Angry Joe interviews Major Nelson

[MorbidAltruism]

I don't know... I thought the interview was conducted pretty well considering the circumstances. It was one of the first Xbox reviews that didn't totally disregard the people. I mean I can see where Microsoft is coming from now.

In regards to the Kinect... I don't necessarily think shady stuff is going to be happening. At the same time I can definitely see the discomfort. I am not really sure what personal information or whatever people are worried about losing. I mean having a cell phone is worse...

 

[Konqrr]

You didn't show me anything was happening. You showed me your extreme case of paranoia.

You remind me of my daughter when she was 5 telling me that she would never get hit by a car if she didn't look both ways before crossing because it hasn't happened yet.

In response to the PRISM argument, Microsoft, Facebook and other intelligent technology providers issued statements that they do not provide any information with government agencies unless required to do so by subpoena.

Do we honestly think that what worthless gaming we do is going to be watched by the government? Some of you are very Orwellian.

Do you think that the Government doesn't notice that people can use their gaming consoles to talk to other people and not play games via parties, chatrooms, skype, etc.? They will be monitoring just like they do with smartphones.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/07/nsa-prism-records-surveillance-questions

Notice that Microsoft being the first to be included back in 2007.

 

[Saint Op Omen]

You remind me of my daughter when she was 5 telling me that she would never get hit by a car if she didn't look both ways before crossing because it hasn't happened yet.


Do you think that the Government doesn't notice that people can use their gaming consoles to talk to other people and not play games via parties, chatrooms, skype, etc.? They will be monitoring just like they do with smartphones.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/07/nsa-prism-records-surveillance-questions

Notice that Microsoft being the first to be included back in 2007.

So That's how the terrorists do it...nobody was checking aol messenger...

Oh look Billy has played the "kill the president" mission 400 times...let's listen in and find out why...

I could see that happening...
Sent under duress.

 

[xWEBSx]

So That's how the terrorists do it...nobody was checking aol messenger...

Oh look Billy has played the "kill the president" mission 400 times...let's listen in and find out why...

I could see that happening...
Sent under duress.

Am I the only one who thinks its okay to watch Billy playing the "kill the president mission" 400 times? I mean... It's not exactly "Super Mario Brothers" stage 1-3 for crying out loud.. methinks even if Billy is not a terrorist he could have some "upbringing" issues mayhapse?

 

[Saint Op Omen]

Am I the only one who thinks its okay to watch Billy playing the "kill the president mission" 400 times? I mean... It's not exactly "Super Mario Brothers" stage 1-3 for crying out loud.. methinks even if Billy is not a terrorist he could have some "upbringing" issues mayhapse?

Billy has failed the "killing the president" mission 399 times because he couldn't bring himself to do it...even in a game....
INNOCENT...damn your always assuming the worst...
Sent under duress.

 

[windsagio]

Why should I give a fuck about developers jobs? They are there to make a profit and I am there to be entice to buy said product. If I think the product is worth a day one purchase than I will buy it day one.

You don't see toyota, ford, honda saying "HEY STOP SELLING MY CARS USED!". WE GOTTA EAT TOO!

(console war bullcrap standard content snipped)

God reading the whole "devs gotta eat" argument is just so irritating. Maybe if they didn't spend fucking 100mil (tomb raider) to make a game that has NEVER sold past 5mil copies and expect a profit then I might feel some sympathy.

