Phew, time to get blown up again, but that's fine (anyone whose opinion I give a shit about has moved on to Discord, anyway...). I'm always willing to discuss things in a civil manner. I'll be ignoring any shitty responses. If you disagree, great, but please address the issues brought up and provide valid reasons, and I'll be happy to like your posts and admit any wrongness on my part. That said, here we go:
Injustice 2 is a "problematic game". What does that mean? Well, I think now, more than ever, we can feel the influence of WB over NRS. Rather than releasing a complete, working title, NRS has released a mess of of a fighting game with lopsided matchups, unfinished characters, input bugs, and money-grubbing strategies. Let's start with the gear system...
Gear
I was more than willing to give the gear system a shot. With a competitive mode included, I figured "great, I can customize my character and it won't affect gameplay. That sounds pretty damn cool." Unfortunately, it's not pretty damn cool. It's pretty damn shitty the way it's force down out throats. Rather than being an "optional" component, we are forced to play with gear enabled by default. This completely ruins any non-Ranked online game modes for those of us who want to play with baseline characters.
Even turning off gear is purposefully confusing. You can't just turn off gear. You have to turn on a mode that has the effect of turning off gear. It's purposefully ambiguous. Your average online player probably doesn't even realize how to turn off gear. WB, and by association NRS, want you to play with gear. They want you to spend 2,000 Source Crystals to transform a single piece of gear. They want those of us who paid $100 to still have to spend money on premium skins. The entire gear system is just free-to-play nonsense included in a $60 (or $100) game. It's criminal. It's insulting.
Moves that could have been included in characters' base sets were set aside as gear-only. This has ruined more than a few of the game's roster. Many character feel totally inadequate until you equip a move that should have been a default part of their move set to begin with. This is catering to the casual crowd (i.e. the piggybank) on an unprecedented level. I fully understand that NRS is a business and they need to make money, but they are doing so on the backs of their most loyal customers. They have sold us out to nickel and dime the Gamefaqs and Eventhubs casuals. Gear was supposed to be optional, but it has overtaken every facet of this game. Rather than making money by releasing a quality title that thousands of people will buy, they're releasing an incomplete, buggy, $65 (or $100) title that tries its very best to goad you into dropping as much additional cash as possible. It's shameful. [*please see note highlighted in green in the update at the bottom of this post]
Bugs
Do I even need to mention the input bug? I've been playing fighting games since 1991 and I have never experienced anything like this. It kills me knowing time that could have been spent making a great fighting game was devoted to that anal wart they call they Gear system. The game is borderline unplayable in its current state. I play on Hitbox, and even going to neutral before going for a punish is futile, as the game holds the down or back input for an eternity.
As discovered by Red Raptor, the game is also riddled with option selects. I'm sure they'll be removed eventually (it's not like my $100 game should be complete or anything...), but for now characters can safely go for tic throws with no repercussions. Again, would this have been an issue if NRS wasn't wasting time on the gear system? Who knows.
Character Viability Discrepancy
This is the section I expect to get blown up on by NRS loyalists and character fanatics, but anyone who can't see the difference between Batman and Captain Cold or Superman and Brainiac is simply in denial.
This game is riddled with 7/3 and 8/2 matchups, which is really nothing new for NRS. [*please see update at bottom of this post] Those of us who played Injustice 1 remember the block infinites on big-body characters. However, at least in that game, the big-body characters had some tools in some matchups. In this game we have characters like Captain Cold, who has a 3-hit all-high string. What? We have Brainiac, with a trait that goes away on hit or on block. We have Wonder Woman, whose trait is random for some unknown reason.
The issue is that the top 5 or 6 characters have all the tools. Batman shouldn't have the best zoning and the best rushdown. Neither should Superman, Black Adam, or Aquaman. But nonetheless we have these characters with extremely strong ranged presence also able to hold their own up close against any character in the cast. Why play Wonder Woman when you can play Aquaman and do everything she does, but better? Why play Cyborg when I can just play Batman and dominate from full-screen or up close?
