Early Top 5 thoughts from Sonic Fox

[Rude]

Hate to add to the list of people asking why Robin is rated so high, but I'm curious. All I heard was he was trash, now he's top 10? I don't think an explanation to the placement is too much to ask.

Remember, the Robin community is comprised of former Nightwing players i.e. downplayers

 

[EMPRESS_SunFire]

Also I am not a Robin player nor have the best experience with him but I don't get why it's that hard to think he is that good, at least on paper he has amazing tools.

- One of the best neutral games
- Safety
- A good wake-up
- Damage
- Oki set-ups
- Legit safe (I'm sure they are safe but if I am wrong, my bad) mix-ups with his trait
- a 6-7 frame mid that is safe on block, can be combo'd into a special and it's probably hit-confirmable... I'm talking about his D12 and I think it's hit-confirmable because Wonder Woman's is.
- Godlike anti-air
- A restand that even tho it's just slightly plus on hit... I'm sure it's useful to negate certain wake-ups he might struggle with

 

[Nexallus]

Robin's pretty good, but his bad MU's are SUPER bad and we have been grinding them for weeks to figure out how to make them more even. Harley and Batman are some of his worst MU's for example.

Also keep in mind that tier lists are supposed to be based on the number of winning MU's and not just how solid a character is.

However, whether Robin is top 10 or not is still beyond me simply because it is too early (we're still learning and grinding).

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

So few people play green arrow he doesnt even appear on tier lists.

Uh he's on there

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Pretty good list besides putting blue beetle with GL and bane

Uhhhh remember later u told me this

Gl beetle bane will show u

Bane I could be wrong

 

[Tweedy]

Literally the only argument I see for Green Lantern being bad, is "he was nerfed from the first game".

Please look at Aquaman, Superman, Catwoman, etc? Idk how Black Adam was in the first game but i'm sure he was somehow better too. That game was different. A character can be nerfed and still be better.

Superman legit got shredded by nerfs and is still great.

 

[Tweedy]

Hate to add to the list of people asking why Robin is rated so high, but I'm curious. All I heard was he was trash, now he's top 10? I don't think an explanation to the placement is too much to ask.

It's just tymers who couldn't get around zoning with Kung Lao or Catwoman so they think that Robin loses to each zoner. Reality is that Hayatei took hella deadshot scalps at Combo Breaker. He clearly doesn't just automatically lose because of zoning, and that's really his only issue.

Edit: After Hayatei got top 8, some guy made a status legit lying about holes that Robin has. When I exposed him on his false info he was like "this is why people post on discord tym so cancer". It's just a bunch of edgelords downplaying.

 

[Rip Torn]

Robin is like Cheetah, but with actual range, a projectile, and a safe DP.

So basically Robin is nothing like Cheetah?

 

[9_Lives]

Literally the only argument I see for Green Lantern being bad, is "he was nerfed from the first game".

Please look at Aquaman, Superman, Catwoman, etc? Idk how Black Adam was in the first game but i'm sure he was somehow better too. That game was different. A character can be nerfed and still be better.

Superman legit got shredded by nerfs and is still great.

You make a good point about most of those legacy characters, but I feel like GL's changes made an already average character slightly worse. You can read my admittedly scrub lyfe opinion in the spoiler if you want.

Spoiler

GL isn't really terrible or anything, but a lot of people don't know that pretty much every single mixup he has off of trait, ex lift and 223 can easily be avoided with delayed getup, which I don't remember being present in i1. And when you strip that away, his damage, even with active trait and a bar, very rarely breaks 400.

His zoning is pretty subpar, especially since his air projectile only goes horizontally now instead of downward, and that means a lot when 3 of his special moves are zoning tools. He gives some of the dedicated rushdown characters problems, but he really struggles at full screen against anyone with a projectile faster than his. And he doesn't exactly have great mobility to compensate for this.

His 1 invulnerable wakeup can easily be stuffed when timed right, but it does pretty well against neutral jump mixups, so it's not completely useless.

While he has really good neutral tools, you can actually use his best string, b13, against him since there is a gap between the two hits large enough for a d1 or in some cases a backdash and full punish.

Tl;dr he's pretty good, but even if he didn't rely on gimmicky set play for significant damage, there is currently little reason to put him in top 5 or imo even top 10 in comparison to most characters listed. Although I'm no expert gl so I would take my opinion with a grain of salt.

 

[jackempty0]

Wait why the hell is Robin up there? What does he do that makes him a top 10 by arguably the best NrS player to date? Everything else I can see pretty decently

what do you mean arguably? there is no argument.

 

[Tweedy]

@SaltShaker I don't think Robin is top 10 tbh tho I just think he's downplayed on here. I'd personally have Catwoman and Harley on there instead of him.

