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Video/Tutorial - Sub-Zero F'ING STUPID

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boba_buster

Noob saibot
dude holy shit


23 minutes.

I thought you were dropping sub for Hunter Predator before last evo? Or dropping him for Bo Rai Cho? Why do you insist on making video after video about how Sub Zero's stuff isn't consistent

please stop
Dude If you don't like it stay out the subzero forums , nobody is making u read or watch toms stuff, a lot of ppl actually appreciate the things tom post and the work he puts into them
 
Inconstistencies during combos and blockstrings affect every character in the game, not just sub-zero.

It's how it is, one of MK X problems that will never receive a fix. Hopefully MK XI will change this
I find this to be true also. I've had to sacrifice damage for consistantly with a lot of characters. Most recently with Tri-Borg Smoke variation.
 

Wigy

There it is...
Probably the dumbest post i've read this year. Bravo.
So 45% meterless loopable 50/50s that you can do very little against with some characters especially without meter on a character with excellent neutral is in keeping with balance. I guarantee if that this stuff was fixed sub would go up the tier list.

This is the main thing holding him back.

Sonic fox brady set was close in a hell of a lot sets with brady dropping shit tonnes of combos, almost definitely due to this. Would have been a hell of a lot closer if not brady winning without those 40% combo losses happening once or twice a game.

Only reason everyone isnt mad salty about his corner game is that its inconsistent.
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
I find this to be true also. I've had to sacrifice damage for consistantly with a lot of characters. Most recently with Tri-Borg Smoke variation.
Agreed but like tom points out its not jus sacrificing damage for consistency if it's still random weither or not the lower damage more consistent combo is going to connect anyway, at least smokes problems are consistent , I know when not to do certain things like b12 because I know when it will whiff crouch block etc etc
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
So 45% meterless loopable 50/50s that you can do very little against with some characters especially without meter on a character with excellent neutral is in keeping with balance. I guarantee if that this stuff was fixed sub would go up the tier list.

This is the main thing holding him back.

Sonic fox brady set was close in a hell of a lot sets with brady dropping shit tonnes of combos, almost definitely due to this. Would have been a hell of a lot closer if not brady winning without those 40% combo losses happening once or twice a game.

Only reason everyone isnt mad salty about his corner game is that its inconsistent.
Your not helping your case , you basically just admitted that tom out played fox and only lost because of sub zeros inconsistencies agains females.

I'm not saying that's my opinion. I'm not saying I disagree with it either , those were some good matches regardless of what the final score was
 

Wigy

There it is...
Your not helping your case , you basically just admitted that tom out played fox and only lost because of sub zeros inconsistencies agains females.

I'm not saying that's my opinion. I'm not saying I disagree with it either , those were some good matches regardless of what the final score was
I'm saying it was a possible outcome outcome if that were not the case.

So objectively, its a stupid accidental thing but given that subzero is already fairly high in the tier list and these bugs hurt him, it does act as a pseudo balance.

Dont get me wrong i dont think it should be there and its good but i think his corner game would need toned down without them. Think you're getting caught up in my wording
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
I'm saying it was a possible outcome outcome if that were not the case.

So objectively, its a stupid accidental thing but given that subzero is already fairly high in the tier list and these bugs hurt him, it does act as a pseudo balance.

Dont get me wrong i dont think it should be there and its good but i think his corner game would need toned down without them. Think you're getting caught up in my wording
I hear ya but even if it was consistent you wouldn't see them that much more because you give up a certain amount of safety to set up the shatter combos , and I don't see how it's a htb situation so anyone could go lab it up and be able to defend against it well, i would say it's pretty read based and not as scary as ppl make it out to be if they lab it up
 

Wigy

There it is...
I hear ya but even if it was consistent you wouldn't see them that much more because you give up a certain amount of safety to set up the shatter combos , and I don't see how it's a htb situation so anyone could go lab it up and be able to defend against it well, i would say it's pretty read based and not as scary as ppl make it out to be if they lab it up
Ive labbed it and certain characters have really limited options. Just cause there is ways out doesnt make the risk reward not horrible.

Dont think any character should be hitting high 40s in the corner honestly.
 
I'm saying it was a possible outcome outcome if that were not the case.

So objectively, its a stupid accidental thing but given that subzero is already fairly high in the tier list and these bugs hurt him, it does act as a pseudo balance.