It's insane seeing something like Batman's trait, which allows him to full-combo punish any gap or negative move in the game, which never goes away once called, and which he gains access to once every few seconds, alongside something like Brainiac's trait, which is slow, less + on block, can't punish gaps, and goes away on hit or block, or Captain Cold's trait, which must be charged while putting Cold at great risk. Who balanced this game?
As it stands, there is no reason to play 90% of the roster; the top 5 or 6 have all the tools necessary to dominate any matchup. Any tournament players you see doing well with Cheetah, Robin, Joker, or anyone else are simply amazing players; it's the players doing well despite their characters' flaws.
Conclusion
It's late so I've got to wrap this up without saying everything I had in mind. If you enjoy the game then I'm genuinely happy for you. I've been waiting to play as Black Manta since I1 was first announced, and I plan to stick it out purely to play as him. But it is not a pleasant experience. The game is flawed in many, many ways. If you have an issue I have not brought up, please feel free to share it in the comments.
I have hope that NRS will begin correcting their mistakes. They'll give us a reason to use characters who are simply taking up space at the moment. They'll give us the option to make a competitive-only KOTH or room. But until then, I have to concede that this game is the worst example of corporate greed and incompetence, that it is a flawed and incomplete experience, and it's insane that WB and NRS expect those of us who paid up to $100 to dig deeper for the pleasure of getting zoned out and rushed down by the same 5 or 6 characters who do everything our characters do, only better.
[UPDATE]: Responses to the comments brought up so far:
Injustice 2 is a "problematic game". What does that mean? Well, I think now, more than ever, we can feel the influence of WB over NRS. Rather than releasing a complete, working title, NRS has released a mess of of a fighting game with lopsided matchups, unfinished characters, input bugs, and money-grubbing strategies. Let's start with the gear system...
Gear
I was more than willing to give the gear system a shot. With a competitive mode included, I figured "great, I can customize my character and it won't affect gameplay. That sounds pretty damn cool." Unfortunately, it's not pretty damn cool. It's pretty damn shitty the way it's force down out throats. Rather than being an "optional" component, we are forced to play with gear enabled by default. This completely ruins any non-Ranked online game modes for those of us who want to play with baseline characters.
Even turning off gear is purposefully confusing. You can't just turn off gear. You have to turn on a mode that has the effect of turning off gear. It's purposefully ambiguous. Your average online player probably doesn't even realize how to turn off gear. WB, and by association NRS, want you to play with gear. They want you to spend 2,000 Source Crystals to transform a single piece of gear. They want those of us who paid $100 to still have to spend money on premium skins. The entire gear system is just free-to-play nonsense included in a $60 (or $100) game. It's criminal. It's insulting.
Moves that could have been included in characters' base sets were set aside as gear-only. This has ruined more than a few of the game's roster. Many character feel totally inadequate until you equip a move that should have been a default part of their move set to begin with. This is catering to the casual crowd (i.e. the piggybank) on an unprecedented level. I fully understand that NRS is a business and they need to make money, but they are doing so on the backs of their most loyal customers. They have sold us out to nickel and dime the Gamefaqs and Eventhubs casuals. Gear was supposed to be optional, but it has overtaken every facet of this game. Rather than making money by releasing a quality title that thousands of people will buy, they're releasing an incomplete, buggy, $65 (or $100) title that tries its very best to goad you into dropping as much additional cash as possible. It's shameful. [*please see note highlighted in green in the update at the bottom of this post]
Bugs
Do I even need to mention the input bug? I've been playing fighting games since 1991 and I have never experienced anything like this. It kills me knowing time that could have been spent making a great fighting game was devoted to that anal wart they call they Gear system. The game is borderline unplayable in its current state. I play on Hitbox, and even going to neutral before going for a punish is futile, as the game holds the down or back input for an eternity.
