Balance Change Council

[Chongo]

Reptile buffs- 9 frame standing 1, 10 frame standing 2, 6 frame d1 and a 7 frame d3.
Reptile nerfs- ED is -20 on block, AH is now -5 on block, EX FB's are - on block.

My wishlist.

 

[ShadowBeatz]

so Mileenas roll, rains 3, nut punch should be low
and cartwheel should bee overhead < lol
But for real NW needs its

....I was just getting over all the CreepyPasta I read and now I'm imagining fighting Cage with a low-hitting nut punch. THANKS I DIDN'T NEED SLEEP ANYWAY

 

[THTB]

Reptile buffs- 9 frame standing 1, 10 frame standing 2, 6 frame d1 and a 7 frame d3.
Reptile nerfs- ED is -20 on block, AH is now -4 on block, EX FB's are - on block.

My wishlist.

Acid hand is already -4. And he needs the +frames he can get. No need for speeding up his normals, it's fine.

Instead of any of those changes, excluding the dash nerf, FB comes out in 25 frames (generally to help with his AA game), and EX slide first hit launch trajectory altered so that it will not miss on the second hit.

 

[Chongo]

Acid hand is already -4. And he needs the +frames he can get. No need for speeding up his normals, it's fine.

Instead of any of those changes, excluding the dash nerf, FB comes out in 25 frames (generally to help with his AA game), and EX slide first hit launch trajectory altered so that it will not miss on the second hit.

I meant to type -5, that was my bad.

 

[RunwayMafia]

Super armor distributed evenly amongst ALL characters.

 

[Big Pampering]

thE main characters that need to be addressed are imo: subzero, scorpion, kabal, kenshi, jax, raiden, mileena, noob.

scorpion needs more options that are safe and solid:

- 8 frame d4, why not subzero has it? it doesnt give advantage anyway and it give him a good safe footsie tool because he can cancel into takedown.
- f3 not fuzzy guardable and +5 on hit so it grants a free 334 blockstring
- hellfire is 9% and 5 frames better recovery.
- d3 is neutral on hit
- standing 1 is 9 frames

subzero:

- give ground freeze a use
- ^5% buff on bnb's
- ex freeze has 1 hit of armor like kabals ex dash.
- old 22 back
- b2 becomes legit guessing game with good enough reward

kabal:

- ex dash is not cancelable
- hooksword and buzzsaw are minus enough to grant blockstring.
- standing 2 is no block infinite
- less meter building on gas blast

kenshi:

ex sc is 0 on block

jax: f41 does not whiff but is -2 on block, 5% buff on midscreen bnb's

raiden:

- strings are not interruptable, and are neutral on block.
- d4 is better like regular d4
- superman is 8 frames again
- vicinity blast hits mid except for low hitboxes

mileena:

- hitbox needs to be like sektor
- armor on ex bite
- ex roll is 10 frames instead of overhead
- 3% damage buff on her low bnb's

noob:

make him a character that can actually zone.

btw: no resets for smoke and cyrax

 

[Seapeople]

This is a cool idea.
I'll throw out my suggestions to maybe spark ideas for other people.

Sindel:
-11 cancel advantage on hit increased to +32, meaning that it can combo into yell and potentially extend juggle combos by using 11~levi cancel.
-Completely remove the frame gaps between 31, 311, and 31b2.
-Make the third hit of 31b2 a low.
-Yell/Scream are no longer breakable.
-While fully levitated you can glide freely back and forth.
-You can levitate while airborne.
-Armor on ex scream or ex cartwheel...This one is sketchy because I don't feel like armor is the answer to everything.

Reptile:
He doesn't need anything imo but it would be nice to have projectile invincibility on the startup of invisibility.

Sub Zero:
-2 hits mid against every character.
-Ex freeze doesn't break if you get hit after its startup.

subzero:
- ^5% buff on bnb's

Sub Zero's damage is fine imo. 41% midscreen isn't bad at all.

 

[FrothyOmen]

Cyrax's antiair needs more recovery frames on whiff.
Smoke's d4 needs to be +15 on hit, -2 on block.
Freddy's straight glove toss causes smoke bomb to whiff similarly to Kabal buzzsaw.

