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Match-up Discussion Joker Matchup Discussion

Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
I don't really go to my offline scene for SF4 and it's more of a casual game until I get my first stick in about 2 weeks, can't play Adon without perfect execution
 
OnlineRon91

OnlineRon91

Joker++
Yea Adon needs a user with his 1 frame links down and mastery of instant air jaguar kicks. Gamerbee is amazing with the character.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Adon has no hard combos or anything, it's all jaguar kicks, the psychology behind those kicks are amazing, people really get button happy when a sluggish normal jaguar kick gets blocked but when an instant one hits them with fast recovery and startup they feel pressure and don't press buttons.

Not to mention how spammable IAJK is for pressure.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Uploading them but the quality and colors are really horrible and the screen is cut off a little, If a windows phone usb cable wasn't so difficult to find the quality would actually be seeable.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
Reuploading them soon, found out I missed a quality option

also learned that "good" quality is half the quality of "best".

Now the quality is pretty good and I can actually record games.
 
Qwark28

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
So the longer a vid is the shittier the quality is. I just need to get a fucking windows phone usb cable.
 
OnlineRon91

OnlineRon91

Joker++
I use parry against MMH's slow ass b3. Mostly because If I try to neutral jump punish they will dash out, and everything else like throw or my own armored b3/f3 will get beat out since his b3 retracts his hurtbox on top of being multi-hitting. Give parry a shot next time :)
 
StevoSuprem0

StevoSuprem0

I'm gonna make this skill gap... disappear.
OnlineRon91 said:
I use parry against MMH's slow ass b3. Mostly because If I try to neutral jump punish they will dash out, and everything else like throw or my own armored b3/f3 will get beat out since his b3 retracts his hurtbox on top of being multi-hitting. Give parry a shot next time :)
Click to expand...
Yeah I had planned on that going in, but didn't have a good read on when he was going to throw them out / couldn't react fast enough. Had to get used to his zoning as well.
I'm not putting enough time in these days either :( I feel really rusty every week at the Break. Shit's just busy right now.
 
OnlineRon91

OnlineRon91

Joker++
I decided to step out of my comfort zone and learn some bread and butter combos with Aquaman yesterday I think. I'm like, he has a full screen 21-22% projectile, 40% overheads, 40% lows, best anti-air in the game, and get out of combo cards. First time in a fighting game imma learn a top tier lol, i think I will benefit from doing so because it will help me realize what my main character lacks though.
 
StevoSuprem0

StevoSuprem0

I'm gonna make this skill gap... disappear.
OnlineRon91 said:
I decided to step out of my comfort zone and learn some bread and butter combos with Aquaman yesterday I think. I'm like, he has a full screen 21-22% projectile, 40% overheads, 40% lows, best anti-air in the game, and get out of combo cards. First time in a fighting game imma learn a top tier lol, i think I will benefit from doing so because it will help me realize what my main character lacks though.
Click to expand...
Joker lacks that entire list you just gave. Lol
 
OnlineRon91

OnlineRon91

Joker++
Yeap. While Aquamans 25 frame b2 gives me 40%, Jokers gives me 11% and sends my opponent half a screen away where I have to get close again with my horrible forward dash.

The only up side is that Jokers b2 is safe on block and Aquamans isn't but eh, for a chance at 29% more damage? I'd take it lol. And not everyone can full combo punish it on block anyways.

Anyways I do want to add Aquaman to my list of characters I play lol which is so far only Joker.
 
Fromundaman

Fromundaman

I write too much.
A few things I noticed from your set:

-Dash through his zoning. He has to spend a bar to hit you for free, and otherwise it's a guessing game like Raven's pillars. Also when he touches his temple for the overhead projectile, you can just dash right through unless he read the dash and did a short one. Also you can gunshot trade before it hits but I forget if that's advantageous or not.

-Use D2 cancels! Not sure why no one does these but D2 is amazing and canceling it allows us to have ranged moves that lead to setups, combos or even just short strings of free damage. When MMH doesn't have trait up we outrange his whole moveset with this, forcing him to activate trait to compete at mid range (that said when trait is up he beats everything).

