you can parry Doomsday's venom and Mb venom. The match was never hard but I would just scout out the venom and punish or parry/backdash after Mb venom. But parrying the entire thing makes me LOL. This has to be one of his worst MUs.

 

[UserJuke]

I have issues with keep away Superman with Killer Frost. I might just be missing something, but I cant really zone him back when he is doing air lazers and I have to go in. I played about 10 games online vs. a good Superman and it seems like I would go right through him if he air dash attacked and I air dash attacked. It was odd, ill try to recreate it in practice. I just eat tons of chip trying to get in, and hes already hard as hell to deal with with f23.

 

[Konqrr]

I have issues with keep away Superman with Killer Frost. I might just be missing something, but I cant really zone him back when he is doing air lazers and I have to go in. I played about 10 games online vs. a good Superman and it seems like I would go right through him if he air dash attacked and I air dash attacked. It was odd, ill try to recreate it in practice. I just eat tons of chip trying to get in, and hes already hard as hell to deal with with f23.

Don't ever go fullscreen vs Supes... block air lasers when he starts them, not holding back waiting for it because you will be too far away to punish. Once you block an air laser, you get a slide punish as he lands.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Ok I'm pretty confident and comfortable saying that Killer Frost beats Aquaman, Bane, doomsday, flash, lex, raven and sinestro. I also feel like she loses to black Adam and Hawk girl. All the other matches my either be 5-5 or I'm just not comfortable to talk about it yet. Thoughts?

 

[Konqrr]

I keep going back and forth on the Grundy matchup as her best game is Slide and her up close game and Grundy blows that up bad if they know the KF matchup.

However, now that I know that MB f3 beats ALL of Grundy's options from a blockstring, I can stop that bullshit cold. I just need to find a way to stop getting cornered lol

One way to beat Walking Corpse is to poke with standing 2 and if you see him do WC, jump out as that is your fastest recovering normal.

So for now I feel it is 5-5.

I also think that Frost beats Nightwing. He has to use meter to stop her from getting a full combo punish on his Wingdings (air dash 2, slide) if he uses them too often. He can't safely pressure her (parry) because he doesn't have any first hit lows outside of sweeps.

I think she beats Deathstroke, and Superman too.

 

[Rickyraws]

I keep going back and forth on the Grundy matchup as her best game is Slide and her up close game and Grundy blows that up bad if they know the KF matchup.

However, now that I know that MB f3 beats ALL of Grundy's options from a blockstring, I can stop that bullshit cold. I just need to find a way to stop getting cornered lol

One way to beat Walking Corpse is to poke with standing 2 and if you see him do WC, jump out as that is your fastest recovering normal.

So for now I feel it is 5-5.

I also think that Frost beats Nightwing. He has to use meter to stop her from getting a full combo punish on his Wingdings (air dash 2, slide) if he uses them too often. He can't safely pressure her (parry) because he doesn't have any first hit lows outside of sweeps.

I think she beats Deathstroke, and Superman too.

I used to think she beat Superman, but after some HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE experiences the past couple of days, I don't think she has the advantage of ANY airborne characters.


I....I cried a little....but I'm okay now.

 

[xKhaoTik]

Yea she definitely beats deathstroke (disregard the match between bit and slips at Ufgt lol).

I was starting to feel the same way about nightwing as well.


But superman? That caught me by surprise lol. I think it's even right now. Thoughts Konqrr?

 

[Sage Leviathan]

KF dies to DS, im 100% positive.

She is certainly NOT the best character in the game. Theres just no way
@everyone complaining

 

[16 Bit]

KF dies to DS, im 100% positive.

She is certainly NOT the best character in the game. Theres just no way
@everyone complaining

Killer Frost beats Deathstroke. At least 6-4.


I think there is a decent chance she is the best character in the game. Need more experience playing other regions and scenes though.

 

[Jer]

I agree with you xKhaoTik.

Sage Leviathan How come you think she loses to KF? Because I honestly see this MU as 6-4/5-5.

 

[xKhaoTik]

KF dies to DS, im 100% positive.

She is certainly NOT the best character in the game. Theres just no way
@everyone complaining

DEFINITELY beats DS

 

[YOMI MITYEAP]

DEFINITELY beats DS

after the patch, yeah she got the slight advantage now bcuz she can punish blocked guns with spikes, that is a huge asset for her to be able to do vs her.

 

[Konqrr]

But superman? That caught me by surprise lol. I think it's even right now. Thoughts Konqrr?

Well, KF is very unique in the fact that she gets a full combo for people pressing too many buttons and LBSH, Superman players press too many buttons. Low scoop is hella negative which is their way to avoid parry in a mixup.

She blows up air lasers with slide to full combo. Superman can't do anything about blocked Iceberg except for Super.

I just think that she has the tools to stop a lot of Superman's best tools.

Her uppercut is gdlk in this matchup. Superman is not Bats J2 lol

But take all of this as my current opinion as I have limited exp against real Superman players, none of them being top players.

Superman's Super may be a problem though.

 

[16 Bit]

I think she beats Superman as well. She can deal with his zoning. The guessing game off a blocked f+2,3~breath is likely in her favor. Knockdowns are a huge problem for him.

 

[That__John__Guy]

A KF friend has to face what is likely a Batman main in a tourney coming up. Any and all tips, strategies, etc., for dealing with a good Batman will be greatly appreciated!

 

[xKhaoTik]

Konqrr @16Bit. I agree with everything you are saying. It's definitely not as bad as it was during the first couple of weeks. I've gotten much better in the MU after talking to bit about it. I guess I didn't want to think so differently of a MU in such a short time. A lot of us thought it was in superman's favor at first.

 

[Konqrr]

A KF friend has to face what is likely a Batman main in a tourney coming up. Any and all tips, strategies, etc., for dealing with a good Batman will be greatly appreciated!

Be aware of his b1 strings after a blocked slide. Use backdash to escape his pressure as he has nothing outside of a read or loosing his bats to punish you for it.

Choose your slides carefully as Batman with bats out get a full combo punish on a blocked slide! It is unlikely that this Batman player knows this though, but you can test the waters and see what he knows.

Do NOT try to punish J2 with d2 unless you see it coming and do it early. Either block it and the incoming blockstring or dash out to avoid it.

Iceberg punish all harpoon whiffs.