Match-up Discussion 2013 Ermac MU Chart

[Death]

Ermac beats Mileena slightly. the only character that can get more damage of a block roll without meter is Sonya. Sonya gets about 45%

 

[STRYKIE]

Ermac beats Mileena slightly. the only character that can get more damage of a block roll without meter is Sonya. Sonya gets about 45%

Just out of curiosity, is this including guaranteed chip or legit damage?

 

[Death]

Just out of curiosity, is this including guaranteed chip or legit damage?

39% plus the 6% guaranteed chip.

 

[STRYKIE]

39% plus the 6% guaranteed chip.

In that respect Scorpion can punish the ball roll for 47% meterless and I've always been on the fence about whether Scorp/Mil is 5-5 or 6-4, there's a few other reasons why I think Scorp could have an advantage but this obviously isn't the place to discuss it lol. I can go into more detail in the Mileena forums if you like?

 

[Death]

In that respect Scorpion can punish the ball roll for 47% meterless and I've always been on the fence about whether Scorp/Mil is 5-5 or 6-4, there's a few other reasons why I think Scorp could have an advantage but this obviously isn't the place to discuss it lol. I can go into more detail in the Mileena forums if you like?

Scorpion vs Mileena is a very solid 5-5 and fair for both characters. What combo does 47%? I was under the assumption you would need to do ex hellfire to get the additional 8%

 

[STRYKIE]

Scorpion vs Mileena is a very solid 5-5 and fair for both characters. What combo does 47%? I was under the assumption you would need to do ex hellfire to get the additional 8%

B2 AA, JK Tele x2, D1~Spear, F2,1xxteleport, JIP, 1,1,1, for some reason B2 has no scaling on it when you use it on an airborne hitbox . Using it as a vortex setup does 41% alone.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

39% plus the 6% guaranteed chip.

41% I think you probably missed the MS B2 in the combo

Kiss > Dive Kick 21 xx Cartwheel > MS B2 > B21F2 > 112 xx MS 41%

 

[Death]

41% I think you probably missed the MS B2 in the combo

Kiss > Dive Kick 21 xx Cartwheel > MS B2 > B21F2 > 112 xx MS 41%

The bnb i go for is MS B2, NJ punch, slight dash kiss, dive kick~cartwheel, B21F2, 112~MS. It does 39%

I played around with the kiss starter but its a much slower imo. I think the MSB2 is about 12 frames faster and more consistent to be considered a bnb

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

EGP Wonder_Chef

So i am picking smoke to fight against in training mode.Can do the 47% combo punisher off B2 on his roll animation no problem. I pick mileena and it is like the combo changes entirely.
You do not seem to be able to land 22~tkp at all. It has to be 2~tkp.
Scaled to end at 40% like you said,
I am doing 12~tkp as the ender as well but its only giving me 37%.

Why does the damage change on mileena? Something to do with her roll animation?

Metzos i believe i know why i never used this punisher for roll out animations.
I always practice against mileena in training mode. When i was trying this combo
i must of saw the inconsistency it has with mileena and the damage.
I will continue to use this as a punisher now.

Because Mileena has no recovery on the ground, and apparently B2B1 scales differently based off of whether or not it hits in the air or on the ground.

Also the 22 is impossible because the more air hits in a combo, the faster you fall in a juggle, and if you hit them with B2B1 xx Lift out of the air, that's 3 more hits out of the air than if they're grounded.

 

[zaf]

Because Mileena has no recovery on the ground, and apparently B2B1 scales differently based off of whether or not it hits in the air or on the ground.

Also the 22 is impossible because the more air hits in a combo, the faster you fall in a juggle, and if you hit them with B2B1 xx Lift out of the air, that's 3 more hits out of the air than if they're grounded.

oh i didnt know about mileena and her roll.
and yea i know about the rest.

thanks for the info

 

[Metzos]

EGP Wonder_Chef

So i am picking smoke to fight against in training mode.Can do the 47% combo punisher off B2 on his roll animation no problem. I pick mileena and it is like the combo changes entirely.
You do not seem to be able to land 22~tkp at all. It has to be 2~tkp.
Scaled to end at 40% like you said,
I am doing 12~tkp as the ender as well but its only giving me 37%.

Why does the damage change on mileena? Something to do with her roll animation?

Metzos i believe i know why i never used this punisher for roll out animations.
I always practice against mileena in training mode. When i was trying this combo
i must of saw the inconsistency it has with mileena and the damage.
I will continue to use this as a punisher now.

You should. Its highly rewarding, as you can see.

 

[zaf]

You should. Its highly rewarding, as you can see.

Yea lol, i played online a bit today to get used to using this and it's retarded...
The timing is quite simple too.

I wish you could go into the blockstrings ermac has after a blocked b2 =[
One can only dream.

 

[Seven]

Ok I updated the MU chart, this is the final update.

 

[LionHeart]

Do you really think its 5-5 vs Skarlet and 3-7 vs Sonya? One thing Skarlet does better IMHO (can't stress the H enough) is getting in, since her Krimson Dash meakes her move 3/4 of the screen. Sonya has a more difficult time getting in but once she does, she pressures Ermac better. IMO Skarlet has a slight advantage on this matchup maybe 4.5-5.5 in her favor and I'M NOT BASING THIS on my matches vs Metzos (that's probably 1-9 in Metzos' favor)

 

[Seven]

Do you really think its 5-5 vs Skarlet and 3-7 vs Sonya? One thing Skarlet does better IMHO (can't stress the H enough) is getting in, since her Krimson Dash meakes her move 3/4 of the screen. Sonya has a more difficult time getting in but once she does, she pressures Ermac better. IMO Skarlet has a slight advantage on this matchup maybe 4.5-5.5 in her favor and I'M NOT BASING THIS on my matches vs Metzos (that's probably 1-9 in Metzos' favor)

Well I have never fought a Scarlett player that has beaten me more than 5-5. She can be zoned out, she does have armor but as long as you block high, she can't take you into a combo. And Skarlet can't anti-air, so I jump in on her all the time.

