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Jade General Discussion Thread

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Yeah about this... What the hell is Jade going to do lmao?
My points still stand... she may get plus off a situation she has to work for, to get something that doesn't pay off for her unless granted respect to use her b323.. which lo and behold, is another High Rish/Low Reward situation .... besides that her fastest projectile comes out at 20 frames.. She is not a zoner by any means, especially with so many teleports or Glow-beating moves... GLOW HAS 44fr RECOVERY TOO ... The list just goes on.

Was really hoping this'd be the level you'd have to play MK11, but yeah.. It ain't. She has no chance against gapless strings with 2 or more mixups, footsie tools with built-in mixups or ... pretty much any other superior tool to hers.

LowTierJade Forever
Funny thing is, I'm not sure if she loses any matchups horribly even then. This game seems pretty balanced right now so I'd like to wait and see before we try to push any buffs for her. I do think that she could use some love but as @THTB said, things take time.

I kinda wish 124 launched properly. Or 4,3 worked consistently on everyone for a combo starter.
But then I also wish Glow didn't have that stupid ass recovery. I literally kept dying in a Tower because I had to face off against a 4x hp Noob Saibot with Cyrax Nets coming every 45 seconds and he even had that skydrop that's immune to Glow.

Her biggest issue is that people get in her face and you literally get nothing for pushing them back out. If she could punish properly she'd be fine imo.
 

jmt

Noob
She has a parry for a reason. Use it to condition people NOT to spam low pokes into grabs. It's also very good at making people not participate in low poke wars after you've landed a poke of your own.
Does that actually work? I'll have to try going into parry after d1.
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
Yeah about this... What the hell is Jade going to do lmao?
My points still stand... she may get plus off a situation she has to work for, to get something that doesn't pay off for her unless granted respect to use her b323.. which lo and behold, is another High Rish/Low Reward situation .... besides that her fastest projectile comes out at 20 frames.. She is not a zoner by any means, especially with so many teleports or Glow-beating moves... GLOW HAS 44fr RECOVERY TOO ... The list just goes on.

Was really hoping this'd be the level you'd have to play MK11, but yeah.. It ain't. She has no chance against gapless strings with 2 or more mixups, footsie tools with built-in mixups or ... pretty much any other superior tool to hers.

LowTierJade Forever
She is very much a midrange zoner (moreso in V1 than V2), but she has a ton of stuff to take in before there's any sort of true comfort zoning. It's not as simple as other characters and that's not necessarily bad. It's just more to learn lol. If teleporters made her not at all a zoner, then Cetrion, Skarlet, etc aren't either. b343 is still solid but you can't autopilot the string. Anti-air 2 is KEY to getting the most damage you can out of her. d4 is strong. Air glaive allows her to approach much more safely and is good on conditioning due to how well it occupies the screen without putting her in harms way when used effectively, and thanks to the meter system, you're encouraged to AMP it often. All of her strings and normals play different parts of the gameplan. She has a lot to take in, and it's not easy, but it can work.

Trust me, I was wondering if she was any good when I first started using her. It wasn't until I got used to what I wanted to be doing that she started to really make sense. I don't know if she's top tier or anything, I just know she's not some bottom of the barrel character. Not with her toolkit.
 
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GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
She is very much a midrange zoner, but she has a ton of stuff to take in before there's any sort of true comfort zoning. It's not as simple as other characters and that's not necessarily bad. It's just more to learn lol.

Trust me, I was wondering if she was any good when I first started using her. It wasn't until I got used to what I wanted to be doing that she started to really make sense. I don't know if she's top tier or anything, I just know she's not some bottom of the barrel character. Not with her toolkit.
How good is an i12 parry comparatively in this game?
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
How good is an i12 parry comparatively in this game?
Not a reaction tool lol, but it's one of 2 things I'm not using with the character (the other being f41). It's a slow parry...only really effective when you know people are doing something.
 

Wrath0594

Steam profile: 76561198102032134
Compare her to parry to idk... Skarlet (god tier). 9 frame, can hold for as long as she wants or let go. Only 20 frames of recovery, so good luck punishing it. And the animation is practically identical to her block.

Jade's parry might be fine, sure. But it is OBJECTIVELY WORSE THAN OTHER PARRIES IN THE SAME GAME.

If you want to talk about the strength of a move- PLEASE COMPARE IT TO OTHER MOVES FIRST. DONT TALK ABOUT THEM IN A VACUUM.

Idk what the devs were thinking with some of this. It's like they designed characters separately, without any kind of collaboration, then tossed em all into the game right before launch. When you compare moves with identical uses like this and see the blatant and massive imbalance, their carelessness really shows.
 
