Match-up Discussion Sinestro post UFGT MU chart

[LEGEND]

Shazam is slightly disadvantageous against Sinestro from my understanding of the matchup when I think about it. 5.5 4.5 but probably not worse than that. Does Sinestro have a good 9f move that can punish d3 from max range?

Fear blast maybe?

otherwise instant Fear axe is good against sweep as far as footsies go

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Fear blast maybe?

otherwise instant Fear axe is good against sweep as far as footsies go

Axe definintely or d2 arachnid would push them back enough to setup offense

fb would whiff

if we were using point systems id say 5.5-4.5

 

[MashPotatoTower]

man im sleeping on Shazam yeah i suppose so
I think its not a good MU tho, its dat zoning, kids hate zoning
Edit: yeah whats with frost? did she suck each and every cock at NR for all her shit?

 

[Under_The_Mayo]

I'm maining him full time now and not switching. I love the character way too much. SHAZAM!



Also I think you will eventually find that Catwoman is a bad matchup. Obviously I'm no top Sinestro player but I REALLY feel it.

I second this, but not significantly. Not like 7 3 or anything. She has a very high ability to become a pest. We already have her one meter bnb's breaking 50% with hard knockdown. Plus her unique interactable setup ability is icing on the cake. I'm focusing on sinestro as well. Can't wait to learn more.

 

[Chuckychuck]

Throwing out raw b3 MB wins against typical frost but here's reality

You can't react to slide in footsie range or mid screen and guess what if u do? It takes 5 frames to activate armor and if late she can block it off a slide recovery and you've now wasted a bar of meter to be now put in a 50/50 situation where her options greatly outweigh yours

On a blocked slide your best option w sinestro is throw. D3 on block is full combo into reset punishable and every other threat can be parried

His jump in 1/2/3 gets hammered by her superior d2 slide to combo reset

His jump back /jump back1/3 option can be baited , dashed and slide or d2 slide

Miss timed axe or axe whiff can be punished w slide even instant air

FB only hits her crouching full screen, mid screen she can duck and slide FB

Shackles on block gets slide

Boulder gets dash in slide from 3/4 or 20% ice spike from full screen block

The best tool sinestro has against her is d2xxarachnid and pray u get your trait out.

Btw when she hits u it's 42-80%. When u hit her (which ill get to soon) u get 27-45%.

Ok so when/how to hit her:

No skilled frost player is gonna stand full screen away from u and ice spike u and try to zone u. So punishing spike w shackles might happen against a top frost once-twice a round where full screen u get 16%. If you're late she gets 20%

So block slide options:
Throw is best but can be back dashed into slide and now you're in same guessing situation again
B2 parried and also she can d1 slide before it comes out
D1 same situation
F2d1 same situation
Jump back 1/2/3 slide or dash in d2 slide
Nj1/2/3 will be d2 into slide


The only hope any sinestro has against frost is metropolis rooftop and throw every starship enterprise u can or if the frost player just completely plays terrible

Again if anyone has an answer other than black Adam or batman I'd like to see it offline at CEO or Evo not online

Any safe 9 frame low beats KF's options...

Her d1 becomes 10
Her slide gets stuffed
Lows beat parry
She's -4 and takes 8 frames for armor making it 12

Any char with a low man. All you need to reverse slide pressure.

 

[RoboCop]

this MU is 5-5, if you try to play it full screen you'll get bodied

That's the reason I believe it to be 6/4, at best. It's fully up to the Deathstroke player to close the distance, but even once he gets in I'd say they're evenly matched. The buffs to Arachnid destroy Deathstroke's ability to do anything on knockdown other than a 6% gunshot, and most of his pressure well send Sinestro flying back to almost full-screen. If Sinestro manages to get his trait up, I'd call the match. And no matter the range, Sinestro's zoning always somewhat outclassed Deathstroke's; now with Deathstroke's recovery nerfs, I'm certain he's going to have trouble holding any life-leads, which used to be how he would win this MU.

 

[M2Dave]

You guys NEED to put yourself in Frost's reset situation and find out what your options are. You will see that you have at least more options than simply guess-blocking at times.

