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Injustice interview, pro players testing, easier to get into than Mortal Kombat

EGGXI

Scary Bat
Casuals will buy it anyway just because Fatalities and story mode.
I have friends who won't buy fighting games/play them with me because casuals can't get into it, and that sucks. People won't buy stuff just for story and fatalities if the gameplay is atrocious for them, a lot of people don't care for story in fighters...
 
"Press buttons and cool stuff happens!" is classic marketing speak for people who have a habit of drooling on themselves.

At least they didn't dumb down supers to one button, since holding two different buttons at the same time may be too hard for some people.

The barrier for entry is too high still, needs an easy mode where the game plays itself and every match ends in a tie.
 
At least they didn't dumb down supers to one button, since holding two different buttons at the same time may be too hard for some people.
I always felt like it wasn't important if MK9 had it on 2 buttons, or if it would have it on one button, since there really isn't that much of a difference, if you do a certain motion and press a button, or if you press two buttons.
MK9 supers still feel harder for casual people, since you actually need timing to land them. If you're not at the right distance, or you whiff, or the opponent simply blocks it's over, while in other fighting games it's much easier to simply shoot out a full screen laserbeam or something and maybe at least do some slight damage. Against other casuals it's guaranteed damage, while you can't say the same for MK9. I think the same will apply for Injustice.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
The guy who did the interview is not a core developer, so I'd take everything he says with a bit of a grain of salt. I know what he's trying to say, but I think that casuals are going to have a harder time with this online than ever before. From what we've seen of the gameplay, 111 spear isn't going to cut it, and back to block makes turtling twice as hard.

I mean really, back to block alone raises the barrier to entry for most 'typical' players. Not to mention the buffed cancel system, being unable to block during dashes, having to understand how the clash works (rather than just mashing a breaker), having to avoid stage hazards etc. Also not having the life bar reset when you 'lose' a round.

Offensively, the stage abilities are probably the most noob-friendly part of the game, and I predict that casual players will use them relentlessly. But when it comes to the core gameplay, it looks like a diiferent animal altogether. So take a deep breath, relax, and enjoy what looks to be one of the most exciting fighters to drop in years.
 

Justice

Noob
I mean really, back to block alone raises the barrier to entry for most 'typical' players. Not to mention the buffed cancel system, being unable to block during dashes, having to understand how the clash works (rather than just mashing a breaker), having to avoid stage hazards etc. Also not having the life bar reset when you 'lose' a round.
But, Back-to-Block is the more widely-used mechanic in fighters, especially in 2D fighters. Sure the timing is different (I still walk backwards because I expect an attack but block too early and then the region detection kicks in), I just don't see that as being as large of a barrier as people want to believe it's going to be for casuals. Unless they grew up strictly on MK and Soul Caliber and such.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
But, Back-to-Block is the more widely-used mechanic in fighters, especially in 2D fighters. Sure the timing is different (I still walk backwards because I expect an attack but block too early and then the region detection kicks in), I just don't see that as being as large of a barrier as people want to believe it's going to be for casuals. Unless they grew up strictly on MK and Soul Caliber and such.
That actually reinforces my point, though. The barrier for a casual player to be able to do well online is a lot higher in many other 2D fighters than it was in MK9.
 

Justice

Noob
That actually reinforces my point, though. The barrier for a casual player to be able to do well online is a lot higher in many other 2D fighters than it was in MK9.
But was that due to back to block or the casual player's inability to deal with the more advanced mechanics of the game. For example, in MK it's real easy to block a crossover punch but if you do, you're locked into taking a chip string at best. This is why I don't think that the blocking will be as bad as people think unless the player is overly accustomed to the mechanics and timing of a block button.
 

EGGXI

Scary Bat
For those who were worried, Hector said in his interview that they are trying to make the game as good as possible for tournament players, which helps the casuals.

Also all the move lists apparently include frame data and recovery time data, so it's geared toward pros.
 