 

[Konqrr]

I've got a few:

General
- "Input bug" removed
- "Invisible wall" in the corner when opponent is in blockstun removed
- Inability to block after whiffing a jump punch fixed
- All "random advantage" on certain moves when blocked are removed
- Remove "Meter Drain" glitch
- The hit level of all attacks hit the way they were intended against all characters, regardless of hitbox size.
- Invincibility glitch removed
- Random pushback on certain moves fixed (Lao 21212 and Sub 214~clone to name two)
- Decreased negative edge
- Tournament Mode in option menu that removes all foreground elements, Toasty Boost, and certain stages (manually selectable) from all matches.
- Button mapping on the pause menu
- "Default" button config brought back in addition to the four programmable ones.

Kabal
- Cooldown on iAGB, reduced damage 9%->7%
- less frame adv on 2~ndc
- You can no longer cancel EX Nomad Dash

Kenshi
- 10f startup and -15 on SC and pushes back less on hit
- EX SC 10f startup, less frame adv on hit, armor only on startup (like Kabal's EX ND) and same range as normal SC. On hit pushes fullscreen.
- Kenshi now builds less meter when opponent blocks Tele-Flurry and Overhead Slash
+ Uppercut has less startup - 14f->11f

Kung Lao
- Spin 8f startup
- Extra armor glitch on EX Teleport to a late 1 removed
+ Low hat recovery reduced from -12 to -10

Mileena
+ Armor added to EX Bite

Kitana
- f21 is -4 on block
+ second hit of 33 hitbox adjusted to not whiff on certain characters when blocked
+ Kitana is airborne on first frame of f3
+ Uppercut has less startup - 15f->12f

Ermac
+ EX Teleport always does both hits even when blocked, safe like Scorpion's EX Teleport.
+ Ermac's crouching hitbox adjusted lower, now matches Sub-Zero's crouching hitbox

Jade
+ DB2 combos from 12
+ First Green Kick floats slightly higher on ground hit
+ Standing 3 hitbox adjusted to have more forward range
+ EX Glow now lasts 3 seconds instead of 2
+ Jade's crouching hitbox adjusted lower, now matches Kitana's crouching hitbox

Scorpion
+ Low attacks give better frame adv on hit like the rest of the cast
+ EX Spear hitbox adjusted to fix "whiffing" when executed while being pressured up close
+ Frame advantage on Hellfire - from 0 to +4
+ Less recovery on b2 - from -25 to -19

Sub-Zero
+ EX Ground Freeze connects on opponents frozen in the air when they fall (old nerf removed)
+ EX Ground Freeze now keeps opponent stuck if Sub-Zero is hit (trade).

Noob
+ EX Tackle now only -11 on block down from -42
+ EX Teleport now juggles like MKT, damage scaled after it hits
+ Portal no longer disables Noob's attack hitboxes while active
+ Noob's crouching hitbox adjusted lower, now matches Sub-Zero's crouching hitbox

Smoke
- Reset removed like it is on the PS Vita
+ EX Invisibility now gives Damage Boost

Sektor
- Can no longer cancel into special moves from normals that do not make contact with opponent
+ Adjusted hitbox on second hit if 12 to make it whiff less when done slightly away from opponent

Cyrax
- Can only throw one normal bomb out while opponent is in hitstun (during a combo). Cyrax does the animation for a second bomb, if attempted, but nothing comes out and the meter that Cyrax would have gained from the bomb is taken away. This also affects Human Cyrax.
- Vertical hitbox on net slightly reduced. This also affects Human Cyrax.
+ Less recovery on EX Teleport
- Anti Air now floats longer on whiff

Rain
- Armor on EX Roundhouse is now 1-hit and not super armor.
+ Less recovery on Water Ball.

Skarlet
+ Increased damage on Daggers

Cyber Sub-Zero
+ Iceball comes out faster and has less recovery
+ Less recovery on Teleport

Sonya
- Can no longer cancel Military Stance f1 into special if it does not make contact with opponent.
- Cartwheel now -4 on block
- Uppercut no longer hits opponents behind her

Freddy
- There is a 10 frame delay between when you enter Nightmare Stance and when you can cancel it to a special move.
- Slightly more recovery on Glove Toss

Kano
+ All frame gaps removed from his blockstrings
+ Old Knife Throw recovery
+ Air Ball now has ground recovery and does not enter "punishment mode" like his Ground Ball. It is -14 on block.

