How should Sub-Zero come back in MK10? And Who should he be?

[Qwark28]

In deception Noob admits himself that Kuai Liang has become powerful saying he would have shown pride if he were still human.

Noob has to have Smoke in order to beat Sub-Zero on not one but two separate occassions in that ti.elime as well.

In MkvsDC Raiden says to Kuai Liang "surely you are stronger than your brother." Many disputed that fact, but then on rolls MK9.

Bi-Han loses to Scorpion in the tournament and is subsequently killed.

Kuai Liang comes in and beats Scorpion in the second tournament. He then goes on later in the game to defeat Noob Saibot himself.

People have always tried to say that Bi-Han is more powerful than Kuai Liang, but I don't think NRS can do anything else to show that Kuai Liang is as powerful if not more powerful than Bi-Han.

Add on to that fact that Bi-Han followed orders from the Lin Kuei without question. Kuai Liang went on to not only disobey their orders, but he defeated the very thing he didn't want to become and took over the whole damn clan. It's Leader vs. Follower there.

You did make one good point though. Bi-Han is evil and half the internet has a hard on for evil characters so it's only natural that Bi-Han is the "superior" Sub-Zero to some people just for that very reason.

Kuai Liang only became more powerful in deception, when he had already become grandmaster

You forgot that Scorpion gets stronger the more time he spends in the netherrealm and that's where Bi-Han had fought him, same place where he also fought and defeated Shinnok.

What I'm saying is that until Deception, Bi han has the most impressive achievements. Being beat by his own brother I'll attribute to him being a spectre and his brother receiving some juicy implants.

If we're talking about further on in the story, Noob also co-leads the brotherhood of shadows with Quan chi but that's not really Bi-Han.

Overall, Kuai does become stronger but not in the current timeline. Waiting to see on MK10.

Edit: if you wanna compare cyber sub to normal Bi-han sub then cyber probably wins there.

 

[TaffyMeat]

All the most popular characters in the series have to return. There's a reason Scorpion was put in Injustice, it's because people love the ninjas. If they ever released an MK without Sub and Scorp in a RECOGNIZABLE form it would be death for the series due to many casuals not caring to buy it because their "boy" wasn't in it.

Sub Zero, Scorpion and Reptile will all return in some form. I'm just really hoping Ermac does, as well. What you will NOT see is Sub Zero, Cyber Sub Zero and Frost all in the same game. That would be stupid. Just get rid of the Cyber version all together and explain why he's not there somehow. And I really hope I don't see ANY of those stupid characters from the 3D games return. Shujinko, Dairou, Ashrah, Kobra....the list goes on and they all suck. There's plenty of good characters they could have in the game without wasting any spots on them.

Scorpion was not in MK3. Ashrah is cool. Forget the female Raiden look, she finds a holy sword and kicks demon oni ass. Reminds me of Onimusha.

 

[John Grizzly]

Scorpion was not in MK3. Ashrah is cool. Forget the female Raiden look, she finds a holy sword and kicks demon oni ass. Reminds me of Onimusha.

And people freaked out about Scorpion not being in it. He was added back in Ultimate. I honestly don't ever see them not putting Sub Zero and Scorpion in an MK game again.

And it's just my opinion about the 3D characters. I have zero desire to see Ashrah return.

 

[187x]

If my Ninja isn't in MK10 I wont buy it. Real shit.

He's one of the main/most known characters of the franchise he will be in the game

 

[187x]

@MKF30

Make frost the new "Subzero"...

Bi Han and Kuai Liang can make cameo appearances or something, but I think NRS should move on with the story and explore different avenues. I know in previous games they said Frost WAS NOT the Sub Bros sister (remember they officially do have a long lost sister out there), but what if she was related to them by being like their niece or something. I think that would be cool.

IMO, Frost embodies that old OG Sub feel (dark, brooding, cunning) which I like, but she could be something fresh and new at the same time.

godlike pic
frost <3

 

[Onilordasmodeus]

In deception Noob admits himself that Kuai Liang has become powerful saying he would have shown pride if he were still human.

Noob has to have Smoke in order to beat Sub-Zero on not one but two separate occassions in that ti.elime as well.

In MkvsDC Raiden says to Kuai Liang "surely you are stronger than your brother." Many disputed that fact, but then on rolls MK9.

Bi-Han loses to Scorpion in the tournament and is subsequently killed.

Kuai Liang comes in and beats Scorpion in the second tournament. He then goes on later in the game to defeat Noob Saibot himself.

