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Emperor Jupiter wins Injustice: Gods Among Us at Apex 2014!

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Kombatant
I mean can't we just say Jupiter is just really good? Instead of his character. I mean Rico did reset the bracket if hadn't been sent to losers he would have won. Plus Jupiter hella adapted on the fly. Let's not pretend Mmh doesn't have a bunch of 5-5s. So it really means nothing about the character. It means someone got outplayed.
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
I mean can't we just say Jupiter is just really good? Instead of his character. I mean Rico did reset the bracket if hadn't been sent to losers he would have won. Plus Jupiter hella adapted on the fly. Let's not pretend Mmh doesn't have a bunch of 5-5s. So it really means nothing about the character. It means someone got outplayed.
I don't know why anyone should ever be scared of saying a certain character is stronger than most of the cast at a particular patch point in a games life.

It was predicted as soon as the 1.6 patch notes were released; I don't know why people are trying to deny it now.

The logic went like this:
Jupiter loses at NEC = Everyone uses this as an excuse to downplay MMH rather than Jupiter
Jupiter wins at APEX with REO 3rd = It's just Jupiter and has nothing to do with the character -- and also, it's just REO (or ignore REO) even though REO explained in clear terms exactly why MMH was so big of a threat.

So basically MMH has it pretty rough in public opinion either way, haha
 
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DarkPage

Kombatant
I don't know why anyone should ever be scared of saying a certain character is stronger than most of the cast at a particular patch point in a games life.

It was predicted as soon as the 1.6 patch notes were released; I don't know why people are trying to deny it now.
Not sure if your saying I'm denying it, everyone knows he's a good character but there's a lot of good characters. And good players with good characters in supposed 5-5 match ups just means somebody is just a better player.

And if that's not what your talking about then please disregard lol
 
Again when I made some statements about him I overreacted making him seem unbeatable and he's very beatable but I also was asked where is my proof of how good he is. I said give it some time and the time is now .
You know I think it's pretty clear at this point where the disconnect happened between people. The problem is: people started calling this character the "Kabal" of injustice.
Here's the thing though.....upon reflection of the KCP podcast and most of Reo's posts, the main idea he kept pushing in all those was: "Manhunter has no bad matchups". To him, a guy who played Kabal, that probably makes the character the Kabal of injustice.

To everyone else though....thats a loaded word that carries connotations that go beyond simply being top tier. Now mind you, I barley followed competitive MK after the first Evo and didn't see an entire tournament again until Evo 2013 when I was more interested in the injustice finals......and even *I* understand what being the "Kabal" of Injustice means to a lot of people. Hell, my Bane shirt design I made is him pulling a Nightfall on Kabal's back for just that reason.

It doesn't just simply mean that he goes even or better with every member of the cast (which MMH probably does). It doesn't just mean that he's the best character in the game (which he probably still is).
When people hear "the Kabal of...*insert game*" they imagine a a character with tools that allow him to basically run roughshot over every single member of the cast and there's little to no options to deal with his BS except just sit there and take it, and wait/pray for your opponent to drop something or screw up and hope they do it enough times that you can actually take 2 games before they warm up and destroy you. Maybe one day that character exists in the game, and it may even be Manhunter....but as of right now that is not the level on which he can be played.
He can be fought and defeated if you outplay your opponent....he just has reaaaally good tools.
 
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CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Not sure if your saying I'm denying it, everyone knows he's a good character but there's a lot of good characters. And good players with good characters in supposed 5-5 match ups just means somebody is just a better player.

And if that's not what your talking about then please disregard lol
There are a lot of good characters. Grundy is good, Zod is good, WW is good etc.

But if you're calling MMH "just another good character" I'm not sure I agree.

I don't think he's Kabal, either -- but people should be realistic.
 

DarkPage

Kombatant
There are a lot of good characters. Grundy is good, Zod is good, WW is good etc.

But if you're calling MMH "just another good character" I'm not sure I agree.

I don't think he's Kabal, either -- but people should be realistic.
Well all I'm really tryna say is players should get more credit or even discredit, over who they play, like example I've seen a lot of people say WW - MMH is 5-5 (no need to argue this it's just an example)

So if a Martian beats a Diana then it shouldn't be like "oh Martian is broke" it should that that WW got outplayed you know?
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Well all I'm really tryna say is players should get more credit or even discredit, over who they play, like example I've seen a lot of people say WW - MMH is 5-5 (no need to argue this it's just an example)

So if a Martian beats a Diana then it shouldn't be like "oh Martian is broke" it should that that WW got outplayed you know?
And as for matchups -- I don't think anyone has an authoritative MU chart for him yet. Clearly things are changing by the week. Remember, 'a lot of people' also said WW was close to the best character in the game prepatch and would be near-broken postpatch due to not receiving any nerfs.