You should care about developer jobs for your own advantage. We're talking about a better variety and quality of games here, when you get down to it. The system you're mysteriously in love with makes it so the publishers have to play especially safe on the AAA titles. Which is fine if you want to play Madden or COD, but it's hard if you wanted to see Eufloria or another Okami. XBLive/PSN help some, but we're still not seeing the mass of creativity that has blossomed over steam and even mobile over the last few years.

~~~

The real thing too, is that the guy saying 'what about the joooooobs' is way off. It's a choice between parasitic jobs and creative jobs.

 

[windsagio]

In regards to the Kinect... I don't necessarily think shady stuff is going to be happening. At the same time I can definitely see the discomfort. I am not really sure what personal information or whatever people are worried about losing. I mean having a cell phone is worse...

(DBL I know, catching up)

I always come to the same place with that, with the legal cell phone/text listening and google knowing every search input and people getting the feds called on them for bad facebook posts, along with the analytics that all the systems are going to be collecting on everyone anyways, some cloudy motion detection images seem a silly concern.

 

[Saint Op Omen]

(DBL I know, catching up)

I always come to the same place with that, with the legal cell phone/text listening and google knowing every search input and people getting the feds called on them for bad facebook posts, along with the analytics that all the systems are going to be collecting on everyone anyways, some cloudy motion detection images seem a silly concern.

Untill we get a Kinect party rebel beheading on the news ...then all bets are off...

Sent under duress.

 

[Scoot Magee]

If it's true that you can share a game for unlimited use with 10 people on your friends list, I think that's a good feature. It's essentially passing around a disc. Though still I'm worried about cut support, game value (I like to sell used) and ect.. The OG xbox was pretty much blocked from going online and I don't want my games to lose functionality they once had. It's not like microsoft was responsible for hosting dedicated servers for all the online games, the users themselves were hosting the servers they were playing in except for a few EA games.

Also from what I understand of the way the system works, I don't think eliminating DRM will be easy. Considering games can be installed and played without a disc they would need to find a way to stop people from installing 1 game on a bunch of consoles. If installing games wasn't required it might be easier but I don't know. It seems the whole method of purchasing and using games they are using needs the DRM to function properly without causing extremely easy, mass pirating.

I think MS wont fail TBH... People are eventually going to accept this but I'm still getting a ps3 for now.

 

[JaredL]

If it's true that you can share a game for unlimited use with 10 people on your friends list, I think that's a good feature. It's essentially passing around a disc. Though still I'm worried about cut support, game value (I like to sell used) and ect.. The OG xbox was pretty much blocked from going online and I don't want my games to lose functionality they once had. It's not like microsoft was responsible for hosting dedicated servers for all the online games, the users themselves were hosting the servers they were playing in except for a few EA games.

You can already give your friends discs anyway.

But it is more convenient for long distances. Aside from that, its nothing new.

 

[windsagio]

Untill we get a Kinect party rebel beheading on the news ...then all bets are off...

Sent under duress.

That's gotta be the worst possible way to promote your beheading party. The video quality is awful!

 

[RagingNight]

You should care about developer jobs for your own advantage. We're talking about a better variety and quality of games here, when you get down to it. The system you're mysteriously in love with makes it so the publishers have to play especially safe on the AAA titles. Which is fine if you want to play Madden or COD, but it's hard if you wanted to see Eufloria or another Okami. XBLive/PSN help some, but we're still not seeing the mass of creativity that has blossomed over steam and even mobile over the last few years.

~~~

The real thing too, is that the guy saying 'what about the joooooobs' is way off. It's a choice between parasitic jobs and creative jobs.

No that is 100% untrue. Majority of the cost of games go to ridiculous production value to make it an AAA game.

There weren't mass AAA games during the PS2 yet we got great games. Because the risk wasn't stupid high. There wasn't 300+ people working on the game.

Look at tomb raider, a series where there wasn't a single game that has ever reached 5 mil copies sold and they expected the new one (that cost 100mil+) to sell 5 mil ? what?

Look at RE6. A game that capcom tried so hard to appeal to the "dude-bro" and had a 500+ dev team. Did it sell well? no. It did ship well but at the cost of damaging the franchise's name/reputation.

Production value of games have gotten stupid expensive and to compensate it, publishers force devs to add DLC and force dev to play it safe. Its no coincidence that Halo4 has many COD influences.

Plenty of Japanese dev games are medium budget games and sell well enough to make profit because they have a more realistic approach to the business side. They don't need to sell 2-3mil to make profit (disgaea games for example), and they are still great games that are unique and refreshing.

The devs that are so anti-used games are the same ones that produce these hollywood style games. I mean look at the new Max Payne, holy shit. And they expected a profit? Really?

It all comes down to this. If the game is worth it, people will buy it new. Used games existed during the ps1 and ps2 era and there were TONS of games with tons of variety.

 

[windsagio]

No that is 100% untrue. Majority of the cost of games go to ridiculous production value to make it an AAA game.

There weren't mass AAA games during the PS2 yet we got great games. Because the risk wasn't stupid high. There wasn't 300+ people working on the game.

Look at tomb raider, a series that a game has NEVER reached 5 mil copies sold and they expected the new one (that cost 100mil+) to sell 5 mil ? what?

Production value of games have gotten stupid expensive and to compensate it, publishers force devs to add DLC and force dev to play it safe. Its no coincidence that Halo4 has many COD influences.