Another thing ... Her overhead is 4 frames longer than slide so with a LOT of practice (lol), you can begin to block low always and react to the overhead. I've done it a bunch of times, but failed a bunch more. It will get easier with time... lol

Frost is NOT MK9 Kabal REO ... her zoning sucks <3 but I get what you are implying and agree haha

If she is not, she is fairly close.

GGA 16 Bit was annihilating almost every tournament player in casual games. 16 Bit blew his opportunity. He should have won the tournament. The streamed matches were not representative of what the character is truly capable of. I played ten matches with Deathstroke and could not win a fight.

Let us stop the foolishness. Sinestro vs. Killer Frost is like 2:8. Even average Killer Frost players can beat Sinestro.

Pig Of The Hut, I feel like faster charge time did not fix any of Sinestro's bad match ups. It just made the good ones even better. Sinestro struggles in match ups where he cannot reliably build the trait.

 

[16 Bit]

Yeah Killer Frost is pretty good. One day she may place top 8.

 

[Red Reaper]

Cowboy probably lost 50-6 to 16 bit and I did as well

We both tried for H O U R S w me raging and desperately looking for answers

Not ONE frost player I've played is playing that character the way he is, it's a damn shame he played shitty during top 12 because NOT ONE PERSON but Master D black Adam stood any fucking chance and we all tried

Black Adam and batman seem to be the only answers this far to that broken ass character that Paulo says is "M I D tier "

GTFO here w mid tier

What exactly is it that's messed up about Frost?

I'm asking because I don't have actual experience just lab work and theories..

 

[Relaxedstate]

Relaxedstate

Espio

I agree with Sinestro-Cyborg being a 6-4 MU.

-Sinestro trades very favorable with Cyborg, he can easily duck IA fireballs, and any mistake the Cyborg player makes hurts him further.
Cyborg MUST go in on Sinestro once he gets the life lead. At that point Sinestro gets to play the game his character and tools were designed for, and Cyborg, simply put, does not.

-Cyborg is also mostly designed to keep your opponent out and escape, but in this scenario he has to do the opposite, and unfortunately his tools for generating offense under zoning pressure are not as great in comparison. Even when he gets in his damage output is not that great (12%-28% midscreen)... which sucks because you just spent time and probably some health getting in on him.

-Grapple hook can be used as a good tool to get in... but you need to absorb a meteor hit or something with long recovery frames to be safe. Otherwise a grapple over Sinestro is very easily anti-aired on reaction. Grapple hook is not necessarily the best way to generate an offense in this match-up... or any for that matter. I talked with Tom Brady about this a bit. For most match-ups Cyborg can zone his way out and get away with minimal mid-screen damage into set-ups. However Cyborg will sometime have to generate an offense, and he can't rely on just grapple hook to get him in either.

Cyborg does have some good tools however. His dash speed and recovery are decent enough to allow you to duck and dash your way in. One well timed grapple or dash again will have you in there. On top of that he has good block strings that provide good advantage and help keep you in, while fishing for a nice combo.
- His corner damage and set-ups are outrageously good. Good Cyborg players will get their opponent in the corner to start their offense. The sucky part about this is that getting your opponent in the corner and set-up to eat a big combo can be very situational, and often easy to push-block, dash, or intractable escape out of.

I learned quite a lot more about Cyborg these last two weeks. I will be updating some things in the Cyborg forum and work on my own post-UFGT/ECT MU chart

 

[Konqrr]

What exactly is it that's messed up about Frost?

I'm asking because I don't have actual experience just lab work and theories..

You would like her. She has Sektor's standing 1 with his same reach too...

 

[Red Reaper]

You would like her. She has Sektor's standing 1 with his same reach too...

I don't like her. lol..

She plays nothing like Sektor. The one I've found to play most like Sektor is Batman. 6 Frame pressure, and lows with similar zoning + Homing Bats (Missiles). Except Batman has more to him than that and is pretty much better than Sektor in everyway outside of AA's.

I use him, because I need an answer for Supes and he's the funnest of the top tiers but my favorite character is 8 frame jab Arrow. (I want him to have a 6 frame jab so he kan deal with Supes! lol..)

Plus she's blue, so that's a no go... lol. I want to understand her though. I didn't think she would be too much of a problem (at least not as much as other characters) but it doesn't hurt to hear the opinions of others.