As discovered by Red Raptor, the game is also riddled with option selects. I'm sure they'll be removed eventually (it's not like my $100 game should be complete or anything...), but for now characters can safely go for tic throws with no repercussions. Again, would this have been an issue if NRS wasn't wasting time on the gear system? Who knows.
Character Viability Discrepancy
This is the section I expect to get blown up on by NRS loyalists and character fanatics, but anyone who can't see the difference between Batman and Captain Cold or Superman and Brainiac is simply in denial.
The issue is that the top 5 or 6 characters have all the tools. Batman shouldn't have the best zoning and the best rushdown. Neither should Superman, Black Adam, or Aquaman. But nonetheless we have these characters with extremely strong ranged presence also able to hold their own up close against any character in the cast. Why play Wonder Woman when you can play Aquaman and do everything she does, but better? Why play Cyborg when I can just play Batman and dominate from full-screen or up close?
It's insane seeing something like Batman's trait, which allows him to full-combo punish any gap or negative move in the game, which never goes away once called, and which he gains access to once every few seconds, alongside something like Brainiac's trait, which is slow, less + on block, can't punish gaps, and goes away on hit or block, or Captain Cold's trait, which must be charged while putting Cold at great risk. Who balanced this game?
As it stands, there is no reason to play 90% of the roster; the top 5 or 6 have all the tools necessary to dominate any matchup. Any tournament players you see doing well with Cheetah, Robin, Joker, or anyone else are simply amazing players; it's the players doing well despite their characters' flaws.
Conclusion
It's late so I've got to wrap this up without saying everything I had in mind. If you enjoy the game then I'm genuinely happy for you. I've been waiting to play as Black Manta since I1 was first announced, and I plan to stick it out purely to play as him. But it is not a pleasant experience. The game is flawed in many, many ways. If you have an issue I have not brought up, please feel free to share it in the comments.
I have hope that NRS will begin correcting their mistakes. They'll give us a reason to use characters who are simply taking up space at the moment. They'll give us the option to make a competitive-only KOTH or room. But until then, I have to concede that this game is the worst example of corporate greed and incompetence, that it is a flawed and incomplete experience, and it's insane that WB and NRS expect those of us who paid up to $100 to dig deeper for the pleasure of getting zoned out and rushed down by the same 5 or 6 characters who do everything our characters do, only better.
[UPDATE]: Responses to the comments brought up so far:
Good morning TYM. I just read through all 4 pages of comments, and I'm genuinely impressed. Many of you who disagree with me actually took the time to address specific points I made, and in some cases even made me think twice about a few of my points. A huge thanks to those of who you disagreed but kept things civil and to the point. I'll try to address as many of the questions and issues brought up as possible:
- Why make a post like this?
- Because this is a forum dedicated to talking about the game. This is literally the point of TYM. Feel free to post your own thread talking about the game. It's totally free, and you'll only get flamed a little, as long as you don't bring up anything related to buffs, nerfs, matchups, or complain about any aspect of the game. (Note: If you decide to post anything remotely negative, go ahead and put ATL Jones on mute and you'll have a much more pleasant experience.)
- What 8/2 MU's
- This is the part I wish I had worded differently, but it was late, I was exhausted, and now it's out there. I do believe there are some incredibly lopsided matchups in this game (Cheetah vs Batman, Cold vs Zoning, etc), but for me the bigger issue is with the tools they decided to give different characters. From my own experience, I'd say WoWo and Cold are the best examples of characters whose tools are just totally outclassed in this game. In any other game they could be great characters, but in Injustice 2, an all-high string isn't cutting it.
- Where the MU numbers start to come into play are when you start comparing the tools of the "lacking" characters with the tools of the top 5 or 6. A matchup is going to be 7/3 or worse, when played at the absolute highest level, if one character does everything the other character does, but better. I'm sick of bringing up Batman, but he's the most egregious example of a character that simply shines too brightly at too many aspects of the game. Aquaman is another good example, able to easily break 200 damage from full-screen while remaining + on all of his 6-frame mids that lead to TR chip while his trait keeps him totally safe. Don't jump or you're eating a 7-frame d2 into 300+ damage. If your character can't out-zone Aquaman and can't compete up close, then yes, at the highest possible level, you're looking at 7/3-8/2 territory.