Plenty of Japanese dev games are medium budget games and sell well enough to make profit because they have a more realistic approach to the business side. They don't need to sell 2-3mil to make profit (disgaea games for example), and they are still great games that are unique and refreshing.

The devs that are so anti-used games are the same ones that produce these hollywood style games. I mean look at the new Max Payne, holy shit. And they expected a profit? Really?

It all comes down to this. If the game is worth it, people will buy it new. Used games existed during the ps1 and ps2 era and there were TONS of games with tons of variety.

Want to start by focusing in on a little part:

The devs that are so anti-used games are the same ones that produce these hollywood style games. I mean look at the new Max Payne, holy shit. And they expected a profit? Really?

Yes, this is absolutely true, because those games are the most hurt by resales. Because they rely on the amazing effects and cinematic-style twists, they're usually 1-time plays, and they get on the secondhand market relatively quickly. They're also, as you noted, the most expensive games to produce, and NEED the most sales to be profitable. So of course they're complaining the loudest.

All devs are anti-used games sales, just about. It is, regardless of how you look at it, a parasitic business practice. And they really hurt the very littlest of guys the most. Sure, an established company (say NIS in your example) with an established brand can go on making games, but lets say you're a small team, and you have what you think is an amazing concept that's just a little too big to go full out indie. Try pitching that game to a publisher. It's a little better now, because you have various online methods of distribution to hit, but it's hard.

In a world where word-of-mouth is almost useless due to second hand sales, publishers want an absolutely safe guaranteed first-week sales game, because anything else is gonna get cannibalized like crazy by the Gamestop market.

Which, I've gotta repeat, produces nothing!

 

[RagingNight]

Want to start by focusing in on a little part:



Yes, this is absolutely true, because those games are the most hurt by resales. Because they rely on the amazing effects and cinematic-style twists, they're usually 1-time plays, and they get on the secondhand market relatively quickly. They're also, as you noted, the most expensive games to produce, and NEED the most sales to be profitable. So of course they're complaining the loudest.

All devs are anti-used games sales, just about. It is, regardless of how you look at it, a parasitic business practice. And they really hurt the very littlest of guys the most. Sure, an established company (say NIS in your example) with an established brand can go on making games, but lets say you're a small team, and you have what you think is an amazing concept that's just a little too big to go full out indie. Try pitching that game to a publisher. It's a little better now, because you have various online methods of distribution to hit, but it's hard.

In a world where word-of-mouth is almost useless due to second hand sales, publishers want an absolutely safe guaranteed first-week sales game, because anything else is gonna get cannibalized like crazy by the Gamestop market.

Which, I've gotta repeat, produces nothing!

I don't see it. There are plenty of games that make good profit without super big sales and are all niche.

Atelier series is super niche, and yet they make profit without even selling 1 mil units. Theres like 4 of them on the ps3 alone. Used games does hurt companies, but they also help them as well. I am more willing to buy a game knowing that I can resell the one I just beat and buy a new one. Or I'm more likely to buy the next game if I bought the used one if I like it.

There are also many others ways to provide incentive to buy new. You can do free dlc (catwoman), good preorder deals, week 1 bonus sale etc etc.

 

[Saint Op Omen]

That's gotta be the worst possible way to promote your beheading party. The video quality is awful!

And the silly dragon head does nothing for your rep...

Sent under duress.

 

[Scoot Magee]

You can already give your friends discs anyway.

But it is more convenient for long distances. Aside from that, its nothing new.

I understand that.

 

[AZ MotherBrain]

Joe putting Nelson on blast.

 

[s7ringr]

After reading (or what I could manage to sift through) this post, I decided I needed to make a comment. I love Joe, I have been watching his videos for years. I met him at PAX in 2010, and he was a really nice guy. He was surprised I knew who he was (this was before ThatGuy.com was better know) and we walked and talked for the better part of 15/20 minutes before my friend pulled me away to play the StarCraft 2 beta. ANYWAY, I get Joe's passion, but I think he shares the same problem a lot of "gamers" have... "Gamers" now include moms, dads, grandparents, girlfriends, kids in preschool...