 

[xCosmicWizardx]

Wanna know my anti-KF tech?

Pocket Hawkgirl. Stay in the air, D+3 to punish distance-closing slide whiffs, or even better, air BF2 during flight to gain ground. If they slide again, mace charge again. Just fly away and chuck maces. After blocked slide, BF2, WE3, or just jump back fly. I don't see any tool that KF has that a competent HG can't smash. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, and I'd like someone to tell me why I'm wrong. However, you can literally just lame a KF out with HG. You don't even have to be a GOOD HG. just fly away and evade everything while chucking air maces.

 

[16 Bit]

Wanna know my anti-KF tech?

Pocket Hawkgirl. Stay in the air, D+3 to punish distance-closing slide whiffs, or even better, air BF2 during flight to gain ground. If they slide again, mace charge again. Just fly away and chuck maces. After blocked slide, BF2, WE3, or just jump back fly. I don't see any tool that KF has that a competent HG can't smash. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, and I'd like someone to tell me why I'm wrong. However, you can literally just lame a KF out with HG. You don't even have to be a GOOD HG. just fly away and evade everything while chucking air maces.

Well just flying away isn't doing damage and if KF catches you once the round may be over. Like your post blocked slide guessing game is in Killer Frost's favor. If she jumps back and you do b,f+2 she blows up HG's torpedo into a full combo and another guessing game that could end the round.

 

[xCosmicWizardx]

Well just flying away isn't doing damage and if KF catches you once the round may be over. Like your post blocked slide guessing game is in Killer Frost's favor. If she jumps back and you do b,f+2 she blows up HG's torpedo into a full combo and another guessing game that could end the round.

Fine sir, that is a chance I'd be willing to take, win or lose. Lol.

Much better than the alternative as a Sinestro main. This is the one matchup that I have significant issues with. I'd go into details on how but it's all been covered here. You play KF properly, efficiently, and deadly. I dread the day that all these average KF players catch on to what you do and what you know.

Not trying to dwell on about this matchup, but it's by far my worst. Rarely an opportunity to charge trait, and rarely in an advantageous situation. Tough any way you cut it.

 

[16 Bit]

Yeah I suppose. M2Dave did better with Hawkgirl than his Deathstroke lol.

As Pig said, I played Killer Frost vs. Sinestro a ton with Cowboy and Pig. The whole time I was willing to help them, I like both guys a lot. I just had no real advice.

 

[Qwark28]

Play cowboy or I first

I'm comfortable calling this 5-5 , at absolute worst 4-6

add me on xbl: qwark28

no sinestro has managed to convince me of a 5-5

 

[Smarrgasm]

add me on xbl: qwark28

no sinestro has managed to convince me of a 5-5

Pig might know the MU he only trains with one of the best black adams...forgot that guys name.

 

[Qwark28]

Pig might know the MU he only trains with one of the best black adams...forgot that guys name.

no dude i havent played him before

 

[Smarrgasm]

Any safe 9 frame low beats KF's options...

Her d1 becomes 10
Her slide gets stuffed
Lows beat parry
She's -4 and takes 8 frames for armor making it 12

Any char with a low man. All you need to reverse slide pressure.

Very few characters have a 9 or less frame low dude. Of those few only GL and Aquaman have good options with theirs cause they are actually strings.

Trust me. Once she gets to you, getting out is a pain in the ass and youre taking insane risks at every turn even when you guess correctly.

 

[Smarrgasm]

no dude i havent played him before

Oh so thats why he knows the MU

 

[Qwark28]

Oh so thats why he knows the MU

i heard he played that scrub who got 17th in ufgt like once
not one mention of the greek dude spitting walls 24/7 in training for the embodyment of those who oppose him.

 

[Smarrgasm]

i heard he played that scrub who got 17th in ufgt like once
not one mention of the greek dude spitting walls 24/7 in training for the embodyment of those who oppose him.

Why do i resist

 

[Qwark28]

Why do i resist

p-too

Pig Of The Hut how many dictators besides the gasm have you played? we need to get some games in

 

[Axel_Redd]

Pig Of The Hut

Killer Frost is a character almost on MK9 Kabal's level but with Mortal Kombat Deception Mileena's execution.

is that easy execution or hard execution? o-o