-I was really sad when you hit him in the corner and just dropped your combo. Off of J3 in the corner you can D2>Teeth>D1>B1>Teeth then keep comboing from there. Can't let people get out free like that!

-Don't respect the normal orbs AS much. Every time he put one on you you waited for it to go off. You can just dash away from it.

-You can pretty much dash for free around MMH so long as he doesn't have trait up or a MB orb in front of you.



Hope that helps. Not an easy matchup if you don't know it and you didn't do bad at all. You've got this next time!
 
StevoSuprem0

StevoSuprem0

I'm gonna make this skill gap... disappear.
Fromundaman said:
A few things I noticed from your set:

-Dash through his zoning. He has to spend a bar to hit you for free, and otherwise it's a guessing game like Raven's pillars. Also when he touches his temple for the overhead projectile, you can just dash right through unless he read the dash and did a short one. Also you can gunshot trade before it hits but I forget if that's advantageous or not.
Click to expand...
Yeah I started to realize this, but was also getting cautions of his pillars. Did it right a few times and messed it up as well. Need more experience with it.

Fromundaman said:
-Use D2 cancels! Not sure why no one does these but D2 is amazing and canceling it allows us to have ranged moves that lead to setups, combos or even just short strings of free damage. When MMH doesn't have trait up we outrange his whole moveset with this, forcing him to activate trait to compete at mid range (that said when trait is up he beats everything).
Click to expand...
I've started using d2 cancels alot lately. For some reason, though, I keep using D2 xx RLG instead of teeth or crowbar out of habit. Need to stop that. Comes back to not playing enough and falling into habits instead of adapting the situations.

Fromundaman said:
-I was really sad when you hit him in the corner and just dropped your combo. Off of J3 in the corner you can D2>Teeth>D1>B1>Teeth then keep comboing from there. Can't let people get out free like that!
Click to expand...
Yeah, I actually just started practicing that combo recently. Isn't it just as good to do d1>d1> teeth though? I find that easier to pull off. But yeah, I fucking it up in the match.

Fromundaman said:
-Don't respect the normal orbs AS much. Every time he put one on you you waited for it to go off. You can just dash away from it.
Click to expand...
Matchup experience; I need it. Lol.

Fromundaman said:
-You can pretty much dash for free around MMH so long as he doesn't have trait up or a MB orb in front of you.
Click to expand...
Yup.
 
Fromundaman

Fromundaman

I write too much.
You can do D1>D1>teeth as well, but D1 doesn't have as good of a cancel window and as a result I've been able to extend combos more off of D1>B1>teeth than off of D1 x2>teeth. That said, it could just be me not finding the right moves to keep the combo going.
 
StevoSuprem0

StevoSuprem0

I'm gonna make this skill gap... disappear.
Fromundaman said:
You can do D1>D1>teeth as well, but D1 doesn't have as good of a cancel window and as a result I've been able to extend combos more off of D1>B1>teeth than off of D1 x2>teeth. That said, it could just be me not finding the right moves to keep the combo going.
Click to expand...
I had completely forgotten about this stuff for the longest time, and then I realized that j3, d2 xx RLG doesn't work in the corner and remembered that this was an option, so now I'm working on using it and exploring options. If I come across anything new, I'll be sure to post it.
 
Fromundaman

Fromundaman

I write too much.
StevoSuprem0 said:
I had completely forgotten about this stuff for the longest time, and then I realized that j3, d2 xx RLG doesn't work in the corner and remembered that this was an option, so now I'm working on using it and exploring options. If I come across anything new, I'll be sure to post it.
Click to expand...
Awesome thanks.
I'm actually still working on it myself since I tend to default to muscle memory more than I should and just always D2>MB DB2. It's a nasty habit I'm trying to break.


Also, just going to say that this month break I'm taking while I leave the country is giving me lots of ideas. I have multiple pages of stuff to test when I get back, including stage BS for almost every stage. Of course, no idea how much of it works yet, but hopefully early January I should have some new stuff coming.
 
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