People have always tried to say that Bi-Han is more powerful than Kuai Liang, but I don't think NRS can do anything else to show that Kuai Liang is as powerful if not more powerful than Bi-Han.

Add on to that fact that Bi-Han followed orders from the Lin Kuei without question. Kuai Liang went on to not only disobey their orders, but he defeated the very thing he didn't want to become and took over the whole damn clan. It's Leader vs. Follower there.

You did make one good point though. Bi-Han is evil and half the internet has a hard on for evil characters so it's only natural that Bi-Han is the "superior" Sub-Zero to some people just for that very reason.

In reality they are pretty much equal. Yeah Kuai does ultimately do a lot more that Bi Han over all, but Bi has still done something that Kuai hasn't matched...he defeated all four of the Elemental Gods of Earth, defeated Quan Chi 1v1, and out smarted Shinnok as well.

Also, one of your points was that Bi Han lost to Scorpion in tournament, well Bi Han defeated Scorpion at least 2 times before that, and Scorpion had to take Bi to the Netherrealm to ensure his victory, and as we all should know, Scorpion is stronger in the Netherrealm (where Bi Han defeated him once before as well).

Ultimately though, Kuai's claim to being stronger than Bi hinges on Raiden saying so, and various other conjecture (which is valid, I'm just pointing that out though), where as Bi Han has actual showings. Keep in mind too, that Bi Han as Noob Saibot was able to defeat Kuai Liang after he had become the Grandmaster of the Lin Kuei while he was holding the Dragon Medallion, so even at his strongest, Kuai could still loose to Bi. Like I originally said though, IMO they are essentially equal seeing as both have victories of the other at various times in the timeline. While Kuai may be more "powerful" than Bi, Bi has always been the more skillful and cunning of the two hands down.

 

[EarlyReflections]

The scenario of Bi-Han stripping apart from Noob seems likely. Remember the "classic Subzero" from MKT and some ports of UMK3? This thing kinda happened before, without any explanation of course..

EDIT: At this time they hadn't reveal that Noob is Bi-Han as I remember.

 

[TaffyMeat]

We've got it wrong. Title is... "How should Subzero come back." He should come back frozen - pun intended. Remember Sub froze Frost in the cryomancer temple? Maybe in alternate timeline Frost freezes Sub. Who would be Bi Han.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

I don't care if its freaking Billy Bob Thorton version

He better be Shredder Zero

that costume was so badass.

 

[MKF30]

godlike pic
frost <3

Yep. Here's the deal if Frost has a topless outfit, she can be the new Sub-Zero.

If not, GTFO and bring back Kuai Liang lol haha.

I don't care if its freaking Billy Bob Thorton version

He better be Shredder Zero

that costume was so badass.

I thought I was the only MK fan to like that look lol with the fuzzy thing on his shoulder lol.

 

[callMEcrazy]

Both Sub-zero and Noob Saibot should return in MK10. Subzero because he is the most popular MK character. Noob because he is not just a very popular character but has great importance to a nether realm based story line which MK10 will presumably have.

Personally I am more concerned about how Sub-zero looks. MK9 pretty much nailed most character designs but Sub-zero was one of the few exceptions. He just didn't look good and his moves didn't look good. Compare that to Noob who was right up there with the coolest looking characters of MK9. I would like to go back to the "Shredder" Sub-zero of MKD. It looked cool and didn't just look like a character only good for getting beat up. It was a slick design. The MK9 design is bulky and that could be why the creators felt compelled to make him a slow character. That's not how he should be IMO.

 

[MKF30]

Both Sub-zero and Noob Saibot should return in MK10. Subzero because he is the most popular MK character. Noob because he is not just a very popular character but has great importance to a nether realm based story line which MK10 will presumably have.

Personally I am more concerned about how Sub-zero looks. MK9 pretty much nailed most character designs but Sub-zero was one of the few exceptions. He just didn't look good and his moves didn't look good. Compare that to Noob who was right up there with the coolest looking characters of MK9. I would like to go back to the "Shredder" Sub-zero of MKD. It looked cool and didn't just look like a character only good for getting beat up. It was a slick design. The MK9 design is bulky and that could be why the creators felt compelled to make him a slow character. That's not how he should be IMO.

Uhh oh careful the Scorpion fanatics don't see that lol

But neat post

 

[TaffyMeat]

Subzero should return as a snowman like his mk3 friendship move

 

[MKF30]

lol snowman

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

if they redesigned ashrahs look... id be all about having her in mk10.

 

[revengeance]

Its either Kuai Liang or a new cryomancer to take up the name. I don't want Bi-Han!

