SaltShaker
In Zoning We Trust
Forever King, the man himself, became a loyalist with Batman. That should be all the proof needed to know he has no bad MUs.
Forever King, the man himself, became a loyalist with Batman. That should be all the proof needed to know he has no bad MUs.
I know you're probably joking, but he does.
I have seen Batman players lose to many of the characters mentioned as bad matchups (Deadshot, Harley, Red Hood, Green Arrow, etc.) but I have never seen the matches go badly enough for me to think "Damn, I hope this Batman player has a good pocket ____________ (insert appropriate counter-pick)". On the flip-side I find myself thinking that for just about every other character in the game when it's obvious that one of the players is losing at the character select screen rather than in the match itself (even more frustrating when the losing player is too stubborn to acknowledge this fact).
I am not joking. Batman downplayers claim that Harley is a bad mu for Batman. Foreverking mopped Biohazard in Viennality. They claim Deadshot is a bad MU. This is debatable foreverking was doing good vs foxy so it actually may be a 5-5.
I think this is a fair. I don't think Batman has any 3-7 MUs. He does have a few 4-6s though. He can compete against the whole cast, but nothing wrong with picking someone up to have an even or favorable MU against them.
For sure he doesn't have any 3-7 matchups. I was also kind of getting at that I don't really think he has any 4-6s either as that's where you'd usually start seeing counterpicks (especially if a bad matchup happens to be a popular character in general) happen and that hasn't really been the case. Having to approach a matchup differently than usual =/= bad matchup.
Perhaps well just disagree about Batman's 4-6s. That discussion is for a different thread.
I do agree with this. For example, I think strategies for approaching Harley and Darkseid are similar, but I think Harley is 4-6 and Darkseid is 5-5. Navigating through zoning doesn't necessarily make it a 4-6 MU for Batman. Its more than just "having to approach a MU differently than usual".
Watching me play in all these tournaments might make it seem like has doesn't have any bad matchups, but he actually does. Red Hood, Green Arrow and Deadshot are for sure losing matchups. Then there are a few maybes like Harley Aquaman Catwoman
Without seeing you roll through tourneys like a boss with him, I would have never picked Batman; you are the source of inspiration which pushes us to replay our losing matchups.
Beating people in bad mus doesnt mean the mu suddenly changes, its not unwinnable. He doesnt have any 7-3s at all, but to say he doesnt lose to anybody when aquaman, harley and green arrow exist is a lie. I love the character, and hes top 3(contender for best character) in the game so I know hes strong, but he loses matchups. That is fact.
Maybe King is just better than the people he plays. I think Batman is busted btw, this isn't downplaying. A 4-6 MU is still very winnable, it doesn't mean it isn't losing though.
I think each character should have their own thread about this topic similar to how most characters have dedicated combo and MU threads. Unfortunately the dialog has shifted because any discussion of potential bad MUs for Batman brings in a lot of people wanting to "discuss" that.
Honestly you're right, I'll move it back.