Goku

Noob
Would it make me look gay if I would stand up and start dancing right now? That song is amazing and usually I'm into rock and metal..
I know right, it is soo damn catchy you have to do the ass-shake dance lol. Her other song, Ice Cream, is the same way :D. And it absolutely would not make you look gay, just that you are having a good time :).
 

Numbface

You. Are Not. Alone.
Block button isn't easier for new players because the block button is a visual "tell". Block button is a giveaway, which says to the opposing player "they're blocking, so do x.". If that opposing player is experienced then it will be brutal for the novice. With back to block, both players must think harder to decipher why they think their opponent Might block any given attack or why they might not block any particular attack.

Example, in SF4 a crouched player might be blocking or they might be buffering an attack. If you are the opposing player, you have only your experience and breakdown of the player's tendencies to decipher which is more likely, because you can't actually see them blocking. In addition to this, you have the safety of knowing that there are safe zones in which you can stand, where you can mount a logical attack based on safe jumping and or throwing projectile or dashing. However, the other player also knows this (usually), and that's the challenge for both players: how do I defend and how do I attack--all while taking the least damage?

There aren't many positions in the game that pretty much spell out what decision you're supposed to make in order to win, which makes the game more fun. Example, in basketball how do you know which way to dribble on offense in order to get around a defender? You don't know, and sometimes you can't get around them. However, that doesn't mean that you cede possession (life) or position. It just means that you have to think smarter than your defender in order to make them change their strategy.
So much wrong with this I don't know where to begin
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
Block button isn't easier for new players because the block button is a visual "tell". Block button is a giveaway, which says to the opposing player "they're blocking, so do x.". If that opposing player is experienced then it will be brutal for the novice. With back to block, both players must think harder to decipher why they think their opponent Might block any given attack or why they might not block any particular attack.

Example, in SF4 a crouched player might be blocking or they might be buffering an attack. If you are the opposing player, you have only your experience and breakdown of the player's tendencies to decipher which is more likely, because you can't actually see them blocking. In addition to this, you have the safety of knowing that there are safe zones in which you can stand, where you can mount a logical attack based on safe jumping and or throwing projectile or dashing. However, the other player also knows this (usually), and that's the challenge for both players: how do I defend and how do I attack--all while taking the least damage?

There aren't many positions in the game that pretty much spell out what decision you're supposed to make in order to win, which makes the game more fun. Example, in basketball how do you know which way to dribble on offense in order to get around a defender? You don't know, and sometimes you can't get around them. However, that doesn't mean that you cede possession (life) or position. It just means that you have to think smarter than your defender in order to make them change their strategy.
Okay, how does this in any way equate that the block button is harder for beginners...?

If anything, this says the total opposite.
 
Block button is much harder for beginners, I can tell.
Everyone and their mother has played a fighting game once in their life and holding back to block is simply natural. You back off, when you don't want to get hit.

In MK9 you need to hold a specific button for that. It's actually really tricky at the beginning, because you simply forget pushing that additional button.

At least it's like that for me.
For some weird reason it didn't bug me in Soul Calibur though. But MK9 is simply a different story, I don't know why.
 

hellbly

Noob
Block button is much harder for beginners, I can tell.
Everyone and their mother has played a fighting game once in their life and holding back to block is simply natural. You back off, when you don't want to get hit.

In MK9 you need to hold a specific button for that. It's actually really tricky at the beginning, because you simply forget pushing that additional button.

At least it's like that for me.
For some weird reason it didn't bug me in Soul Calibur though. But MK9 is simply a different story, I don't know why.
I've the same experience.
It depends from 3d/2d games, I guess: in a 2d game you find easier (and common) to block backing away from your opponent, you only have two directions: an attack direction and a defense direction.
In a 3d game you've to re-think your gaming, because you've more directions and backing away is not automatic safe: in this kind of games you're already thinking ahead; in a 2d game, maybe, you act more by instinct/automatic reflex