 

[callMEcrazy]

Uhh oh careful the Scorpion fanatics don't see that lol

But neat post

What ? I myself like Scorpion more than Sub-zero, and no wonder with the stupid bulky Sub-zero designs. But I've seen too much over the years not to know which one is more popular. Hell there's an ice cream shop not far from my house named Sub-zero.

 

[MKF30]

What ? I myself like Scorpion more than Sub-zero, and no wonder with the stupid bulky Sub-zero designs. But I've seen too much over the years not to know which one is more popular. Hell there's an ice cream shop not far from my house named Sub-zero.

Bulky? I don't think the MK 9 Sub is bulky, unless you're maybe referring to the Cyber Sub which seems clunky. But the ninja? Hardly bulky, he's slender and should be faster.

I was kind of joking around with that comment btw, some Scorp/Sub fans take it more seriously and hate the other lol. I like both as characters equally but my fav ninja is Ermac, to me the ability to make someone's head explode with your mind or rip off limbs is far more badass then burning or freezing something but hey to each his own.

 

[callMEcrazy]

Bulky? I don't think the MK 9 Sub is bulky, unless you're maybe referring to the Cyber Sub which seems clunky. But the ninja? Hardly bulky, he's slender and should be faster.

I was kind of joking around with that comment btw, some Scorp/Sub fans take it more seriously and hate the other lol. I like both as characters equally but my fav ninja is Ermac, to me the ability to make someone's head explode with your mind or rip off limbs is far more badass then burning or freezing something but hey to each his own.

Hehe. I knew you were joking. I've seen how ugly the Scorpion vs Sub-zero fan wars get at times, so I knew what you were talking about. I was just showing my disappointment at Sub-zero's MK9 design, on which we disagree. Maybe bulky isn't the right word but he is certainly missing something. Lets say he is just not stylish or good looking, and that is a big deal for a character of Sub-zero's importance.

I'm a big admirer of Ermac myself. Noticed the avatar ?

 

[MKF30]

Hehe. I knew you were joking. I've seen how ugly the Scorpion vs Sub-zero fan wars get at times, so I knew what you were talking about. I was just showing my disappointment at Sub-zero's MK9 design, on which we disagree. Maybe bulky isn't the right word but he is certainly missing something. Lets say he is just not stylish or good looking, and that is a big deal for a character of Sub-zero's importance.

I'm a big admirer of Ermac myself. Noticed the avatar ?

lol ahh yes, at first I thought it was Tremor then Noob since he's very dark lol but the green eyes

Yeah lol I was a little surprised when I see a battle topic on say comicvine or other sites with "battle forums" pitting two characters against each other, a lot of scorp/sub fights lol people flaming each other over it lmao...

Hmm I see, was going to ask you also which costume per-se out of curiousity. Bi-Han's or Kuai Liangs I know some people felt the shredder Sub-Zero look was "too much" stuff on him but I kind of got used to it, I loved his MKDA older look. Thought that was cool with the Dragon Medallion. But yeah, to each his own. I liked Kuai Liang's design better then Bi-Han's personally but of course my overall fav is Ermac, just badass looking

 

[callMEcrazy]

lol ahh yes, at first I thought it was Tremor then Noob since he's very dark lol but the green eyes

Yeah lol I was a little surprised when I see a battle topic on say comicvine or other sites with "battle forums" pitting two characters against each other, a lot of scorp/sub fights lol people flaming each other over it lmao...

Hmm I see, was going to ask you also which costume per-se out of curiousity. Bi-Han's or Kuai Liangs I know some people felt the shredder Sub-Zero look was "too much" stuff on him but I kind of got used to it, I loved his MKDA older look. Thought that was cool with the Dragon Medallion. But yeah, to each his own. I liked Kuai Liang's design better then Bi-Han's personally but of course my overall fav is Ermac, just badass looking

If Noob Saibot is present in the cast then it only makes sense that Sub-Zero is Kuai Liang right ? Anyway this is the look that I like.

This look is too much ? Too much of what ?? Everything in MK in over the top. This is a slick and cool design and when you look at it you feel like this is a character you want to play with. Well at least I do anyway. I can't believe fans rejected this design for the stupid design they have now. I don't like the unmasked design either, sorry. But if they don't go back to the shredder design then they can do whatever they want with him.

 

[MKF30]

If Noob Saibot is present in the cast then it only makes sense that Sub-Zero is Kuai Liang right ? Anyway this is the look that I like.