So I wouldn't put much stock in somebody saying "this matchup is 5-5" in November 2013 or whatever and holding it forever like that's the gospel truth. I think there's still much to learn and explore..

Doesn't mean it's wrong, but I wouldn't take any matchups as set in stone yet.
 
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JTB123

>>R2 - BF4 = Unblockable.
Congrats to @HazeJupiter for taking the tourney, I find MMH very entertaining to watch.

Also Rico really impressed me with Black Adam, when he's on point he is a machine. His set with Reo was awesome, very methodical play from both players.
 

AU_IM_DIGIMON

Kombatant
You SPECIFICALLY said SMASH - "IRRELEVANT ASS GAME" LOL.

Apex is NOT the smash communities only major. There's Genesis too. And I'm sure there's two more. I can't think of them. Besides MK community has zero. Stand alone anyway. So yeah.

What makes Apex stand out is that they actually run other fighting games there too.
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
You SPECIFICALLY said SMASH - "IRRELEVANT ASS GAME" LOL.

Apex is NOT the smash communities only major. There's Genesis too. And I'm sure there's two more. I can't think of them. Besides MK community has zero. Stand alone anyway. So yeah.

What makes Apex stand out is that they actually run other fighting games there too.
Other one is Pound I think

Edit: Just to play devils advocate Stately Wayne Manor is the first NRS only major.
 

Jer

I'm a literal Sloth
You SPECIFICALLY said SMASH - "IRRELEVANT ASS GAME" LOL.

Apex is NOT the smash communities only major. There's Genesis too. And I'm sure there's two more. I can't think of them. Besides MK community has zero. Stand alone anyway. So yeah.

What makes Apex stand out is that they actually run other fighting games there too.

Pound, Rom, Zenith.
 

trufenix

bye felicia
I don't think he's Kabal, either -- but people should be realistic.
Realistic is that MMH is no boogeyman. Realistic is that MMH is working just as hard to win as Aquaman, Batman, Zod, WW, Bane, Zatanna, Frost, Black Adam and all the other top 5s in the game despite the fact he's got two specialists in the driver's seat. People want to say MMH is S tier (or just better than the rest) because he looks good on paper and REO said so, but when the same gets said about WW we just laugh Foxy back into irrelevance. I don't know why we can't get there on this MMH thing. REO and Jupiter (two really good players who have been dedicated to him for months) duking it out in the Apex finals doesn't prove anything, unless you'd also accept that Grr v. Max or Theo v. KDZ or Rico v. DragonGod GF at a real actual major (all very likely if they travel) is also some kind of proof.

The MMH bandwagon has shifted gears to "he needs time" because when solid guys at all the locals picked up the martian they didn't just win (Edit: Or because somebody they know who is really good with MMH but doesn't tournament / travel blows them up). If 6 months isn't long enough for an S Tier butterfly to emerge from its cocoon or at least give some sign of taking over, it ain't happening. No S tier character in the history of S tier characters has needed that kinda time unless it required an exploit or an infinite to get there and if that's what Pig is talking about, then everybody in Injustice "needs time" because we all know how NRS games are.
 
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CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Realistic is that MMH is no boogeyman. Realistic is that MMH is working just as hard to win as Aquaman, Batman, Zod, WW, Bane, Zatanna, Frost, Black Adam and all the other top 5s in the game despite the fact he's got two specialists in the driver's seat. People want to say MMH is S tier (or just better than the rest) because he looks good on paper and REO said so, but when the same gets said about WW we just laugh Foxy back into irrelevance. I don't know why we can't get there on this MMH thing. REO and Jupiter (two really good players who have been dedicated to him for months) duking it out in the Apex finals doesn't prove anything, unless you'd also accept that Grr v. Max or Theo v. KDZ or Rico v. DragonGod GF at a real actual major (all very likely if they travel) is also some kind of proof.

The MMH bandwagon has shifted gears to "he needs time" because when solid guys at all the locals picked up the martian they didn't just win. If 6 months isn't long enough for an S Tier butterfly to emerge from its cocoon or at least give some sign of taking over, it ain't happening. No S tier character in the history of S tier characters has needed that kinda time unless it required an exploit or an infinite to get there and if that's what Pig is talking about, then everybody in Injustice "needs time" because we all know how NRS games are.
So many misconceptions here:

-People aren't 'laughing f0xy into irrelevance'. People have been playing against him this entire time, and they simply aren't having the kinds of issues vs. him that they were early in the game's life. This isn't to say that WW isn't a good character, but look at her results.

People have been overrating WW for a long time, and just because someone declared her to be absolute top-level doesn't mean that she is.

-Proof of MMH as a serious threat did not start with APEX and won't end there.

-As far as 'No S tier character has ever needed time', again this is completely untrue. In MK9, Kenshi took months and months to reach the level where he was widely feared. In Injustice, even Superman took some months to reach the level he was at by EVO. Sonya was never a day-1 tournament winner and it took a lot of development for her to become what she was in later years.

