Strategy The Subzero tech/strat video thread

[xQUANTUMx]

Beefy did uncharged B2 to me the other day, left me staggered, I was like wtf? that's plus? lol....still learning.

 

[EGP Wonder_Chef]

can you do like deep jump kick > 22 xx slide?

it's really hard to test this without someone to help

 

[Lord Beef]

can you do like deep jump kick > 22 xx slide?

it's really hard to test this without someone to help

I can imagine it would work, BUT im not sure if the djk launches the opponent high enough to to that in that situation. I know on a standing opponent it works though....good question. Must test.

Beefy did uncharged B2 to me the other day, left me staggered, I was like wtf? that's plus? lol....still learning.

LoL, that was hella by accident too. I fucked up the dash cancel. But what does happen, the frame adv is a nice fail safe and I just go straight for 22/or 212 and confirm to clone or freeze.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

Freeze someone in a d4 position? what?

ya know... when sonya approaches you with d4 and you clone and she's frozen but you can't JIP b1,2,1.

I THOUGHT YOU SZ PEOPLE HAD FRIENDS!!!!

 

[ryublaze]

ya know... when sonya approaches you with d4 and you clone and she's frozen but you can't JIP b1,2,1.

I THOUGHT YOU SZ PEOPLE HAD FRIENDS!!!!

Oh, I always did 2,1,2,slide but idk if thajt does more damage thjan 224 slide. Sometimes I'm able to get a 2,1,4,slide but i think that's character specific. What's weird is that if you try to jump over them and combo then you'll just phase through them and go back to the other side.

 

[DJLO]

this is just a continuation of the last video youve posted, but it goes more in depth into what you can "grab freeze" people into:

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

Outside of trying to time a fully charged b2, I have no idea.

Sent from my scrubby HTC Thunderbolt using Tapatalk

There's really not a better punish. I like to use (2)24~freeze sometimes when thery're close to the wall because i can put a clone out afterward (assuming they don't wakeup). You can also use uncharged b2 for 5-7% damage and +12 advantage where you can get more chip afterward.
^This might be the best thing to use when the other player is cornered. Overall (2)24~slide does decent damage and pushes your opponent toward the wall, so it's not bad at all.

I can imagine it would work, BUT im not sure if the djk launches the opponent high enough to to that in that situation. I know on a standing opponent it works though....good question. Must test.


LoL, that was hella by accident too. I fucked up the dash cancel. But what does happen, the frame adv is a nice fail safe and I just go straight for 22/or 212 and confirm to clone or freeze.

Now, I know STB CharlieMurphy is not a fan of this but whenever I freeze someone in a low position I'll dash in and do an uncharged B2 which puts you at advantage plus w/e damage it does then you get a free blockstring. I go with 212 clone and look to hit confirm it.

cyusstrike taught me this.

 

[Lord Beef]

Now, I know STB CharlieMurphy is not a fan of this but whenever I freeze someone in a low position I'll dash in and do an uncharged B2 which puts you at advantage plus w/e damage it does then you get a free blockstring. I go with 212 clone and look to hit confirm it.

cyusstrike taught me this.

I do this or I will go all out and b2...this is match up dependent of course.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

Posting these here as well (also on raiden forums for other reasons).

First things first. I know.... I suck at cross up defense. If we can ignore this fact and simply talk about the MU i'd really appreciate it. How you guys approach raiden, what tricks you have. ECT ECT. I do not get alot of Raiden MU experience.... and it shows. I felt like Reed outplayed me most of the time, and I got some wins with gutsy reads and better reactions.
I'm at your mercy

and the second half (shorter)

 

[Tom Brady]

Here are the main rules of fighting Raiden:

1. do not start off by chasing him, make him commit to getting the lead or the round will be a 90 second draw.

2. For first hit, if he zones, always ex slide. This prevents him from getting breaker and gives you the lead. Now if he commits and is wrong, he cant break.

3. Rarely use 212~clone on Raiden, use 214. The logic is that if he is going to punish you, make sure he has to spend a bar of meter for that 10% ex superman. Using 212 allows him to teleport and punish you with more damage and spend no meter to do it.

4. After eating enough roundhouse kicks for trying to teleport 212 when you instead use 214, now you can try a 212~clone setup in the corner. If he teleports you can punish. if he does air superman, you can still punish. If he does neither, you can try a corner trap.

5. If Raiden has meter and you fell a ex teleort set up coming, use D+4~clone. If he does a normal teleport, the D+4~clone comes out and you are at a good safe distance from raiden. If he does ex teleport, the D+4 whiffs, but you recover in time to block his attack.

6. When you have the lead and Raiden has no meter, it is very hard for Raiden to get you out of the corner. I'll have to make a vid to explain this.

 

[Tom Brady]

tbh.. Raiden would be a 6.5-3.5 adv IF we did a .5 system. Its not quite a 3-7, but its harder then 4-6.

 

[Seapeople]

Raiden can also teleport out of b12 so I'd especially avoid using that string against him. Sgt Reed wasn't really capitalizing on it though.
I pretty much never throw ice blasts until Raiden starts getting greedy with projectiles. But even then I try to sit on a clone since Raiden could blow me up with a teleport.

There were a couple times you missed confirming 21 into a combo (like at 1:24 in part 2). I think you were trying to punish Raiden in a way that you could keep him cornered? In those situations you could use 212~freeze, then dash into a deep jumpkick followed by a slide to reverse your positions. (Or just punish him with 22~freeze).

