Tech Stop thinking Shazam is bad

[Cage Redfield]

Everyone gets a full combo if you duck the HM in that setup.

There's noticeable gaps in 22, I wouldn't be surprised if BA cage beats this free for a full combo. After seeing this video, this little gimmick has become my Hail Mary unless I know for sure the reversal options a character has is booty.

Edit: this is a trap setup, right? How come I'm getting reversal Lightning Cage or Black Magic out the command grab? That's two full combo punishes. Superman can even use his terrible reversals like Low Scoop to just shit on this entirely.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

1. Shazam does 37% w/1bar which is good damge. Over 60% w/a reset which is GREAT DAMAGE.

Compared to Superman 70% combos and Bladam 55% combos I wouldn't say that's great at all.

2. Yes, its risk.. Characters like Black Adan, Superman, etc.. don't have combos that loop unless you do "x". Shazam does..

Yes they do.

Also.. do not say what "x" characters do not let him do. This comes off a knockdown or 22 trap. DO NOT say that Superman, etc will never EVER be knocked down or block a 22. As long as they block 22 or get knocked down, Shazam is in business. Anyone who is basically saying that Shazam will NEVER knock these characters down does not know what they are talking about.

Yeah sure Shazam gets his mixup game, but a 50/50 game where the risk reward is NOT in your favor is never good. Again, look at Scorpion.

 

[jimzam]

In my sole opinion, Shazam is one of the better characters in the game.

so does this mean ur going to be using shazam in ect next week?

i dont see shazam being good but maybe if u use him it will change my mind...

 

[JaredL]

As if black adam lets this kid in

 

[chores]

its like he's a red starburst in a pack full of pinks

 

[Redk9]

Lol, Shazam is terrible. Tom you failed to mention a multitude of things in this guide. Thankfully Ive put extensive time in with shazam, so ive developed my mindset to truly understand all the opponents options, and how bad he is.

-After a sweep a character can wake up, or not wake up. You didn't factor in, if the opponent has a way to get a combo OFF there wake up option. For instance, black adam could meter burn his cage on wake up, and get a full combo. Superman could meter burn his frost breath on wake up, flash can meter burn his lightning kick on wake up. This means its not a "oh i guessed wrong its alright i took minor damage" situation anymore.
-Second what if a character has a safe wake up option that moves the character body as you said. What if grundy does a wake up walking corps, and cancels it so he doesn't do the grab? What if green arrow does his safe wake up exploding arrow back dash(which you can't jump over, and teleporting through doesn't allow for a punish).
-Third what if a character mix's up what wake up options they do, so baiting a punish is a mix up of its own? What if Joker mix's up his wake up acid blossom wake up, and his crowbar wake up which moves him forward? One avoids any jumping cross ups shazam could do, but the other is safe. Both beat the wake up throw.

In a vaccum shazam can be made to sound good, but his reset isn't devastating. With a large portion of the cast his reset situation is just as risky for him as it is for them. Not to mention his neutral game is bad. Every character has strengths, but nobody attempting to place in a tournament will use shazam over someone like superman. Its the exact reason every top player like yourself uses a top tier character, yet crushes any suggestion to buff a character who clearly needs help.

 

[jimzam]

Lol, Shazam is terrible. Tom you failed to mention a multitude of things in this guide. Thankfully Ive put extensive time in with shazam, so ive developed my mindset to truly understand all the opponents options, and how bad he is.

-After a sweep a character can wake up, or not wake up. You didn't factor in, if the opponent has a way to get a combo OFF there wake up option. For instance, black adam could meter burn his cage on wake up, and get a full combo. Superman could meter burn his frost breath on wake up, flash can meter burn his lightning kick on wake up. This means its not a "oh i guessed wrong its alright i took minor damage" situation anymore.
-Second what if a character has a safe wake up option that moves the character body as you said. What if grundy does a wake up walking corps, and cancels it so he doesn't do the grab? What if green arrow does his safe wake up exploding arrow back dash(which you can't jump over, and teleporting through doesn't allow for a punish".
-Third what if a character mix's up what wake up options they do, so baiting a punish is a mix up of its own? What if Joker mix's up his wake up acid blossom wake up, and his crowbar wake up which moves him forward? One avoids any jumping cross ups shazam could do, but the other is safe. Both beat the wake up throw.

