Gun Reform?

[rev0lver]

So people are just going to keep guns in their family with no access to legal ammunition and no legal way to use the firearm? In that case, keep the buyback open indefinitely, add every person with a reported lost or stolen weapon to a federal watch list, and impose huge penalty enhancements (much like hate crime laws) to any crimes involving firearms. At a certain point, the money incentive will win out over being a criminal.

That's the problem though. The responsible gun owners who use their guns for protection would be far more likely to give up their guns than the ones intending to use them for criminal purposes.

 

[Illmatix]

That seems like a pretty reasonable change. 3 less rounds could potentially be 3 people still alive if someone chooses to go on a shooting spree, and it's pretty unlikely that you'd need more than 7 if you're not going around trying to kill people.

The slippery slope argument is never a good argument though. Because someone doesn't think 10 rounds is necessary doesn't mean they will keep going down until there's nothing.

What if I said "They're taking two strips of bacon off the baconator?????? Soon the baconator will have no bacon!" or "Video game prices are going up $5?????? In just a few years they could be a billion dollars!"

yea personally i think smaller clip size is a silly idea. 2 pistols= 14 rounds anyways plus it doesn't take that much time to reload.

 

[rev0lver]

Crazy people like the ones that do mass shootings usually spend a lot of time in shady places (virtual online places) like the Onion webbrowser or whatever its called, I have checked it out and having guns delivered to your house is actually very easy that way. The surviving thing is true, although the las guy at sandy hook killed himself right?

I heard about that yesterday actually. There was a news report where some kid stumbled across a site on there where you can buy illegal weapons. But I'm not sure how legitimate that would be considering you can easily rip people off that way, and it could be a government trap.

The sandy hook shooter did kill himself, but we don't know if he planned on that or not.

 

[rev0lver]

yea personally i think smaller clip size is a silly idea. 2 pistols= 14 rounds anyways plus it doesn't take that much time to reload.

That's true, but also 2 pistols = 14 rounds instead of 20. The thing is, the few seconds it takes to reload could be the difference between stopping/escaping the shooter and not. Overall, it comes to cost-benefit. I think it's more likely that a shooter having a smaller clip would cause less damage than a person having to fire more than 7 rounds in self defense.

 

[TakeAChance]

I have a question...

How many gangs go out in broad day light and start opening fire on innocent people?

I get it, the rough areas are rough. Would they be rough without guns?

 

[Illmatix]

That's true, but also 2 pistols = 14 rounds instead of 20. The thing is, the few seconds it takes to reload could be the difference between stopping the shooter and not. Overall, it comes to cost-benefit. I think it's more likely that a shooter having a smaller clip would cause less damage than a person having to fire more than 7 rounds in self defense.

yea this wont effect me when i buy gun, and i think a lot of people will just move to .45z due to the small clip size and higher firepower anyways.

 

[Illmatix]

I have a question...

How many gangs go out in broad day light and start opening fire on innocent people?

I get it, the rough areas are rough. Would they be rough without guns?

yes cause alot of the times muggings are done with knives anyways.
drive by's happen in broad daylight more than you would think.

 

[rev0lver]

I have a question...

How many gangs go out in broad day light and start opening fire on innocent people?

I get it, the rough areas are rough. Would they be rough without guns?

They don't go around massacring people, but there are robberies, being in the wrong place at the wrong time, etc. Thankfully I don't live in a place where I find it necessary to have one, but I can really see why some people feel safer with it.

They wouldn't be as rough without guns, obviously. But most of these people don't get their guns legally in the first place.

 

[TakeAChance]

Wow, there are 270,000,000 firearms in the united states. That is insane!

 

[rev0lver]

Wow, there are 270,000,000 firearms in the united states. That is insane!

You're damn right it is, personally I find the number disgusting. But that's also why I find it really unlikely that the government would be able to recover them all if they did try to ban them.

 

[Illmatix]

You're damn right it is, personally I find the number disgusting. But that's also why I find it really unlikely that the government would be able to recover them all if they did try to ban them.

that's nutz lol i mean the number lol srry for that

 

[TakeAChance]

They don't go around massacring people, but there are robberies, being in the wrong place at the wrong time, etc. Thankfully I don't live in a place where I find it necessary to have one, but I can really see why some people feel safer with it.

They wouldn't be as rough without guns, obviously. But most of these people don't get their guns legally in the first place.

I live in Canada so forgive me if I can't understand it the way you folks do. I understand that places can be rough, and places like NY, Philly, etc. hold stigmas about mugging and robberies, but at the same time I just can't help but feel that the 270,000,000 guns in the states may be contributing to more of this type of behavior than preventing it.

I don't think we will ever see guns outlawed in the states, but I cannot see how someone can reasonably argue against STRICTER regulations for aquiring/owning a gun. There should be a straight up ban on assault type weapons tho. Leave that shit for the military.

 

[TakeAChance]

Just to give you a comparison.

The united states has 270,000,000 firearms right now.

Canada has just under 10,000,000

 

[Zoidberg747]

Wow, there are 270,000,000 firearms in the united states. That is insane!

We have 88 per 100 residents.

Yeah....

 

[nwo]

10 million guns were sold last month in December 2012, the previous all time high was about 5 million in a single month. I think this is a wonderful thing because more guns into the hands of law abiding citizens makes the world a safer place.

Here's a great video. From one of the pro gun rallies over the weekend.

 

[TakeAChance]

10 million guns were sold last month in December 2012, the previous all time high was about 5 million in a single month. I think this is a wonderful thing because more guns into the hands of law abiding citizens makes the world a safer place.