- I'm seeing very conflicting comments. The same people preaching about how broken every other NRS game was at launch are the same ones saying it's too early to call bad matchups? What? You're literally going on about the track record NRS has of releasing absolutely broken characters in every single one of their games so far and then saying there's no way that's the case this time.
- But gear doesn't cost money
- That is absolutely correct. Like any free-to-play game, it is absolutely possible to get most of what you need out of the gear system without spending a dime. Where the money-grubbing comes into play is with anything dealing with Source Crystals. I won't get too into this because it's just one of those areas where you either agree or you don't, and it's just totally a matter of opinion. I think everything involving Source Crystals is too expensive for what you're getting, especially if you bought the $100 edition.
- One aspect of the cash-grab mentality that I know many people are fed up with is showing off gear-only moves in character trailers as a way to build hype and sell DLC, only for us to find out later that the character we just bought doesn't actually have the moves that were advertised. NRS could easily post information about gear moves and be transparent, and I hope that they decide to do so. As it stands, we have to take every trailer with a huge grain of salt and hope the character plays anything like what we're being shown. That feels dishonest.
- I really didn't have time to get into all of my gripes with the gear system, which involve the shitty interface, tedious process of opening boxes, inventory management, etc.
- My biggest issue with the gear system is that NRS wasted time on it instead of fixing things like the overall balance and input bug.
- I also need to update the section on Gear moves, because it is not worded well. It does sound like I'm saying gear moves themselves are the cash grab, but that's not what I mean. I'm trying to say that gear moves are catering to the casual players, who are the ones who will be dropping the most money on optional purchases. That, in itself, is not bad, but they're doing it at the expense of character viability. They are releasing gimped characters who require gear moves to be viable. That is the problem. Sorry for not making that clearer.
- But what about X move?
- No, I'm not saying all gear moves should have been default character moves. But there are many that should have been. Fate shouldn't have an unavoidable full-screen move that removes the opponent's ability to use meter, but WoWo should definitely be able to choose which trait to activate.
- But other NRS games were busted at launch!
- Great. And Hitler was a bad person; that doesn't excuse all other bad people because they're not as bad as Hitler. That's called "setting the bar too low". I'm not here to talk about MK9, I1, or MKX; I'm here to talk about Injustice 2, a game that must be judged on its own flaws and merits. How busted previous NRS games were doesn't concern me.
- That said, I do hope NRS addresses these issues and brings us a fun, balanced, functional experience.
- Why even play the game then?
- I like fighting games and I like comic book characters. I want the game to be good, and I imagine NRS is going to address most of these issues ("hope" might be a better word).
- Just because I think the game is a broken piece of shit right now does not mean I can't hold hope for the future.
- Why so hostile?
- Again, it was late, I was exhausted, and I had just come off a 6-hour-or-so playing session in which I managed to experience just about every negative thing the game had to offer. I should have been more diplomatic, you're absolutely correct, but I was not in a positive or constructive state of mind. I cleaned up the OP a bit to make it less hostile.
- And before anyone helpfully chimes in that the above statement is just code for "he got his ass kicked by Batman and wanted to cry on the forums", know that wasn't the case. I did quite well against @Scott The Scot's amazing Batman (with both of us experiencing everything the input bug had to offer), took out a great Firestorm with my Captain Cold, and had a fun back-and-forth set with an amazing Robin player against my Cheetah.
- Waaaaah. You're just a crybaby!
- Thanks for your helpful response and for promoting active discussion on the site, @CrimsonShadow. With mods like you, I can't imagine why people are fleeing TYM en masse to discuss things on private Discord servers. I thought TYM was a forum for discussing the game, but you're the mod, so I guess I'll defer to your judgement. I expect that kind of response from many of the less-respected TYM members, but I'm genuinely disappointed to see it coming from you.
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