 

[hayatei]

robin is like mid tier/low mid tier has a lot of losing match ups overall and doesn't really win anything hard unlike some of the top chars.

im 100% open to being proved wrong but right now i feel like when the match up is played at a high level he has nearly no mix ups potential and loses neutral against a lot of chars

 

[hayatei]

It's just tymers who couldn't get around zoning with Kung Lao or Catwoman so they think that Robin loses to each zoner. Reality is that Hayatei took hella deadshot scalps at Combo Breaker. He clearly doesn't just automatically lose because of zoning, and that's really his only issue.

Edit: After Hayatei got top 8, some guy made a status legit lying about holes that Robin has. When I exposed him on his false info he was like "this is why people post on discord tym so cancer". It's just a bunch of edgelords downplaying.

the robin gets zoned out thing is a BILL. the only characters i get zoned out by atm are green arrow and dr fate. everyone one else feels like I can get in just fine. batman also zones you out but you don't take any dmg from it so i won't include it since it's a different kind of neutral

 

[Tweedy]

the robin gets zoned out thing is a BILL. the only characters i get zoned out by atm are green arrow and dr fate. everyone one else feels like I can get in just fine. batman also zones you out but you don't take any dmg from it so i won't include it since it's a different kind of neutral

What about Harley?

 

[hayatei]

What about Harley?

she kinda zones you but she's weak to mb roll imo

 

[ImperatrixSindel]

I am a little surprised to see Ivy in so many people's top 10 lists. I think she's good, for sure, but I think Dragon may be skewing opinions.

 

[Basic Stupidity]

Uhhhh remember later u told me this

Gl beetle bane will show u

Bane I could be wrong

Yea maybe when blue beetle gets buffed.

 

[Shaka]

Sonic Fox just named all the the zoners basically. Y'all can thank him once your favorite character gets nerfed bad. This games makes no sense to have the most unwinnable matchups than any other fighting game out now. That's why injustice dies too quick

lol MK9 Kabal vs Jade, Kenshi vs Jade, Kabal vs everyone. what are you on kid?

 

[Tweedy]

You make a good point about most of those legacy characters, but I feel like GL's changes made an already average character slightly worse. You can read my admittedly scrub lyfe opinion in the spoiler if you want.

Spoiler

GL isn't really terrible or anything, but a lot of people don't know that pretty much every single mixup he has off of trait, ex lift and 223 can easily be avoided with delayed getup, which I don't remember being present in i1. And when you strip that away, his damage, even with active trait and a bar, very rarely breaks 400.

His zoning is pretty subpar, especially since his air projectile only goes horizontally now instead of downward, and that means a lot when 3 of his special moves are zoning tools. He gives some of the dedicated rushdown characters problems, but he really struggles at full screen against anyone with a projectile faster than his. And he doesn't exactly have great mobility to compensate for this.

His 1 invulnerable wakeup can easily be stuffed when timed right, but it does pretty well against neutral jump mixups, so it's not completely useless.

While he has really good neutral tools, you can actually use his best string, b13, against him since there is a gap between the two hits large enough for a d1 or in some cases a backdash and full punish.

Tl;dr he's pretty good, but even if he didn't rely on gimmicky set play for significant damage, there is currently little reason to put him in top 5 or imo even top 10 in comparison to most characters listed. Although I'm no expert gl so I would take my opinion with a grain of salt.

His zoning isn't amazing you're right. It does allow him to play lame with a life lead, though. His b13 has a big gap but i'd be concerned if it didn't. It's hit confirmable off of an amazing 9 frame advancing low. No mention of his jump 1? I think it's one of the better jump ins in Injustice 2.

If they use delay wake up, you can read that and mix them. Pretty much all characters are gonna have to deal with no delay or delay wake up, it's how it was in MKX. If you wanted to mix with Alien who was super broke, and you were wrong on how they were getting up, you'd lose your turn or even get punished. It being in this game and not in the first is not really relevant. We're comparing him to the rest of the I2 cast, not the first game's cast.

His damage is definitely lower than others for sure. That's honestly the biggest point I've gathered from any Green Lantern player mentioning his weaknesses. While his zoning isn't amazing it's pretty good considering the rest of his tools. Besides his damage it really just seems like you guys are comparing him to a ghost aka the Inj 1 cast.

 

[SaSSolino]

I know that Black Adam's damage needs to be nerfed, but he can't be better than characters like Aquaman, Deadshot, Batman or Superman without a way to open an opponent up.

Perhaps it's just me, but I'd rather fight an Adam than most of the characters in this list.

Not sure what Darksied's doing up there either.