Also more throws are always good

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

Raiden can also teleport out of b12 so I'd especially avoid using that string against him. Sgt Reed wasn't really capitalizing on it though.
I pretty much never throw ice blasts until Raiden starts getting greedy with projectiles. But even then I try to sit on a clone since Raiden could blow me up with a teleport.

There were a couple times you missed confirming 21 into a combo (like at 1:24 in part 2). I think you were trying to punish Raiden in a way that you could keep him cornered? In those situations you could use 212~freeze, then dash into a deep jumpkick followed by a slide to reverse your positions. (Or just punish him with 22~freeze).

Also more throws are always good

We both didn't know he could teleport out of b1,2 on block.

Honestly... i missed more than a few small things. I rewatched it a noticed a few times I could of chipped him out to win and i would do a 2.2 delay. I have bad habits lol.

I really do appreciate the info.

 

[Qwark28]

Marvaz 's earlier post

subzero aint a character who can afford to 50/50 unless on a very good f4 read, he just does way too low damage and doesnt get many chances to do it

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

Marvaz 's earlier post

subzero aint a character who can afford to 50/50 unless on a very good f4 read, he just does way too low damage and doesnt get many chances to do it

not entirely true at all.

 

[Qwark28]

not entirely true at all.

check out his post... 22 ice puddle mixup?

im not talking about a b2 when someones frozen or anyhting, thats not a 50/50 that hurts him directly, subzero has to get that damage whenever he can because he rarely gets it, you cant afford to fuck around vs high lvl players mainly because you always have to use your setups and you barely do any damage at all, you shouldnt give that up unless youre 100% sure itl hit

 

[Marvaz]

Marvaz 's earlier post

subzero aint a character who can afford to 50/50 unless on a very good f4 read, he just does way too low damage and doesnt get many chances to do it

your right, which is why ill leave out any tech out the forums and keep catching people "off guard" at tourneys lol

 

[Qwark28]

your right, which is why ill leave out any tech out the forums and keep catching people "off guard" at tourneys lol

yep, thats what gimmicks do

 

[Seapeople]

This is a quote from the sonic hurricane footsies guide (http://sonichurricane.com/?page_id=1702).

"A gimmick works only once, because it’s a trick designed to counter the opponent’s most common reaction without properly accounting for alternatives. Of course shenanigans have their uses, but only until your opponent realizes that you’re bluffing about having anything else to resort to.
Your goal should be to get as close to a fully tactical gameplan as possible, because that’ll actually make your shenanigans considerably more effective as well. Remember, you don’t get in trouble for using shenanigans – you get in trouble for depending on them."

 

[Knoterror]

What do you guys think of this tech...

You get a Slide knockdown in the corner. HUUUGE guessing game for at this point Sub right? What I've been having a lot of success with lately is to immediately dash THROUGH them while they're grounded. I have yet to see someone reverse wakeup this gimmick. I usually go into D4~throw back into the corner or a D3~crossup.

 

[Seapeople]

What do you guys think of this tech...

You get a Slide knockdown in the corner. HUUUGE guessing game for at this point Sub right? What I've been having a lot of success with lately is to immediately dash THROUGH them while they're grounded. I have yet to see someone reverse wakeup this gimmick. I usually go into D4~throw back into the corner or a D3~crossup.

youtube.com/watch?v=iyxzkbkPRn0

This works really well from my experience unless there's better character-specific options available. Be careful about reversing their wakeup inputs though because if they stay grounded then you're stuck in the corner. I pretty much only do that to close out the round.

D3 into crossup usually doesn't turn out good in any situation but I'm guilty of it sometimes. It's a hard habit to break.

 

[Knoterror]

youtube.com/watch?v=iyxzkbkPRn0

This works really well from my experience unless there's better character-specific options available. Be careful about reversing their wakeup inputs though because if they stay grounded then you're stuck in the corner. I pretty much only do that to close out the round.

D3 into crossup usually doesn't turn out good in any situation but I'm guilty of it sometimes. It's a hard habit to break.

Nice, glad this is known.

EDIT: Different setup, nm

 

[Knoterror]

Got a possible new strategy against people that like to try and NJP you when you've got them cornered that will also hit them into a clone.

22 AA you say? Yes, if it's a close 212/222 clone... But this will work on any spaced clone, like 214 or 11.

Will need to test against humans before I post a video.

 

[Knoterror]

Okay, here we go. Tested in an actual match and is viable. This is also a good chunk more damage than your bnb AA 22~Freeze, (B1)2, 214~Slide as well.

Basically any AA D4~Slide ejects them from the corner. This can mean into ANY corner clone setup where the clone is tall enough.I use 214 and 11 here, but you get the idea. As you can see, you're also still largely attacking from behind the clone.

This is also nice because it's an option select. If you don't hit with the D4 AA, the Slide doesn't come out. So be careful of your clone timing. May finally be worth an occassional EX clone. Just another thing to keep in mind.

 

[Lord Beef]

Okay, here we go. Tested in an actual match and is viable. This is also a good chunk more damage than your bnb AA 22~Freeze, (B1)2, 214~Slide as well.

Basically any AA D4~Slide ejects them from the corner. This can mean into ANY corner clone setup where the clone is tall enough.I use 214 and 11 here, but you get the idea. As you can see, you're also still largely attacking from behind the clone.

This is also nice because it's an option select. If you don't hit with the D4 AA, the Slide doesn't come out. So be careful of your clone timing. May finally be worth an occassional EX clone. Just another thing to keep in mind.

Definitely not bad when you're going for raw damage/untechable knockdown over containment. Good stuff.