It was practically August when MMH was released and that means that at this point he's been out for less than 6 months, and for a higher-execution character that's not very much time at all. This is doubly true for DLC characters, which not everyone buys Day 1.

Add to this that the 1.6 patch in which MMH fared well was in October.

-Grr and Maxintensity are indeed proof and they've shown that Bane is a viable Top 8 character now when he was widely considered to be the laughingstock of Injustice. I don't know what you were going for here, but those results speak for themselves.

-Equating Killer Frost to MMH is borderline ludicrous and I'll just leave it there.

I'll say again that MMH is def. not Kabal. But people seem to be living in denial about how good of a character he really is.
 
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RIF

Apprentice
-Grr and Maxintensity are indeed proof and they've shown that Bane is a viable Top 8 character now when he was widely considered to be the laughingstock of Injustice. I don't know what you were going for here, but those results speak for themselves.
No one has considered Bane low-tier for quite some time. He is NOT the same character that he was when he was initially released. It's doubtful Bane would be doing as well today without the plethora of buffs he received in numerous patches.

The point about Jupiter's placement at NEC as an indicator of MMH's tier rank is dubious at best. This game is all about match-ups. If a player does not have the requisite experience against a character, they will struggle. The PLAYER will lose, not the CHARACTER. In time, everyone will know where characters stand. Claiming that 'X' character isn't as good as advertised because a player failed to make it out of pools is silly. Flash wasn't in top 8 at NEC, DTN, OR Apex. Are we going to claim that character as overrated as well?
 

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
Flash wasn't in top 8 at NEC, DTN, OR Apex. Are we going to claim that character as overrated as well?
Flash has been overrated almost since Injustice was released.

Someone declared he was Top 5 and everyone else just followed along. Then after he was buffed people declared he was broken and everyone followed that too..

While he's still a good character, he's not what he was claimed to be.
 

EMPEROR_JUPITER

Your ego betrays you.
a couple shoutouts to people that showed me support. @LanceMonsoon . hes my brother and he was the one that came up to me after rico had reset the bracket, his calm words made me forget about the big stage behind me. shoutout to @RunwayMafia . (he knows why lol). and shoutout to @EMPEROR_OF_OUTWORLD . who was literatly texting me during top 8, even though he couldnt make it to cheer me on in person. he was doing it behind to phone
 

xInfra Deadx

Gimmick stolen by Jordan Peele
Flash has been overrated almost since Injustice was released.

Someone declared he was Top 5 and everyone else just followed along. Then after he was buffed people declared he was broken and everyone followed that too..

While he's still a good character, he's not what he was claimed to be.
The character isn't overrated, the players that have showcased him so far, are. I still believe he's a top 5 character, but so far he's getting the Sonya treatment.
 

RIF

Apprentice
Flash has been overrated almost since Injustice was released.

Someone declared he was Top 5 and everyone else just followed along. Then after he was buffed people declared he was broken and everyone followed that too..

While he's still a good character, he's not what he was claimed to be.
Says who? You? The character has ALL of the tools, damage, and gimmicks to be in the top 5 conversation. It's WAY too early to claim Flash is overrated. Stop.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Realistic is that MMH is no boogeyman. Realistic is that MMH is working just as hard to win as Aquaman, Batman, Zod, WW, Bane, Zatanna, Frost, Black Adam and all the other top 5s in the game despite the fact he's got two specialists in the driver's seat. People want to say MMH is S tier (or just better than the rest) because he looks good on paper and REO said so, but when the same gets said about WW we just laugh Foxy back into irrelevance. I don't know why we can't get there on this MMH thing. REO and Jupiter (two really good players who have been dedicated to him for months) duking it out in the Apex finals doesn't prove anything, unless you'd also accept that Grr v. Max or Theo v. KDZ or Rico v. DragonGod GF at a real actual major (all very likely if they travel) is also some kind of proof.

The MMH bandwagon has shifted gears to "he needs time" because when solid guys at all the locals picked up the martian they didn't just win (Edit: Or because somebody they know who is really good with MMH but doesn't tournament / travel blows them up). If 6 months isn't long enough for an S Tier butterfly to emerge from its cocoon or at least give some sign of taking over, it ain't happening. No S tier character in the history of S tier characters has needed that kinda time unless it required an exploit or an infinite to get there and if that's what Pig is talking about, then everybody in Injustice "needs time" because we all know how NRS games are.
If u think Aquaman and MMH have same learning curve we have a problem
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Flash has been overrated almost since Injustice was released.

Someone declared he was Top 5 and everyone else just followed along. Then after he was buffed people declared he was broken and everyone followed that too..

While he's still a good character, he's not what he was claimed to be.