Here's a great video. From one of the pro gun rallies over the weekend.

*Looks at American vs Canadian crime rates...*

I am shocked that judging by these statistics (http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Canada/United-States/Crime) that Canada and the US are quite similar in crime rates but there are a few telling categories. Please take note that I have no idea how legit these stats are, and I also do not know the year published.

Canada has higher victims of assault at 2.3 percent than the U.S.(1.2%) (this shocked me)

The U.S. Has 7 times more car thefts and jackings than Canada (Could be due to having more guns, which makes it easier to jack)

Canada has an absolute rediculous ammount of drug offenses. (92,590 per 100,000 people...I have a hard time believeing this statistic) compared to 560 out of 100,000 people from the U.S.

The U.S. has 5x more people in prison than Canada.

Canada has higher suicide rates (very marginal. The difference is not very much)

We Canadians sure do like to pirate software.

The U.S. Has an absolutely ASTOUNDING total crime count for that particular year: 11,877,218 compared to Canada's 2,516,918 count.

Canada however has a 2% higher count of total crime VICTIMS.

Judging from these stats, you can see that guns COULD (correlation does not prove cause) be the reason that Canada has a higher victim percentage compared to the U.S.

The spin side of that is that guns COULD (once again correlation does not...) be the reason the total ammount of crimes is 5x higher than Canada's and #1 in the world.

 

[nwo]

I was trying to post something that was too long, I don't want to spam. The World Health Organization Murder Statistics for the world, Murders per 100,000 citizens. The United States ranks among the lowest on that list with 4.2.

Here's a list from Wikipedia, the numbers vary slightly depending on the year. (The latest numbers say 3.9 for the North American subregion and 4.8 for the United States, if I'm reading it right)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

 

[TakeAChance]

I was trying to post something that was too long, I don't want to spam. The World Health Organization Homicide Statistics for the world, Murders per 100,000 citizens. The United States ranks among the lowest on that list with 4.2.

According to those same stats

Canada has a 1.6 rate and 554 defined homocide cases. (Person intentionally murdering someone)

The U.S. rates 4.2 with 14,748 defined homocide cases.

That is over 26 x higher than Canada.

Lets look at the statistic for the amount of guns. Canada has just under 10,000,000 so for estimating we will say 9.8 million guns. The U.S. has 120,000,000 fire arms currently.

The U.S. Has 27.55 times more guns than Canada.

The Us has 26 times higher homocide rates than Canada.

These numbers are strikingly similar.

Once again, Correlation does not prove cause, but comparisons can definitely be made.

 

[nwo]

The United States has a very low homicide rate per 100,000 citizens compared to the majority of the world.

Disarmed places like Chicago have the highest homicide rates in our Country. Chicago is the murder capital of the world.

 

[TakeAChance]

The United States has a very low homicide rate per 100,000 citizens compared to the majority of the world.

Do they tho? The majority of the world is not as developed as the United States.

When you take into account that African countries are being calculated and other areas of developement, yes the U.S. has a very low homocide rate in comparison.

Lets look at the stats for the top 10 Highly Developed Countries.

Source: http://listverse.com/2012/02/13/top-10-highly-developed-countries/ (via Human development index)

In Descending order (#10 - #1)
The number beside the Country represents their homocide rate per 100,000 people and count.

Sweden - 1.0 and 91
Germany - .8 and 690
Liechtenstein - 2.8 and 1
Ireland - 1.2 and 54
Canada - 1.6 and 554
New Zealand - .9 and 39
United States of America - 4.8 and 14, 748
Netherlands - 1.1 and 179
Australia - 1.0 and 229
Norway - .06 and 29

As you can see, out of the top 10 most developed countries, The U.S. actually is the worst for homocide.

 

[GutiSapiens]

Leave that shit for the military.

And the gang members, drug dealers and terrorists, don't forget those guys. They won't be turning in their weapons any time soon.

 

[TakeAChance]

And the gang members, drug dealers and terrorists, don't forget those guys. They won't be turning in their weapons any time soon.

Don't be a puppet. An assault rifle is not giving you any resistance to those people anyways. Unless you know they are coming for you, I doubt you have (and you shouldn't) have an assault rifle on your persons at all times.

 

[GutiSapiens]

Don't be a puppet. An assault rifle is not giving you any resistance to those people anyways. Unless you know they are coming for you, I doubt you have (and you shouldn't) have an assault rifle on your persons at all times.

Who does? Does the fact that they are permitted mean that you carry it to the supermarket? NO Does it mean that if you get into an argument you will kill everybody around with an Ak-47? NO.

What's wrong is forbidding people something that delinquents carry around freely.

And does the fact that they are not coming for me mean that they will do me no harm? (robbery or deal went wrong) NO.

 

[TakeAChance]

Who does? Does the fact that they are permitted mean that you carry it to the supermarket? NO Does it mean that if you get into an argument you will kill everybody around with an Ak-47? NO.

What's wrong is forbidding people something that delinquents carry around freely.

And does the fact that they are not coming for me mean that they will do me no harm? (robbery or deal went wrong) NO.

But you said it yourself. Odds are that you wouldn't have the assault rifle on you anyways (it's impractical).

Delinquents may carry guns, but with stricter gun control there would be less delinquents carrying them around. This would be most notable in the years to come.

 

[Illmatix]

perhaps a special aptitude test for a gun collecting license? that way avid gun collecters can still collect. and you can only have the guns on your property.