Dont get me wrong i dont think it should be there and its good but i think his corner game would need toned down without them. Think you're getting caught up in my wording
Characters have corner games far worse and no one complains. And fairly high is a bit inaccurate, he's mid tier. Some small hit box characters completely shut SZ down even before this small collision issue. Then he cant even damage them when he hits them. However, you have no issue with those characters crushing SZ.


In no way am i saying this will be changed. Some characters just death match SZ. I guess it happens.... Im just saying that he DOES have death matches for some reasons such as this.
 

Wigy

There it is...
Characters have corner games far worse and no one complains. And fairly high is a bit inaccurate, he's mid tier. Some small hit box characters completely shut SZ down even before this small collision issue. Then he cant even damage them when he hits them. However, you have no issue with those characters crushing SZ.


In no way am i saying this will be changed. Some characters just death match SZ. I guess it happens.... Im just saying that he DOES have death matches for some reasons such as this.
Im curious; whos corner game would you say would be better than subs if these issues were fixed? Low/overhead armour break into 45% roughly meterles. Also grab combos
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
Im curious; whos corner game would you say would be better than subs if these issues were fixed? Low/overhead armour break into 45% roughly meterles. Also grab combos
Seriously? Try raiden Jax Jacqui ermac etc etc , hell look at a-lists corner game how can u even say that shit , plenty of characters can jail you in the corner , I hate being in the corner against d'whora
 

Wigy

There it is...
Seriously? Try raiden Jax Jacqui ermac etc etc , hell look at a-lists corner game how can u even say that shit , plenty of characters can jail you in the corner , I hate being in the corner against d'whora
Jax i'll give you. None of the others are vaguely close in my opinion.
 

JDM

Noob
Dude If you don't like it stay out the subzero forums , nobody is making u read or watch toms stuff, a lot of ppl actually appreciate the things tom post and the work he puts into them
Front page :V I appreciate the work he puts into this stuff, that's not it at all. But it's whining at this point. We all know Sub's combos are wonky in the corner, don't do the max damage stuff then, I'm sure there are more instances of this in the game that people aren't aware of.

I dont like Predator and SZ is better than BRC.
Seriously? I thought you loved Bo so much :/
 

boba_buster

Noob saibot
Front page :V I appreciate the work he puts into this stuff, that's not it at all. But it's whining at this point. We all know Sub's combos are wonky in the corner, don't do the max damage stuff then, I'm sure there are more instances of this in the game that people aren't aware of.



Seriously? I thought you loved Bo so much :/
The whole point of the video was that their is no more consistent alternative , it's not a matter of go for the lower damage easy one cuz it doesn't exist
 
Front page :V I appreciate the work he puts into this stuff, that's not it at all. But it's whining at this point. We all know Sub's combos are wonky in the corner, don't do the max damage stuff then, I'm sure there are more instances of this in the game that people aren't aware of.



Seriously? I thought you loved Bo so much :/
ehh thats 24-28%. thats fine unless its a stations where the chatterer crushes me in every way then i cant get any damage at all, even in the corner. Its dumb but its the game. Even more funny when is that when this happens its never "ugh.. bad mu. it happens". Its "Tom's dumb and sucks. level up brah".
 

STB Shujinkydink

Burning down in flames for kicks
ehh thats 24-28%. thats fine unless its a stations where the chatterer crushes me in every way then i cant get any damage at all, even in the corner. Its dumb but its the game. Even more funny when is that when this happens its never "ugh.. bad mu. it happens". Its "Tom's dumb and sucks. level up brah".
Why dont you just use Cryomancer for these MUs? Are those combos inconsitent as well?
 

Northern Slasher

Heads or Tails X
So 45% meterless loopable 50/50s that you can do very little against with some characters especially without meter on a character with excellent neutral is in keeping with balance. I guarantee if that this stuff was fixed sub would go up the tier list.

This is the main thing holding him back.

Sonic fox brady set was close in a hell of a lot sets with brady dropping shit tonnes of combos, almost definitely due to this. Would have been a hell of a lot closer if not brady winning without those 40% combo losses happening once or twice a game.

Only reason everyone isnt mad salty about his corner game is that its inconsistent.
45% meterless loopable? The only way to achieve that is with a clone burst, and that's not just automatic. It has to be set at the proper distance in order to combo it and nobody is going to let you do that over and over again.
 
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