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Tech Stop thinking Shazam is bad

Redk9

Redk9

Mortal
Uotan said:
Aquaman sweep does not punish torpedo, it doesn't even reach him. Otherwise you named the 5 characters who can punish, one of which is the mirror (lol), and yet you have the balls to claim "More then half the cast can punish this". Get the hell out of here.
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Cyborg nova blaster(reversal), Joker's Acid Blossom(reversal), Bane's quick kick, Sinestro's d2(sometimes, depends on when they cancel the 22 string). Nightwing's facepoke. Even if you remove aquaman that's still 10 characters. Some of those punishes are tight, sinestro's is kinda inconsistent since its 2 frame, but they are there. 10 is a lot closer to being over half then "90%" as you said.
 
Tom Brady

Tom Brady

Champion
PND_Ketchup said:
I like Tom, and I heavily respect Tom.

BUT. I do wish he wasn't so condescending in some of his replies.

It's possible to debate and respectfully discuss something on here without the "I'm right and you're wrong, here's why" attitude.
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Nothing I said was condescending, nothing I said was disrespectful, and never did I ever say anyone was right or wrong.

Guys like you and STB TakeAChance somehow attach a tone to what I write in which you assume the manner I would be speaking, then say I come off as condescending based on the tone you gave me inside your heads as you read my posts.
 
PND_Ketchup

PND_Ketchup

"More deadly than the dawn"
Tom Brady said:
Nothing I said was condescending, nothing I said was disrespectful, and never did I ever say anyone was right or wrong.

Guys like you and Chance somehow attach a tone to what I write in which you assume the manner I would be speaking, then say I come off as condescending based on the tone you gave me inside your head as you read my posts.
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Don't get me wrong, I never said you were disrespectful.

I just personally find that some of your posts have that kind of tone to it, if you actually don't intend to come across in that manor then there's nothing else to discuss, I must be reading them wrong I suppose.
 
Uotan

Uotan

Unban Joker
Redk9 said:
Cyborg nova blaster(reversal), Joker's Acid Blossom(reversal), Bane's quick kick, Sinestro's d2(sometimes, depends on when they cancel the 22 string). Nightwing's facepoke. Even if you remove aquaman that's still 10 characters. Some of those punishes are tight, sinestro's is kinda inconsistent since its 2 frame, but they are there. 10 is a lot closer to being over half then "90%" as you said.
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Cyborg nova blaster doesn't punish, hell it's so slow I don't know how you possibly thought it could. Neither Joker's Acid Blossom or Sinestro's d2 even reach Shazam after a 22 xx bf2. I'll give you Bane d1 and Nightwing f1. IDK if you know how percentages work but 72% of the cast is a lot closer to 90% than "More then half the cast".
 
Redk9

Redk9

Mortal
Uotan said:
Cyborg nova blaster doesn't punish, hell it's so slow I don't know how you possibly thought it could. Neither Joker's Acid Blossom or Sinestro's d2 even reach Shazam after a 22 xx bf2. I'll give you Bane d1 and Nightwing f1. IDK if you know how percentages work but 72% of the cast is a lot closer to 90% than "More then half the cast".
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I went in, and repeated the same punish 3 times with each of those. Only sinestro's didn't work because if shazam cancels 22 really early they stay closer, but if they do it later they are a bit further away(but risk getting interrupted). Not like you'd know that seeing as you haven't put in much time to shazam. I didn't try a few character's. Didn't include supers even though a ton are fast enough to punish it. But we were both admittedly wrong in our generalizations.
I feel your missing the point. Having a 50/50 option where your safest options is still punished by multiple characters, and doesn't offer you much, but the START of a set up is still terrible. Don't get so lost in a single argument you miss the point that this character isn't good. Until you actually play at a high level(im talking offline with tournament level players) you won't realize how low this characters chances are at ever placing decently actually are.
 
Uotan

Uotan

Unban Joker
Redk9 said:
I went in, and repeated the same punish 3 times with each of those. Only sinestro's didn't work because if shazam cancels 22 really early they stay closer, but if they do it later they are a bit further away(but risk getting interrupted). Not like you'd know that seeing as you haven't put in much time to shazam.
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You aren't using training mode correctly then, because none of them punish or reach. You can keep talking out your ass though, feel free.