Swap Darkseid with Superman 100%, and really not sold on the Bane placing either.

Bane's fine where he is imo

 

[Tweedy]

I know that Black Adam's damage needs to be nerfed, but he can't be better than characters like Aquaman, Deadshot, Batman or Superman without a way to open an opponent up.

Perhaps it's just me, but I'd rather fight an Adam than most of the characters in this list.

Not sure what Darksied's doing up there either.

If you block a trait cancel you're holding 9-12% chip and he's anywhere from +8-+24. If he throws you that's only 12% yeah, but you're still eating 9% from his trait so it's like a 19-21% throw. If he happens to open you up, you know the result of that. Superman has no mix ups as well(outside of the corner, Adam has them there too tho) and does nothing for chip even with trait on.

Sasolino I know you're just downplaying and you have an agenda. I'm just posting this so less informed players will know that you're being deceiving.

Black Adam trait frame data. Keep in mind his trait automatically does 9% unblockable for shits and gigs and basically all of these that good Adam's use are hit confirmable.

 

[Fred Marvel]

Literally the only argument I see for Green Lantern being bad, is "he was nerfed from the first game".

Please look at Aquaman, Superman, Catwoman, etc? Idk how Black Adam was in the first game but i'm sure he was somehow better too. That game was different. A character can be nerfed and still be better.

Superman legit got shredded by nerfs and is still great.

what? GL is bad because he does really low damage especially off bnb's, has no wakeup at all, still is completely free to zoning, has weak mid range space control now which was what he excelled at in the first game. also his best tools like minigun and oa's rocket were removed and lanterns might was severely nerfed. basically whats the argument that he's good? i guarantee once people learn the matchup he wont be shit. i get away with things like b13 close lantern all the time but its full combo punishable. any setups he has on knockdown you can just delay wakeup, his zoning is only good against characters who dont or cant zone. they didnt address his issues from the first game and gave him new issues. thats how he's bad.

Superman was hardly touched (universal changes like it costing a bar for him to combo off low scoop now arent nerfs)Aquaman was tweaked but i wouldnt say nerfed he got buffs too, same with batman and black adam was buffed i cant think of any nerfs. Catwoman was heavily buffed so i really dont see where youre going with this

 

[CrimsonShadow]

I am happy to see @Tweedy challenging the status quo in this thread.

In general, "I have a few bad matchups so my character isn't good" and "I have to get through zoning so my character isn't good" are two of the biggest bills sold in Injustice 2.

But in general, these wildly divergent opinions show that we don't collectively know as much as we think we do right now.

 

[LaidbackOne]

I know that Black Adam's damage needs to be nerfed, but he can't be better than characters like Aquaman, Deadshot, Batman or Superman without a way to open an opponent up.

Perhaps it's just me, but I'd rather fight an Adam than most of the characters in this list.

Not sure what Darksied's doing up there either.



Bane's fine where he is imo

Adam is definitely better than Superman atm.

 

[EMPRESS_SunFire]

what? GL is bad because he does really low damage especially off bnb's, has no wakeup at all, still is completely free to zoning, has weak mid range space control now which was what he excelled at in the first game. also his best tools like minigun and oa's rocket were removed and lanterns might was severely nerfed. basically whats the argument that he's good? i guarantee once people learn the matchup he wont be shit. i get away with things like b13 close lantern all the time but its full combo punishable. any setups he has on knockdown you can just delay wakeup, his zoning is only good against characters who dont or cant zone. they didnt address his issues from the first game and gave him new issues. thats how he's bad.

Superman was hardly touched (universal changes like it costing a bar for him to combo off low scoop now arent nerfs)Aquaman was tweaked but i wouldnt say nerfed he got buffs too, same with batman and black adam was buffed i cant think of any nerfs. Catwoman was heavily buffed so i really dont see where youre going with this

The problem is that you are still comparing him to his IGAU version like... Just let it go! Yeah, he lost his tools or whatever but he gained a lot of stuff as well, maybe if you focus on doing well with this GL instead of being melancholic about it you will realize he is not a bad character at all.

Everyone has to deal with delayed wake-ups... That would be like me saying Cheetah's oki is a bill because you can just delay wake-up but it's really not, there are ways around it and it's all about reading what your oponent is going to do.
His damage being low is a weakness but he actually has meterless damage which most of the characters in this game lack so I don't think it's all that bad.

His B13 doesn't have a gap at max range which as far as I know... It's where you wanna throw it out, not to mention the gap inbetween B13 and bomb is a bill since you don't really HAVE to cancel the string into it, it's not like B13 is unsafe or anything, you should confirm it.
He has plus frames off hit-confirmable strings as well.