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GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
Not a reaction tool lol, but it's one of 2 things I'm not using with the character (the other being f41). It's a slow parry...only really effective when you know people are doing something.
Compare her to parry to... Idk Skarlet (god tier). 9 frame, can hold for as long as she wants or let go. Only 20 frames of recovery, so good luck punishing it. And the animation is practically identical to her block.

Jade's parry might be fine, sure. But it is OBJECTIVELY WORSE THAN OTHER PARRIES IN THE SAME GAME.

If you want to talk about the strength of a move- PLEASE COMPARE IT TO OTHER MOVES FIRST. DONT TALK ABOUT THEM IN A VACUUM.

Idk what the devs were thinking with some of this. It's like they designed characters separately, then tossed em all into the game right before launch.
I can see it blow up 13f moves getting mashed out on reaction and it has a fairly decent kb going for it too. No idea if there are 13f gaps though.
I don't know why Jade has such shit frames though. And when I commented on this in the beta, all the sheep were like
"Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah it is fiiiiiiiine"
 
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She has a parry for a reason. Use it to condition people NOT to spam low pokes into grabs. It's also very good at making people not participate in low poke wars after you've landed a poke of your own.
I thought her parry didn't work against low pokes or grabs? Or am I mistaken?
 
Reactions: jmt

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
After sets with a Sub-Zero, I'm heavily conflicted on whether this isn't her worst matchup currently.

Jade cannot effectively zone Sub-Zero because Slide is a low and it goes over bf1 and trading with Iceball is bad anyway.
Slide also punishes Glow anywhere within slide range so she can't glow unless she's full screen.
212 puts Jade in Subzero's d4 range and the range of his overhead so it puts you in a 50/50
124 is throw punishable so it's a 50/50 situation if it gets blocked (by anyone tbh)
Jade cannot punish Slide effectively and it prevents her from playing her game
Air Axe is in no way inferior to air glaive

Air glaive is punishable by either ice ball if it's instant (sub trades for full combo) or run up and uppercut if it's used anywhere within dash distance, or by slide on the way down if it's within slide distance
Slide also punishes low spark
His icicle projectile barrage is a mid and it covers all of Jade's spacing options
I can't see how this matchup is not at least 7-3

@THTB @AK Harold @Espio
Input welcome.
 
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DrZmmm

Noob
The fact that slide punishes glow is where things start to go wrong. He already has zoning options that are as good as or better than Jades. The slide is just the icing on the cake and like you said, we can't punish slide effectively even if we do block it.

But I think that's a problem with Jade in general..she cant punish like most of the roster can. If a character can match or take away our best tools we're pretty much screwed cause we dont have the frames or damage to make up for the loss.
 

MK9

Noob
Been her problem since the beta, she has no quick startups. She can’t counter a lot of strings on block.
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
Vs Sub, you can react to ice ball and choose your time to glow there. And once it's up, we'll have more freedom, since now low projectile is much less risky to throw out. This is how you want to activate glow on most characters who will try to zone Jade (unless you AMP air glaive and they block it from a reasonable distance or their gap closer specials aren't too great). If you are V1, losing out on straight glaive isn't a total loss. V2, however, I can see this being troublesome. But generally, this is a matchup where air glaive definitely shouldn't be done on autopilot.

The risk on air glaive is indeed a factor, but a big thing to consider is that the Sub definitely must be reading that you won't AMP air glaive at, like, the peak of your jump, and even then, if he's too slow, he's getting hit and you can take that time to glow, since you are very plus on hit at that point.

124 is -6. If they are going for a throw and you scout this, their chin should be ROCKED. 212 being in d4 range is tricky. I need to actually test, but I'm pretty sure jump back ia air glaive can check someone mashing d4 here. I don't think all hope is lost.

Jade's speed isn't really bad, tbh. She has it better in fastest standing mid department than a few characters out there (there's characters who don't get a mid until 14f). Mids in general are fairly slow, and not many can actually lay claim to a sub-10f mid, and her jabs are the typical 7-8f ones for those particular punishes. Also, having a solid d4 herself is good because Sub has his b143 string (I think hers actually outspeeds Sub's if it's the same speed as Scorp's). Vs V1, ice ball can be a problem because we have to scout, but Sub has to also be aware that we have a few ways around it and can even ignore it for periods of time, and will have to do his own scouting.

This is all I picked up from my one ranked set vs titaniumtigerz, so it's very initial impressions. But it didn't seem as dire as advertised here.
 

Wrenchfarm

Lexcorp Proprietary Technologies
Any tips on landing JiK, Air Glaive EX, B2xNitro kick consistently? I really like having a way to generate some combo damage, but it's a little inconsistent (especially on small bodies). Am I messing up here, or is this just a "learn the match up" thing?