Sindel
+ Standing 1 has less startup - 11f->9f
+ You can now special cancel from standing 4
+ EX Scream has armor on startup
+ Sindel's crouching hitbox adjusted lower, now matches Sonya's crouching hitbox
- Uppercut no longer hits opponents behind her
+ 11 now combos into EX Scream
+ Scream (all variants) are no longer breakable.
+ You can now cancel an air projectile into Levitate.

Jax
- Slightly more recovery on Ground Pound
- Slightly more recovery on f413 blockstring - from 0 to -2

Cage
- More startup on f3 - 9f->11f
- Xray only activates if a physical attack connects, it is no longer proximity based.
+ Less startup on Sweep - 22f->15f
+ Increased damage on EX Shadow Kick - from 12% to 15%
- Armor now only on startup of EX Shadow Kick

Stryker
+ Less startup on Grenade Toss (all variants) - 22f->18f
+ Less recovery on Grenade Toss (all variants) - from -15 to -11
+ Less startup on Gun Shot - 26f->20f
+ Less recovery on Xray - from -35 to -15
+ Armor now lasts longer on EX Roll

Liu Kang
- More recovery on b31 blockstring - from -1 to -3
- More recovery on b312 blockstring - from 0 to -1
+ Less recovery on whiffed Dragon Kick. It is now only -5 when he lands.
+ Less startup on Parry (all variants) - 9f->4f

Nightwolf
+ EX Shoulder is now a mid for both hits
+ f3 now hits low
+ Less startup on Arrow - 36f->25f

Baraka
+ Less recovery on Blade Spark - from -21 to -16
+ You can cancel f4 (knee) into special moves again
- Blade Fury can only be used in a combo once then it ends the combo (to prevent f4 infinites)
+ u4 now has 1-hit armor (lulz)

Shang Tsung
- More recovery on Ground Skull - from +2 to +1
+ Less startup on Uppercut - 15f->12f
+ Joker fatality to text Paulo Garcia's phone every time it is done colt ^_^

Quan Chi
+ Less recovery on Trance - from -35 to -27

Raiden
- Hitbox adjusted for the second hit of f24. It now has less vertical range.
- The opponent is taken a shorter distance when Electric Fly connects. This prevents an opponent from being nearly cornered instantly on certain stages from the starting point if hit by this move.

Sheeva
+ EX Stomp retains armor for 5 frames after reappearing
+ EX Low Grab moves forward like EX Grab-n-Punch
+ Less startup on Uppercut - 13f-> 10f
+ Xray now does more damage - 33% to 41%

 

[RomeoBravoDelta]

The only buff I can think of for Sektor that isn't armor (armor on EX Flame Burner is useless and on EXTU is ridiculous) is to make b2 a charge unblockable, à la Ermac.

And standardize the hitboxes between Human and Robot.

 

[Ashenar]

Honestly you all want real balance instead of nurfing the select few buff the freaking cast from the bottom up that's real balance.

 

[Konqrr]

Remove the bullshit, buff the fish, don't change the game so much that it feels like you have to learn it again.

 

[Seapeople]

General
- "Input bug" removed
- "Invisible wall" in the corner when opponent is in blockstun removed
- Inability to block after whiffing a jump punch fixed
- All "random advantage" on certain moves when blocked are removed

The invisible wall can also happen midscreen. But if we're including these kind of changes I'll add a few

-Fixed hit/block stun (which would most likely also fix the meter drain and random advantage)
-The hit level of all attacks hit the way they were intended against all characters, regardless of hitbox size.
-Invincibility glitch removed
-Better netcode (both online and offline)
-Fixed corner inconsistencies
-Random pushback on certain moves fixed
-Decreased negative edge
-Toasty boost removed...yeahh I went there.
-Button mapping on the pause menu
-More cooperative training mode

 

[Bildslash]

Why not take this one step further to create an official council for Injustice.