In a vaccum shazam can be made to sound good, but his reset isn't devastating. Not to mention his neutral game is bad. Every character has strengths, but nobody attempting to place in a tournament will use shazam over someone like superman. Its the exact reason every top player like yourself uses a top tier character, yet crushes any suggestion to buff a character who clearly needs help.

lol have fun playing shazam against chars like killer frost or deathstroke xD

 

[SLy]

Its the exact reason every top player like yourself uses a top tier character, yet crushes any suggestion to buff a character who clearly needs help.

 

[Tom Brady]

Compared to Superman 70% combos and Bladam 55% combos I wouldn't say that's great at all.

Yes they do.

Yeah sure Shazam gets his mixup game, but a 50/50 game where the risk reward is NOT in your favor is never good. Again, look at Scorpion.

That Superman example is not even close to the same. I can always block any option you do or tech a throw. With Shazam, you cannot block the option, you cannot tech the option. You WILL be hit and reset unless you wake up attack.

A Shazam player can knock you down and say "The match is over.. I'm gonna command grab every time".. and you are fucked unless you wake up attack.. which they can read, because they have FORCED you to do it, and punish with a full combo.

 

[Tom Brady]

Lol, Shazam is terrible. Tom you failed to mention a multitude of things in this guide. Thankfully Ive put extensive time in with shazam, so ive developed my mindset to truly understand all the opponents options, and how bad he is.

-After a sweep a character can wake up, or not wake up. You didn't factor in, if the opponent has a way to get a combo OFF there wake up option. For instance, black adam could meter burn his cage on wake up, and get a full combo. Superman could meter burn his frost breath on wake up, flash can meter burn his lightning kick on wake up. This means its not a "oh i guessed wrong its alright i took minor damage" situation anymore.
-Second what if a character has a safe wake up option that moves the character body as you said. What if grundy does a wake up walking corps, and cancels it so he doesn't do the grab? What if green arrow does his safe wake up exploding arrow back dash(which you can't jump over, and teleporting through doesn't allow for a punish".
-Third what if a character mix's up what wake up options they do, so baiting a punish is a mix up of its own? What if Joker mix's up his wake up acid blossom wake up, and his crowbar wake up which moves him forward? One avoids any jumping cross ups shazam could do, but the other is safe. Both beat the wake up throw.

In a vaccum shazam can be made to sound good, but his reset isn't devastating. Not to mention his neutral game is bad. Every character has strengths, but nobody attempting to place in a tournament will use shazam over someone like superman. Its the exact reason every top player like yourself uses a top tier character, yet crushes any suggestion to buff a character who clearly needs help.

Again wrong.. Shazam is a YOLO character. He command grab resets constantly to force the wake up..

1. The wake up attack has to have some for of invincibility, so not just any wake up attack will do.

2. If the opponent uses an attack such as BA lightning cage.. You can always make a read, let it whiff, and full combo punish.

 

[Cage Redfield]

22 into HM isn't a trap setup, only if you block the 2nd hit standing, which is easy to see and realize what Shazam is doing and avoid, by ducking after the first hit. On top of this, characters can actually down 1 to beat this. Even better, Grundy can down 2 after crouch-blocking 22's first hit. Grundy down 2 leads to about, uhm, 50%. Black Adam Black Magic leads to a full combo, so maybe a bit more than that or a little less?

Funnily enough, this same concept is actually impossible against Lobo 12 xx Czar Toss. The character with the real trap setup is considered a really bad character, while the character whose trap setup gets beat by anyone's down 1/reversal after seeing the 2nd hit coming is better.


OK

 

[Uotan]

Yes they do.

.

Ambiguous crossup isn't a loop, when their options are wakeup or block a direction, even at complete random, it's not a 50/50.

 

[Redk9]

Again wrong.. Shazam is a YOLO character. He command grand constantly to force the wake up..

1. The wake up attack has to have some for of invincibility, so not just any wake up attack will do.

2. If the opponent uses an attack such as BA lightning cage.. You can always make a read, let it whiff, and full combo punish.

1. Every wake up option I mentioned has invincibility with the exception of grundy's which has 3 points of armor(that beats HM). I used shazam so I tested nearly every wake up option, more extensively then you probably did.

2. Yes you can make that whiff, but the point is shazam is now just as much at risk at eating a full combo if he guesses wrong as black adam is. What a great mechanic for a character to be entirely based off of.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

Ambiguous crossup isn't a loop, when their options are wakeup or block a direction, even at complete random, it's not a 50/50.