We have this image in our head when we were the underground, the OG, the true gamer. I'm the one who knew the Contra code, I new how to cheat on Rainbow Road to cut out half the track. That I know what a Dreamcast is and my parents, who bought it for me, have no idea what I am talking about when I talk about the Christmas ever. (A Dreamcast, Sonic Adventure and, NFL2K - I cried. 12/25/99) We are upset that games, gaming systems, gaming companies and the industry as a whole have "forgotten" about us, the original gamer. The problem is, they are a business - a for-profit business - and these "non-gamer" gamers probably outnumber us 100-1. My parents, with a house hold income probably quadrupedal mine, (me being a 27 year old network technician) are more willing to drop hundreds and thousands of dollars on stupid, high-margin, profit-filled bullshit like Connect or WiiFit - While I buy $9.99 used games at Gamestop. Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo - They love us, the know what we did for them for 20/30 years, but they also know most of that money came from someone else, our parents. They are basically cutting out the middle man, pass us right up and go to the source. Old people who don't know whats going on, willing to pay ridiculous amounts of money for shit they don't need, and bratty 4-11 year-olds who will kick and scream and make their parents life hell unless they get what they want.

Do you think Microsoft makes more money when I buy Left 4 dead: 2 or when my mom buys a Connect, Julianne Hough workout madness, and her workout board.. thing, water bottle, heartbeat monitor, special digital diet plan weight tracker with scale? Or when my brother needs Halo, with a new headset, keyboard attachment, Gold Membership, Xbox Points for a cool skin and that $10 special gun ONLY AVAILABLE FOR ANOTHER 5 MINUTES!!!!!!!!! MOOOOOOOOOOM WHAT'S YOUR CREDIT CARD NUMBER?!?!?! OMG I NEED THE MAP PACK, MOM I BROKE MY HEADSET IN ANGER BECAUSE THIS GUY IS A NOOB MOM I NEED 3 MORE CONTROLERS FOR MY FRIENDS, MOM I NEED HEADSETS FOR ALL OF THEM, MOM I NEED THIS STEERING WHEEL ATTACHMENT THING FOR MY RACING GAME, MOM I BROKE MY HEADSET AGAIN! MOM MY MEMBERSHIP RAN OUT!

No one wants to be the next Sega.

 

[Juggs]

So has it been explained why the 24 hour check in is necessary? And what happens when I'm out of town or god forbid not at my house to caress my precious XBOX? Will my XBOXONE commence a self destruct sequence if I'm not there to coddle it? Am I really going to have to get an XBOX sitter when I'm not at home for more than a day?

The XBOXONE is literally trying to create no life gamers with no social interactions what so ever. And by social interaction I don't mean playing with friends online or chatting with them on twitter, lol.

 

[JaredL]

So has it been explained why the 24 hour check in is necessary? And what happens when I'm out of town or god forbid not at my house to caress my precious XBOX? Will my XBOXONE commence a self destruct sequence if I'm not there to coddle it? Am I really going to have to get an XBOX sitter when I'm not at home for more than a day?

The XBOXONE is literally trying to create no life gamers with no social interactions what so ever. And by social interaction I don't mean playing with friends online or chatting with them on twitter, lol.

Xbone is for people who want to play CoD, use skype and watch TV at the same time.
PS4 is for gamers.

That's how it works out in the end.

 

[s7ringr]

Xbone is for people who want to play CoD, use skype and watch TV at the same time.
PS4 is for gamers.

That's how it works out in the end.

"Gamers" because being a gamer means buying used games and not having 24/7 internet access.

 

[JaredL]

"Gamers" because being a gamer means buying used games and not having 24/7 internet access.

Graphics are in PS4s favour too don't forget. Multiplatform games will look better on Ps4.

 

[s7ringr]

Graphics are in PS4s favour too don't forget. Multiplatform games will look better on Ps4.

It has DDR5 RAM instead of DDR3... random access memory... they have the same chipset and graphics card from AMD... so I have no idea where you're getting this from. I can put 80G of DDR15 in my computer, doesn't make the boobs on a naked level 1 human rogue look anymore real.

 

[JaredL]

It has DDR5 RAM instead of DDR3... random access memory... they have the same chipset and graphics card from AMD... so I have no idea where you're getting this from. I can put 80G of DDR15 in my computer, doesn't make the boobs on a naked level 1 human rogue look anymore real.

Microsoft dedicate 3 gigs of that to OS shit. Sony only 1.

 

[s7ringr]

Microsoft dedicate 3 gigs of that to OS shit. Sony only 1.

Microsoft is clearly inept, have no idea how to make a gaming machine, have no idea how to make money or a product people demand, and its a shock that they are even still in business. You should start your own gaming hardware company, bro, because you clearly have it all figured out.