Last thing that game needs is repeating the mistakes MK suffered early on its life.

 

[Red Reaper]

Sektor's Leg Lift should build meter!

 

[killa_solid]

For Sonya:
- Dk goes into roll animation on block
-Cartwheel is -5
+Her 4 has a greater cancel advantage on block (~+27)
+Both hit of her 21 hit crouch block but not neutral crouch
Baraka:
+Spark has jax projectile recovery
+The 3 hit blade spin move leads to a safe jump in on hit
-Reduced push back on blade charge
Cyrax:
Stays the same, he needs it lol

 

[Eddy Wang]

I've got a few:

General
- Remove "Meter Drain" glitch

Kung Lao
+ Low hat recovery reduced from -12 to -10


Skarlet
+ Increased damage on Daggers

These are the ones i don't agree

Meter Drain stays, its not a glitch so it should remind scrub players to stop mashing armor between frames taht can't be interrupted they need to time it right.

Kung Lao low hat doesn't need more buffs, there is characters who don't even have a 10f startup string and even the ones who have its already hard to punish low hat, so no


Skarlet dagger is fine, What she doesn't have is a reliable AA, the most good one is 13f startup and needs to be 8f startup

Jax GP can already be cancelable , so no more recovering.

 

[Seapeople]

Meter Drain stays, its not a glitch so it should remind scrub players to stop mashing armor between frames taht can't be interrupted they need to time it right.

I don't think I've ever heard of this kind of thing happening in other fighting games. It was definitely unintended and is a glitchy byproduct of bad block design. If you are mashing armor and mistime it you should be hit by the attack rather than losing the bar -_-

 

[Eddy Wang]

I don't think I've ever heard of this kind of thing happening in other fighting games. It was definitely unintended and is a glitchy byproduct of bad block design. If you are mashing armor and mistime it you should be hit by the attack rather than losing the bar -_-

I think street fighter also does have it.

Meter is very important in this game, you need to know how to manage it, so mashing armor or miss time it escape pressure its not a good thing, you just need to improve your execution on this one.

I rather have a record mode that help us on training mode than that shit we have, no one would have cry about meter drain we we all knew in which parts of some setups we could interrupt some shiez

 

[Konqrr]

1. Meter Drain stays, its not a glitch so it should remind scrub players to stop mashing armor between frames taht can't be interrupted they need to time it right.

2. Kung Lao low hat doesn't need more buffs, there is characters who don't even have a 10f startup string and even the ones who have its already hard to punish low hat, so no

3. Skarlet dagger is fine, What she doesn't have is a reliable AA, the most good one is 13f startup and needs to be 8f startup

4. Jax GP can already be cancelable , so no more recovering.

1. It should either work or not. If not, they get hit but not lose meter for it. I understand your point of view though.

2. With the spin going from 6f to 8f, all characters would have the same 18f (as it is now) to get an attack in before he can spin and 19f before he can hit with 2 unless Lao has Xray. ALL characters have a pressure string that starts up in 18f or less. This move should not be full combo punishable by 90% of the cast.

3. When Skarlet daggers are coming at me, I don't even care how many of them I get hit by. They are like flies. I feel that the damage should be increased a couple % to make them more threatening. I also agree that she should have a better anti air attack.

4. Jax has literally no recovery frames after GP. Once the animation finishes, he can go directly into anything. There should be a few frames where he is vulnerable after he commits to it.

 

[Eddy Wang]

1. It should either work or not. If not, they get hit but not lose meter for it. I understand your point of view though.

2. With the spin going from 6f to 8f, all characters would have the same 18f (as it is now) to get an attack in before he can spin and 19f before he can hit with 2 unless Lao has Xray. ALL characters have a pressure string that starts up in 18f or less. This move should not be full combo punishable by 90% of the cast.

3. When Skarlet daggers are coming at me, I don't even care how many of them I get hit by. They are like flies. I feel that the damage should be increased a couple % to make them more threatening. I also agree that she should have a better anti air attack.