It isn't as good of a mixup but it's still an extremely strong mixup. Also every J3 goes into a 223 / 22 xx low scoop mixup if you want.

 

[JaredL]

Again wrong.. Shazam is a YOLO character. He command grab resets constantly to force the wake up..

1. The wake up attack has to have some for of invincibility, so not just any wake up attack will do.

2. If the opponent uses an attack such as BA lightning cage.. You can always make a read, let it whiff, and full combo punish.

And what if you don't make the read? Its a 50/50. You can either do 37% if you read right, or black adam can do 42% if he reads right.

 

[Redk9]

And what if you don't make the read? Its a 50/50. You can either do 37% if you read right, or black adam can do 42% if he reads right.

Glad you understand my point.

 

[MrSunshine]

Could you do a stop thinking joker is bad video ples? Tom Brady

 

[Tom Brady]

22 into HM isn't a trap setup, only if you block the 2nd hit standing, which is easy to see and realize what Shazam is doing and avoid, by ducking after the first hit. On top of this, characters can actually down 1 to beat this. Even better, Grundy can down 2 after crouch-blocking 22's first hit. Grundy down 2 leads to about, uhm, 50%. Black Adam Black Magic leads to a full combo, so maybe a bit more than that or a little less?

Funnily enough, this same concept is actually impossible against Lobo 12 xx Czar Toss. The character with the real trap setup is considered a really bad character, while the character whose trap setup gets beat by anyone's down 1/reversal after seeing the 2nd hit coming is better.


OK

If you crouch the second hit, yes...

You cannot D1 Shazam out of 22~command throw unless you block the second hit crouching. There is no way to interrupt unless you do so.

1. If you block the second hit crouching, you can use a 6 frame D1 to beat the high command throw and the torpedo.

2. 22~Low throw will ALWAYS beat the interrupt attempt. They can stand up and cause the low throw to whiff.


SO...

If the opponent tries to interrupt with any standing attack or block, command throw.

If the opponent tries to crouch or BD, torpedo.

If the opponent wants to mash D1 or uppercut, low throw.

 

[RYX]

Can you make a video like this for Bane? It's becoming such a heartache seeing him suffer ;_;

 

[JaredL]

If you crouch the second hit, yes...

You cannot D1 Shazam out of 22~command throw unless you block the second hit crouching. There is no way to interrupt unless you do so.

1. If you block the second hit crouching, you can use a 6 frame D1 to beat the high command throw and the torpedo.

2. 22~Low throw will ALWAYS beat the interrupt attempt. They can stand up and cause the low throw to whiff.


SO...

If the opponent tries to interrupt with any standing attack or block, command throw.

If the opponent tries to crouch or BD, torpedo.

If the opponent wants to mash D1 or uppercut, low throw.

Or you can backdash after a blocked 22...

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

Why say that Lobo sucks and Shazam is one of the best in the game when Lobo has all of Shazam's setups but waaaay better?

Every command grab is 37% into another command grab 50/50 mixup.

Shazam gets 37% but it ends his mixups. He can only do 32% if he wants a command grab setup.


Lobo also has way better command grab setups on block... So why say that Lobo sucks but Shazam is one of the best in the game...?

 

[Tom Brady]

Or you can backdash after a blocked 22...

If you crouch the second hit, yes...

You cannot D1 Shazam out of 22~command throw unless you block the second hit crouching. There is no way to interrupt unless you do so.

1. If you block the second hit crouching, you can use a 6 frame D1 to beat the high command throw and the torpedo.

2. 22~Low throw will ALWAYS beat the interrupt attempt. They can stand up and cause the low throw to whiff.


SO...

If the opponent tries to interrupt with any standing attack or block, command throw.

If the opponent tries to crouch or BD, torpedo.

If the opponent wants to mash D1 or uppercut, low throw.

 

[MashPotatoTower]

I actually think Shazam goes even in alot of match ups and looses few, but looses em fairly soundly. I have some ideas on mu in his favor but there are so many characters whom I haven't really played.
but I hold to my buffs none the less, good vid

 

[JaredL]

That sounds like another freaking 50/50 since torpedo isn't safe...

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

The problem is that Shazam has to make a good read to get like one torpedo off, or one low command grab, but if he misses ANY of those options, BOOM full combo.