 

[LionHeart]

AssasiN[be]
Eddy Wang
L0rdoftheFLY
Ninj

What do you guys think about this?

 

[Qwark28]

Well I have never fought a Scarlett player that has beaten me more than 5-5. She can be zoned out, she does have armor but as long as you block high, she can't take you into a combo. And Skarlet can't anti-air, so I jump in on her all the time.

Feel like I need to say this in every damn MU thread, this is about EQUAL skill.

Eddy Wang skarlet can't AA, add that to your list.

 

[Seven]

Feel like I need to say this in every damn MU thread, this is about EQUAL skill.

Eddy Wang skarlet can't AA, add that to your list.

I've played people of equal skill, ask FOREVER KING, and about the AA.....what I mean is....... everyone in the game has some sort of AA, hers just sucks

 

[Qwark28]

I've played people of equal skill, ask FOREVER KING, and about the AA.....what I mean is....... everyone in the game has some sort of AA, hers just sucks

I mean in the skarlet matchup, that is what your post was about, unless forever king plays a character with a hat, teleport and divekick named skarlet.

 

[Seven]

I mean in the skarlet matchup, that is what your post was about, unless forever king plays a character with a hat, teleport and divekick named skarlet.

haha I just named someone good, that uses Skarlet. And I've fought some Skarlet mains, Mosp comes to mind, there are others I just can't remember.

 

[Qwark28]

Seven , as long as you block high she gets an 8% blockstring that builds half a bar of meter and can follow-up with EX daggers for another blockstring, there's no "block low/high" guideline for Skarlet, you have to block accordingly.

She can't be zoned out when all it takes is one projectile for her to not even launch you for 40% to a reset into guaranteed blockstrings and pressure, just get in, just like that.

dagger keep your zoning in check but you can outdamage her if you get one out, really easy bait for her armoured dash while you don't get much for countering a dagger.

she builds meter hella fast while ermac can't really get it due to his pressure having ridiculous holes and his zoning being handicapped in fear of getting his weeny cut off by EX dash, therefore, she can almost always break.

meterless skarlet is a whole different matchup, she's bullied by his zoning IF he can establish a solid zoning game by cutting her dagger cancel momentum, if she gets in though, she's got the meter back and mac is in trouble.

She CAN AA, 10f standing 1 to 30%+ reset with extra pressure, you need to play a real skarlet.

the way I see it, macaroni has to work very hard while cheese can just slide all over and in him and win purely through chip and EX dash threats, THA LAWD HAVE MERCY ON YALL POOR SOULS SHALL THEE RED MISTRESS HIT A DAWN OR UPETTH SLASH.

what mac SHOULD do is establish his zoning pressure and punish daggers whenever he can, she can't do shit other than interrupt momentum with her tiny ass 1% damage but she gets in fast, he needs to punish slashes, poke through high strings and zone her properly while respecting her dash.

 

[Qwark28]

haha I just named someone good, that uses Skarlet. And I've fought some Skarlet mains, Mosp comes to mind, there are others I just can't remember.

play someone like lawd of the flies or eddy wang or ninj and youll see what skarlet can do, playing someone who uses her and someone who mains her has vastly different results.

 

[Seven]

Seven , as long as you block high she gets an 8% blockstring that builds half a bar of meter and can follow-up with EX daggers for another blockstring, there's no "block low/high" guideline for Skarlet, you have to block accordingly.

She can't be zoned out when all it takes is one projectile for her to not even launch you for 40% to a reset into guaranteed blockstrings and pressure, just get in, just like that.

dagger keep your zoning in check but you can outdamage her if you get one out, really easy bait for her armoured dash while you don't get much for countering a dagger.

she builds meter hella fast while ermac can't really get it due to his pressure having ridiculous holes and his zoning being handicapped in fear of getting his weeny cut off by EX dash, therefore, she can almost always break.

meterless skarlet is a whole different matchup, she's bullied by his zoning IF he can establish a solid zoning game by cutting her dagger cancel momentum, if she gets in though, she's got the meter back and mac is in trouble.

She CAN AA, 10f standing 1 to 30%+ reset with extra pressure, you need to play a real skarlet.

the way I see it, macaroni has to work very hard while cheese can just slide all over and in him and win purely through chip and EX dash threats, THA LAWD HAVE MERCY ON YALL POOR SOULS SHALL THEE RED MISTRESS HIT A DAWN OR UPETTH SLASH.

what mac SHOULD do is establish his zoning pressure and punish daggers whenever he can, she can't do shit other than interrupt momentum with her tiny ass 1% damage but she gets in fast, he needs to punish slashes, poke through high strings and zone her properly while respecting her dash.

so 5-5?

 

[Qwark28]

play this MU offline whenever you can before making numbers IMO, skarlet is shit and ermac is THA ALMIGHT LAWD online

 

[Qwark28]

so 5-5?

the way i see it its a hard 6 4 for ermac, i like to use decimals so 6,5-3,5 IMO