Tournament Viable Characters for 2013

[Rude]

What happened to Mileena being "dead" and "figured out?"

 

[Vagrant]

What happened to Mileena being "dead" and "figured out?"

Fox

 

[Rude]

No love for Jer..... :-(

 

[Eddy Wang]

Fox

dat kid is fucking scary i have to say it, actually the player in U.S that scares the hell out of me its him, he makes godlike reads

 

[Vagrant]

dat kid is fucking scary i have to say it, actually the player in U.S that scares the hell out of me its him, he makes godlike reads

And the Mil forums are STILL dead. It's sad man.

He was my favorite to watch at WB though man, wow!

 

[Treadmill]

there were a lot of reptile players

MIT
TylerLantern
Chris Geesus
Cossner
Nubcakes (severely underrated player)
Chongo(maybe?)
THTB(did he play within the last year?)
Joker (he might have used Jax too?)
Showtime (but he dropped him now)
Myself

all mained Reptile and took him to a major within the last year.

I main him to and have done ok in tournaments. I'm just saying viability isn't measured by only the way ppl perform with him. Like I said look at kenshi. Who else has done anything with kenshi?

 

[Zoidberg747]

LBSH, as BlackBryan proved over the weekend, the entire cast is viable. It will take more work with some characters than others.

This is 2011 talk. The only way low tiers win is if they don't meet their 2-8, 1-9 matchups.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

Hmm.. I think everyone wants to make this issue simpler than it really is. In all honesty, there are 2 types of 'viable' characters:

1) Characters that can reasonably and reliably make their way into top 5, without any help from alternates.

2) Characters that are viable in top5, but may need some additional help to get there.

For example, there aren't a lot of cage players outside of Dizzy that are reaching top5 with only cage; however cage is still a viable character in top5, and a threat people have to respect. Similarly MIT Clint and other people have shown that Reptile is viable at the higher end of the bracket .. but he usually needs some help to get there.

If you're going to make an argument about Scorpion only making top8 only because of Slips, you should probably say the same thing about Mileena and Pig/SonicFox. But even now, how many Mileenas are threatening to win a tournament without an alt? How many lao's are able to go all the way without an alt? People that previously were ok going all-Lao are now getting blown up before top 8.

Kabal Freddy and Kenshi seem to be fine on their own. Maybe Sonya too. Cyrax seems to be able to make his way comfortably to Top 5.

Anyway, I just think it's not as cut-and-dried as people make it out to be.

 

[Lt. Boxy Angelman]

The fact that there arent enough people who play one of everyone to their consistent, full potential makes ths an impossible call to me.

We may never know...but if a list had to be made, I'd add Rain, Reptile, Ermac and that's it.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

I main him to and have done ok in tournaments. I'm just saying viability isn't measured by only the way ppl perform with him. Like I said look at kenshi. Who else has done anything with kenshi?

I think a lot of that has to do with the lack of Kenshi players though.

Blackula does consistently well.

Blindman only went to one major, but he didn't place that high. =[

King Hippo is in the same boat, but I think he plays multiple characters too.


Are there any other real Kenshi mainers that go to tournaments?


And sorry I didn't know you went to any majors. I see you got 17th at Colombus though which is definitely worth putting on that list.

 

[Rude]

The fact that there arent enough people who play one of everyone to their consistent, full potential makes ths an impossible call to me.

We may never know...but if a list had to be made, I'd add Rain, Reptile, Ermac and that's it.

<3 you.

Rep and Big Mac, definitely.

 

[LEGEND]

partially using a character in tournament, like as a secondary or for a few bad MUs doesn't make that character tournament viable. We are talking 100% solo mains that are viable
-

Sektor is a weird case imo, he can handle alot of the most popular tournament characters and only has 2 3-7s imo (mileena and Kabal, if they play it correctly). Problem i see with this though is he doesn't beat enough character and everyone can have a pocket Mileena to deal with him cause that MU is braindead easy to learn

 

[Treadmill]

I think a lot of that has to do with the lack of Kenshi players though.

Blackula does consistently well.

Blindman only went to one major, but he didn't place that high. =[

King Hippo is in the same boat, but I think he plays multiple characters too.


Are there any other real Kenshi mainers that go to tournaments?


And sorry I didn't know you went to any majors. I see you got 17th at Colombus though which is definitely worth putting on that list.

that's what I mean I guess. You can't base the viability solely off of how many ppl do well with that character especially in our tiny non traveling community.

 

[KRYS9984]

I feel that Ermac, Sector and even Quan-Chi have a good chance of placing well in tournaments (out of the lower A / B tier). Unfortunately, not many people main them but they have the necessary tools to put up a good fight against the higher tier characters.