4. Jax has literally no recovery frames after GP. Once the animation finishes, he can go directly into anything. There should be a few frames where he is vulnerable after he commits to it.

me gusta ^^ i miss took it jax, i though you're telling it to be more faster on recovery, that move is annoying

Skarlet daggers combined deals 4% damage, increase each by 6% may be not a good idea, it would improve her damage output even more and also her unbreakable damage lolz

But since her X-Ray deals 29% damage it wouldn't hurt to be combo continued though

 

[Seapeople]

I think street fighter also does have it.

Meter is very important in this game, you need to know how to manage it, so mashing armor or miss time it escape pressure its not a good thing, you just need to improve your execution on this one.

I rather have a record mode that help us on training mode than that shit we have, no one would have cry about meter drain we we all knew in which parts of some setups we could interrupt some shiez

I've never heard of it happening in SF but I don't play it either...
It just stems from the way blocking was poorly designed in this game. Getting hit by the other player's attack is still a punishment for trying to interrupt at the wrong time, and that is really what was intended to happen.

 

[Eddy Wang]

I've never heard of it happening in SF but I don't play it either...
It just stems from the way blocking was poorly designed in this game. Getting hit by the other player's attack is still a punishment for trying to interrupt at the wrong time, and that is really what was intended to happen.

i understand your point of view
But i wouldn't say that "it was intended to happen" or "not intended to happen" until NRS confirm by themselves, that is why i stay neutral at this lol

 

[Konqrr]

Understanding the game as well as I do, it would be so cool to be able to tweak the game and test things out.

 

[Laos_boy]

Remove the stupid things
Sonya
- Cartwheel -5
* EX CARTWHEEL
Kenshi
- Spirit Charge - 15
* EX RISNG KARMA
Kabal
- 2NDC +5
- Air Gas Blast are 0 on block and come out at 11 frames
* EX ND
Cyrax
- After the 2nd net the bomb doesnt hit. He needs the standing reset.
* EX RAGDOLL
Smoke
- f4 ex SB otg's and if blocked leaves smoke at 0 ONLY AFTER F4 EX SB
* ex SB
Jade
- Can Flash through Smoke bomb, Kenshis Spirits, Freddys Ground claw
In games Flaws
- Negative edge
- Input bug
- Both sides are treated equally
- Stages Dont Drop Frames or lag
- Meter Drain Glitch To the extent were and ex move can be stop but only if the move actually COMES OUT

The Following Buffs and nerfs are debatable

EVERY CHARACTER GETS ONE ARMORED MOVE *

Kitana
- EX LIFT DRAINS METER, lol Just because
*Ex ASS has full super armor and is 2 frames faster and hits over head
Sindel
- Ex Yell Drains meter
* EX STEP UP
Kano
- choke is +4 on block
- Ex Kife grants combo on airbourne hit
* EX CHOKE
Jade
- 2% damage buff
- u3 mid
- 12 ex staff
* SHADOW KICK
Liu Kang
* Ex Flying Kick
Kung Lao
* EX TELEPORT
Scorpion
- d4 +4 on hit
- d3 0 on hit
- Ex Hell fire + 5 on hit
* EX TAKE DOWN
Sub Zero
- EX ground ice otg returned
* EX SLIDE
Cage
- f2 REMOVED
* Shadow kick
NW
- F3 Low
* EX SHOULDER
Ermac
* EX TKP
Reptile
- d1 6frames
* EX ACID HAND
Sektor
* EX FLAME THROWER and its + 5 on hit
Noob
- EX slide is a launcher like mileenas roll
* EX UPKNEE
Mileena
- 1% damage buff
* EX NECKBITE
Jax
- That one string that ends in an uppercut you can get f413
* EX DASH PUNCH
Stryker
- 4 gives a free jump in
* EX ROLL TOSS
Quan Chi
- 9 frame D4
* EX RUNE
Raiden
* EX SHOCKER
Shang Tsung
* Ex Ground Skull
Sheeva
- 1 10 frames
* ONLY EXECPTION ON ALL GRABS
Baraka
- EX chop chop drains meter
Skarlet
- daggers does 4 % each
- EX TELEPORT gives 10 health back
* EX DASH
Rain
- 3 low
- lightning over head
*EX ROUNDHOUSE
Freddy
- EX sweet dreams Drains Meter
* EX SWEET DREAMS
* ex Blade charge