Something something about downplaying safe 50/50s.
 
Redk9

Redk9

Mortal
Uotan said:
You aren't using training mode correctly then, because none of them punish or reach. You can keep talking out your ass though, feel free.

Something something about downplaying safe 50/50s.
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Lol, i'll pass on being drug down by some TYM random that probably won't even place decently at a local. Sure you can have this one.
 
BeastOFRaw

BeastOFRaw

Noob
Shazam is the type of character you have to play consciously, no auto pilot bs that some other characters have. He is a character that is able to completely and utterly mind fuk and intimidate the opponent to the point where what they are going to do next becomes obvious. This offense does not come cheap, as it requires patient play, where conditioning your opponent and getting in their head becomes Shazam's greatest asset. The tools that he currently has are more then adequate for this job.
 
Tom Brady

Tom Brady

Champion
PND_Ketchup said:
Don't get me wrong, I never said you were disrespectful.

I just personally find that some of your posts have that kind of tone to it, if you actually don't intend to come across in that manor then there's nothing else to discuss, I must be reading them wrong I suppose.
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If my posts seem curt its because I am just trying to set ups, strats, and counters to your opponents counters. Just options in general..

Rather than taking this and see options, people just decide that because Superman is better, Shazam is terrible. Also, I said he is one of the better characters, not the best, and not Superman. The point was just to show that he is viable and here are the options.

This thread is filled with "why play Shazam when I can play Black Adam, etc.." as a means to discredit anything I say and insinuate that I am "fooling" people into thinking Shazam is playable.

Shazam is not as good as a Black Adam, no... but Characters like Black Adam arent for everyone..

Take MK9.. Sub-Zero was the best character for me. Using better characters resulted in me doing worse. Just because Kabal was better didnt mean that using Kabal was better for me.

This thread was information for those who thought Shazam was bad because he had no options. Shazam is the right character for some people... Giving them "better" options by saying "play Superman or Black Adam" doesnt help anyone..
 
SatsuiYesHadou

SatsuiYesHadou

Yung Kneecaps
Lol I have not seen any supermen in a top 8 that actually have a challenging bracket in front of them. Yeah if there's a bunch of free people at a tourney of course a supes and black adam could win but pls you can't be serious. Only 2 supes in vindication top 8 that had 100 people and only 1 black adam and that bracket had many top players. It's ridiculous if you're complaining about losing to someone who actually knows what they're doing and actually developed these characters from the start. If you lose to a scrub using batman first round in a tourney cause your timing was off from online then I would understand but come on now if you're losing to top supes players like pboard and tyrant and myself (not to be cocky even though I am 16 and main johnny cage after all ;) )
 
xWildx

xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
A lot of Tom's answers seem to include "make a read, and punish" as if making a correct read is a simple thing to do. The player on the defensive will also be making reads, it's not as simple as he makes it sound. Especially when you have characters like Superman, BA, etc. who can take far less risks for comparable damage and setups.
 
MorbidAltruism

MorbidAltruism

Get over here!
Tom Brady said:
If my posts seem curt its because I am just trying to set ups, strats, and counters to your opponents counters. Just options in general..

Rather than taking this and see options, people just decide that because Superman is better, Shazam is terrible. Also, I said he is one of the better characters, not the best, and not Superman. The point was just to show that he is viable and here are the options.

This thread is filled with "why play Shazam when I can play Black Adam, etc.." as a means to discredit anything I say and insinuate that I am "fooling" people into thinking Shazam is playable.

Shazam is not as good as a Black Adam, no... but Characters like Black Adam arent for everyone..

Take MK9.. Sub-Zero was the best character for me. Using better characters resulted in me doing worse. Just because Kabal was better didnt mean that using Kabal was better for me.