It all comes down to the player and how they utilize their strengths; however, as CrimsonShadow mentioned, they might need a pocket (insert character here) to cover their bad match-ups and secure a top 5 / top 8 position.

 

[Justice]

This is 2011 talk. The only way low tiers win is if they don't meet their 2-8, 1-9 matchups.

Every character has losing matchups, so I guess you could say the same thing about the entire cast as well.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

Treadmill
Also can we look at Reptile's matchups?

I mean just look at him vs all the characters on Pig's list.

Jax - Maybe Even (Tyrant makes it look bad, but it's Tyrant so who knows?)
Shang Tsung - Even
Smoke - Maybe even
Mileena - Maybe even or slight disadvantage

Liu Kang - Loses
Kung Lao - Loses
Johnny Cage - Loses
Cyrax - Loses BAD
Sonya Blade - Loses BAD
Kabal - Loses
Freddy Krueger - Loses

Kenshi - Originally though even, but Pig thinks Reptile loses, I agree.

Kitana - Originally Reptile's favor, but getting closer to even now IMO. When is the last time a Reptile beat a top Kitana? MIT lost to a Kitana at Dallas with Rep, Nubcakes (who is REALLY good) lost to a Kitana at SCR, and I saw at the last BnB TylerLantern lost in GF to a Kitana. Kitanas have really adapted and learned to play this matchup smart.

so how can a char who has MAYBE ONE winning matchup (Kitana) out of all of the top 13 characters be tournament viable? Especially when more than half of those matchups are losing ones.

 

[GuamoKun]

EGP Wonder_Chef

I beat a Reptile player at SCR...with Kitana.

Its finally happening.

 

[PPJ]

Everybody is tourney viable. Trash tier like Kano and Sheeva are fine as long as you have a secondary that covers their bad MU's, or a top 10 character

 

[RiBBz22]

I think Sektor is the big time bubble character here

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

@EGG Wonder_Chef

I beat a Reptile player at SCR...with Kitana.

Its finally happening.

These damn tenacious Kitana players are learning the matchup!

 

[Phosferrax]

I think Raiden is definitely a viable character, even though there haven't been any major results with him. In time...

 

[Lulzlou]

Kitana - Originally Reptile's favor, but getting closer to even now IMO. When is the last time a Reptile beat a top Kitana? MIT lost to a Kitana at Dallas with Rep, Nubcakes (who is REALLY good) lost to a Kitana at SCR, and I saw at the last BnB TylerLantern lost in GF to a Kitana. Kitanas have really adapted and learned to play this matchup smart.

so how can a char who has MAYBE ONE winning matchup (Kitana) out of all of the top 13 characters be tournament viable? Especially when more than half of those matchups are losing ones.

this just means kitana players need to stop downplaying

 

[coolwhip]

Tournament Viable Characters for 2013

Definition of tournament viable - proven to be able to either win or place top 5 at a major in its current state.

Liu Kang
Kung Lao
Johnny Cage
Mileena
Cyrax
Smoke
Sonya Blade
Jax
Shang Tsung
Kabal
Kitana
Kenshi
Freddy Krueger

Thoughts?

I'd add Reptile, potentially Skarlet, and even Raiden. Though not sure if they would qualify given the definition you provided. I just believe they're good enough as characters.

 

[coolwhip]

Yes but Dizzy didn't face any high level Kabal's, Kenshi's, or Freddy's.... it has to be a perfect storm of MU's for a pure Cage to win it all.... A character with 3 7-3 MU's cannot win a Major (30 people does not equate to a major IMO)

He actually beat CD Jr's Kabal in that tournament (SB), and had just beaten M2Dave's Freddy at MLG Raleigh.

 

[STRYKIE]

On the flipside of all this, are some characters only getting a bigger breakthrough than they really should be because of other players undermining the matchup? It still takes a committed player to elaborate on the furthest extents of the character. Which is probably why we'll never know where Rain stands.

Scorpian's pokes are too shit to make him viable, his risk/reward on vortex does not balance well against many of the top tier characters... def should not be on the list.

The fact that you began your argument spelling his name wrong fortifies that you don't know the first thing about Scorpion's problems at a high level. What would normal pokes do for him, "guaranteed" 7% hellfire? Whoop-dee-do.

Trying to imagine a flowchart of how Scorpion is played is a guaranteed losing recipe, you'll get D1~speared 10 for 10 and make the Cage matchup look 5-5. As I previously mentioned, the idea that he's nothing but full screen spears and random guesses is probably the biggest reason he gets as far as he does in the first place.