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Match-up Discussion LBSH Cyrax is Broken Mu Chart

HGTV Soapboxfan

"Always a Pleasure"
6-4 smoke?

lol really?

7-3 mileena? what?

And all those 7-3s!? Don't get me wrong i mostly agree with the list, but lbsh Smoke is one of his worst MUs, no one goes 7-3 against mileena and a lot of those 7-3 MUs you posted are 6-4s and even 5-5.
A lot of characters beat Mileena 7 3. Sonya for one
 

NKZero

Warrior
I think the numbers are a little exaggerated here tbh....also I cannot see Cyrax having just the one losing MU tbh. I'm pretty sure he loses to Freddy and I still believe (though I can accept it may be even) that he loses to Sektor. I still don't know why he doesn't lose to Kenshi (some say he beats him? :eek:). Anyways I'm no Cyrax expert so the only MU I can really talk about is the Sektor one.
 

NKZero

Warrior
EDIT: Denzell just saw the updated chart lol...I was thinking this sounds more reasonable haha. A question though. If Kitana beats Cyrax then how does Mileena lose 3-7? I presume that zoning is a big part of the reason why Kitana is successful right? Well what about instant air sais for Mileena? I know that's not the only thing but doesn't that help her cause?
 

NariTuba

disMember
EDIT: Denzell just saw the updated chart lol...I was thinking this sounds more reasonable haha. A question though. If Kitana beats Cyrax then how does Mileena lose 3-7? I presume that zoning is a big part of the reason why Kitana is successful right? Well what about instant air sais for Mileena? I know that's not the only thing but doesn't that help her cause?

Nah the zoning doesnt matter unless she has the life lead, and even then its just a nuisance. Kitana beats Cyrax because of her footsies. Also its hard for him to rush her down since he cant punish her d1 unless its at point black range. He cant stop her from doing her thing, he has to play her game.
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
EDIT: Denzell just saw the updated chart lol...I was thinking this sounds more reasonable haha. A question though. If Kitana beats Cyrax then how does Mileena lose 3-7? I presume that zoning is a big part of the reason why Kitana is successful right? Well what about instant air sais for Mileena? I know that's not the only thing but doesn't that help her cause?
Mileena just doesn't have good enough pressure to keep this even 6-4 and all her telekick can be punished with resets. her zoning just isn't good enough to make it significant against him. footsies aren't good enough either.
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
CSZ has 2 weaknesses:

- No armour
- No way of fighting instant air projectiles

Cyrax doesnt have:
- iAFBs
- As many guess games in his offense that raise the need for armour, in which case the Ex parry /close divekick will do the same thing.
at the highest lvl i feel it will only be 7-3 maybe 6-4 minimum
 
lol, hell no. his resets are inferior to cyrax's. he doesn't have a 50/50 command grab mixup (into death or another grab) either. cyrax >>>>>>>> smoke.
Command grab isn't a 50 50. You can break CG on reaction anytime it connects. Breaking CG puts cyrax at mid range his worst possition.
 
Wait wait wait wait. How is it difficult to get in with cyrax? He has a godlike d4 with massive advantage on hit, and close bomb helps back them into the corner. He also has an advancing move that, while slow, is advantage on block. Cyrax is almost as easy to get in with as sonya blade.
Smoke away
 

NariTuba

disMember
up close he beats smoke. and smoke zoning is not really relevant. his footsies are pretty good but b2 is too slow to be that much of a problem i think cyrax wins it.
b2 is 15 frames, fast enough so that you cant block it on reaction. His damage is as good as Cyrax, tho Cyrax gets a little more bang for his buck with 1 bar... tho this is compensated by the fact Smoke builds meter faster with zoning and shake cancels. You are forced to aproach him and get in up close because he wins the footsie game and can whiff punish rax d4 with sb for a kill.

If the Smoke is good he'll be doing b23~sb on hit and b23~smokeaway on block making his 50/50 completely safe.

I dont see Cyrax having any advantage at all... I could even agree with 6-4 Smoke.
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
b2 is 15 frames, fast enough so that you cant block it on reaction. His damage is as good as Cyrax, tho Cyrax gets a little more bang for his buck with 1 bar... tho this is compensated by the fact Smoke builds meter faster with zoning and shake cancels. You are forced to aproach him and get in up close because he wins the footsie game and can whiff punish rax d4 with sb for a kill.

If the Smoke is good he'll be doing b23~sb on hit and b23~smokeaway on block making his 50/50 completely safe.

I dont see Cyrax having any advantage at all... I could even agree with 6-4 Smoke.
That's where the footsies come in. if he does b1 rax can poke him before he gets it out. no need to throw out d4s on smoke. he's just cornering himself smoking away. cyrax has a net glitch so the smoke has to be careful with shaking. I don't see an advantage for smoke either besides his mediocre zoning. its all a footsie battle. maybe It should be 5-5. but rax reset is easier to hit from the air and ground. rax will get 60% minimum all the time if the rax player does it right its 100%. Smoke players can't do resets off the ground and air 100% of the time. I would say more of a 5-5. 6-4 is out of the question smoke has to win with footsies. but rax is just so much better up close I like 6-4 rax brokeness beats out smoke. 5-5s and 6-4s are hard to decide sometimes
 

HangNail

TrevarThePastor
Pretty good chart, although I disagree with Freddy, J.Cage and Mileena. Freddy crushes bombs and nets very effectively. Cage loses at a far, wins like a motherfucker up close. Mileena and cyrax both play super risky, teleports on nets into frame traps can be annoying, especially because the net is so slow.
 

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
Can you explain how kano makes it competitive for rax at the highest lvl? i'm just not seeing it.
Just because Kano is a 'bottom 5' character doesn't mean that he automatically gets steam rolled by a top 5 character. I can't say I have this MU experience, but I can probably safely assume that you don't either, so don't just go saying it's a shit MU without playing it extensively. 9-1 is ridiculous, and tbh, I think 8-2 is silly as well.
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
yes I know the mu. i dont care if he was bottom 5. Cyrax destroys kano in this version of the game. And i'm keeping 8-2. Vs me or any rax its bad for kano. lets see no trades.
upball huge punish.
no neutral string besides b1
rax with better mixups offense
can zone but doesn't have to
doesn't even have to use resets to beat him
 

SonicFox5000

The Best.
7-3 in cyraxs favor vs mil? Nah. More like 6-4 lol. This matchup is pretty easy to win if your playing a smart mil like muah
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
7-3 in cyraxs favor vs mil? Nah. More like 6-4 lol. This matchup is pretty easy to win if your playing a smart mil like muah
Mileena has to be too random to beat rax and rax punishes everything she does with at least 60%
I never lose to mileena with rax its too easy for rax especially when he gets the lead.
 

SonicFox5000

The Best.
Mileena has to be too random to beat rax and rax punishes everything she does with at least 60%
I never lose to mileena with rax its too easy for rax especially when he gets the lead.
No lol, just bait his bombs and net lol. Zone that whore, and you have no idea how i pressure people with mileena. You can be random, dont be risky. THERES A DIFFERENCE!
 

YOMI DJT

LIn Kuei Champion
No lol, just bait his bombs and net lol. Zone that whore, and you have no idea how i pressure people with mileena. You can be random, dont be risky. THERES A DIFFERENCE!
He doesn't have to throw bombs or nets to beat mileena. her pressure is not that great vs rax. rax can pressure her easier.