This look is too much ? Too much of what ?? Everything in MK in over the top. This is a slick and cool design and when you look at it you feel like this is a character you want to play with. Well at least I do anyway. I can't believe fans rejected this design for the stupid design they have now. I don't like the unmasked design either, sorry. But if they don't go back to the shredder design then they can do whatever they want with him.

lol I like it too, I like most of Sub's looks. Some fans for some reason hated on it said "omg he looks like shredder wtf" but I think it's pretty badass plus, Shredder they forget has way more blades on him...the only similarity really is the helmet.

I dig the older unmasked, when he has grey hair to me it looks badass because the DM ages Sub-Zero yet amps his powers. So far I have to admit out of all the looks I wasn't too big on Cyber Sub, seemed clunky and I dont know, just prefer human sub better. I thought Smoke made a better cyber ninja personally. Or perhaps if they had to make Sub cyber, have him look different then Sektor and Cyrax meaning more partially cyber(not as much robot looking) kind of like that concept in MK Rebirth you see of him really fast, its like a bio mech mask attached to his face but you can still see his human face kind of merged with the metal.

 

[callMEcrazy]

lol I like it too, I like most of Sub's looks. Some fans for some reason hated on it said "omg he looks like shredder wtf" but I think it's pretty badass plus, Shredder they forget has way more blades on him...the only similarity really is the helmet.

I dig the older unmasked, when he has grey hair to me it looks badass because the DM ages Sub-Zero yet amps his powers. So far I have to admit out of all the looks I wasn't too big on Cyber Sub, seemed clunky and I dont know, just prefer human sub better. I thought Smoke made a better cyber ninja personally. Or perhaps if they had to make Sub cyber, have him look different then Sektor and Cyrax meaning more partially cyber(not as much robot looking) kind of like that concept in MK Rebirth you see of him really fast, its like a bio mech mask attached to his face but you can still see his human face kind of merged with the metal.

Well...even though I wasn't keen on having so many Sub-Zero(s) in the game (Sub, Cyber Sub, Noob), I can't say it was Cyber Sub's looks that I really hated. I actually liked it. I thought it looked better than Cyrax and almost on par with Sektor (I main Sektor so I could be partial ). I just thought his existence was unnecessary. I knew all Lin Kuei characters might eventually get cyber forms but I hoped they would keep Sub free of it.

Smoke definitely makes a better cyber ninja though, no doubt about that. I think they just wanted to develop Smoke a bit. Noob-Smoke did Smoke no favors. He lost a bit of identity maybe. So they used MK9 to bring it back somewhat. Noob-Smoke wasn't bad as a concept, but it was time for a change.

 

[MKF30]

Well...even though I wasn't keen on having so many Sub-Zero(s) in the game (Sub, Cyber Sub, Noob), I can't say it was Cyber Sub's looks that I really hated. I actually liked it. I thought it looked better than Cyrax and almost on par with Sektor (I main Sektor so I could be partial ). I just thought his existence was unnecessary. I knew all Lin Kuei characters might eventually get cyber forms but I hoped they would keep Sub free of it.

Smoke definitely makes a better cyber ninja though, no doubt about that. I think they just wanted to develop Smoke a bit. Noob-Smoke did Smoke no favors. He lost a bit of identity maybe. So they used MK9 to bring it back somewhat. Noob-Smoke wasn't bad as a concept, but it was time for a change.

Yeah I didn't "hate it" per-se, I just thought they could have made him look slimmer but it made sense since they turned them into cyborg ninjas. Example, to what I mean if you compare the original Cyber ninja classics(they were more slimmer, agile) vs. the MK 9 updated ones but as I said, I totally get why they did it modernized, updated etc.

I noticed Cyrax looked the slimmest of the 3, then Sub then Sektor(more bulky) Pretty much the reason why Sub got taken was cause Raiden interfered preventing Smoke so as soon as that happened I knew someone else was getting it lol. Yeah, I like how some things changed, while others remained the same.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

Yeah I didn't "hate it" per-se, I just thought they could have made him look slimmer but it made sense since they turned them into cyborg ninjas. Example, to what I mean if you compare the original Cyber ninja classics(they were more slimmer, agile) vs. the MK 9 updated ones but as I said, I totally get why they did it modernized, updated etc.

I noticed Cyrax looked the slimmest of the 3, then Sub then Sektor(more bulky) Pretty much the reason why Sub got taken was cause Raiden interfered preventing Smoke so as soon as that happened I knew someone else was getting it lol. Yeah, I like how some things changed, while others remained the same.

he actually wasn't any bigger

his stance made him look like a squatty bald dude.