This thread was information for those who thought Shazam was bad because he had no options. Shazam is the right character for some people... Giving them "better" options by saying "play Superman or Black Adam" doesnt help anyone..
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I can personally relate to this. Black Adam is just not my character. I don't care if he is better than Shazam. I want to know what works with Shazam because he is the character I am trying to get better at. Any character can do well... but not just any character can miraculously fit my style. :16Bit
 
Darth Mao

Darth Mao

Your Tech is Mine! #buffRaiden
Tom Brady said:
If my posts seem curt its because I am just trying to set ups, strats, and counters to your opponents counters. Just options in general..

Rather than taking this and see options, people just decide that because Superman is better, Shazam is terrible. Also, I said he is one of the better characters, not the best, and not Superman. The point was just to show that he is viable and here are the options.

This thread is filled with "why play Shazam when I can play Black Adam, etc.." as a means to discredit anything I say and insinuate that I am "fooling" people into thinking Shazam is playable.

Shazam is not as good as a Black Adam, no... but Characters like Black Adam arent for everyone..

Take MK9.. Sub-Zero was the best character for me. Using better characters resulted in me doing worse. Just because Kabal was better didnt mean that using Kabal was better for me.

This thread was information for those who thought Shazam was bad because he had no options. Shazam is the right character for some people... Giving them "better" options by saying "play Superman or Black Adam" doesnt help anyone..
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I agree with this post but is time to stop trying to make some characters look more good and viable than he really is, it's more than clear that some characters need serious improvements to become competitive. It is logical and obvious that Shazam has qualities but the top characters are always better and this causes a clear imbalance.
 
kronspik

kronspik

Mortal
Darth Mao said:
I agree with this post but is time to stop trying to make some characters look more good and viable than he really is, it's more than clear that some characters need serious improvements to become competitive. It is logical and obvious that Shazam has qualities but the top characters are always better and this causes a clear imbalance.
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Do you think Tom is going to balance future patches or something? He's giving out tech, not balancing the game. Stop thinking about patch notes all the time.
 
Darth Mao

Darth Mao

Your Tech is Mine! #buffRaiden
kronspik said:
Do you think Tom is going to balance future patches or something? He's giving out tech, not balancing the game. Stop thinking about patch notes all the time.
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And where I said that's what he did or should do? What I tried to say is not always some new technique makes the character be good, show this is a noble attitude from him and what he said about encouraging diversity rather than pointing tops as a solution goes according to what I think too.

But not always only new techs solves, sometimes we has to consider that something needs to be revised to become viable.
 
Euphoric

Euphoric

MKX
I hear he's terrible since Day 1. Everyone makes fun of Shazam, becuase I hear he is just so bad. Probably close to Bane level. Everyone made fun of him badly on InjusticeLive and he got raped in story, he sucks, is the general opinion, so probably true, he is ass. Why would so many people say he sucks...
 
T

Throwback

Noob
Conceptually, I believe Shazam will take a long time to show whether or not he is good. This is because at the very top, experienced level of play (certainly not where the top IGAU players are at now; no disrespect) everything becomes a read. So right now you are getting hit by tricks and setups because you don't know them. Shazam has, for the most part, straight 50/50s. In 2 years time, Shazam will still have his 50/50s but unlike the current meta, so will everyone else.

You can talk about things like chip damage safe block strings and I can talk about shazam's grab range and punish game; but it doesn't mean much in the long run. Damage might be a factor - I really hope trait helps in that regard as time goes on.
 
BlackBryan

BlackBryan

B*tch Distributor
Mr. Mileena said:
BlackBryan
stop downplaying
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TOM BRADY SAID IT SO IT MUST BE TRUE!

Shazam is free. Nothing anyone can say will make me think otherwise, short of winning something major. I play him more often then I play BA, I know his in's and out's. I also know he is going to get bodied by top tier characters.

Children, children, children.
Just because you lose to Gametime's, Chef's or my Shazam doesn't mean he is any kind of viable; Kano, remember? Getting around annoying zoning, staying on you, and big corner damage is what I do best, doesn't mean I wouldn't do better if a had a full screen 50/50, though. The guys you see running shit with Shazam are the guys that would body most anyone with any viable character. Don't believe me? I invite you to play my Shazam, feel confident, then play my BA and and salt my fries.
 
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