x-ray in hgh level gameplay

[THTB]

The damage we've seen X-Rays do is around 35-40% damage...which is actually more Super-ish. There hasn't been one higher than 40% so far.

Also, separate meter for breakers just throws out an aspect of meter management. Having multiple uses for one meter is good because it forces you to choose between what functions to use at what times. No, it's not MK-ish, but I think it's been established already that MK hasn't been MK since (pretty much) after UMK3, arguably after MK4.

Tbh, the way that meter is built is probably the only thing they actually will need to change. Better rewards for losing is definitely not a good mechanic. You should be awarded for making correct moves, not making mistakes.

 

[ChaosTheory]

Storms, I'm not talking about people who say X-Rays and Ultras are the same type of move. Because they are, basically. I'm talking about when people talk about X-Rays as if they have similar functionality and prevalence as Ultras. Which they do not. In that case, they are far more like Supers and quite dissimilar to Ultras.

-You gain an Ultra from taking around 50% of your life. There's no management there, it just happens. It resets every round and it still happens nearly every round between similarly skilled players. Not like X-Rays at all, really.

-You gain a Super from being active in building the meter. You then have to make the conscious decision to forfeit your EX moves and forfeit your FADC's in exchange for the possibility of landing a Super. That's a risk-reward type of meter-management. That's bascially the exact approach to MK9's meter. Just subsitute terms... EX/FADC/Super = Enhanced/Breaker/X-Ray


So ultimately, if you're concerned about X-Rays because of how Ultras impact SFIV, don't. They will not impact MK9 that much for a numerous reasons.

If you're concerned about X-Rays simply because of damage, you're being silly. Extremely common combos from MK3 through MKDC have yielded +35%-50%. And there was no meter management for those combos.

 

[prospic]

When there is CHECK....................the game will be broken.

 

[DanCock]

just thought i point out that the status effect after a xray isnt really a status effect.

some characters can do a combo into a Xray like Subby and Sektor, but they cant do any more hits after the xray.
while other characters cant combo into xray, but can xray then combo after --> like Cage and Kung.
then we have characters that cant do either but do more hits during the xray like Reptile, NW.

these alll seem to just give 44% ish max damage if done right.

The damage we've seen X-Rays do is around 35-40% damage...which is actually more Super-ish. There hasn't been one higher than 40% so far.

Also, separate meter for breakers just throws out an aspect of meter management. Having multiple uses for one meter is good because it forces you to choose between what functions to use at what times. No, it's not MK-ish, but I think it's been established already that MK hasn't been MK since (pretty much) after UMK3, arguably after MK4.

Tbh, the way that meter is built is probably the only thing they actually will need to change. Better rewards for losing is definitely not a good mechanic. You should be awarded for making correct moves, not making mistakes.

What he said. except for the "No, it's not MK-ish, but I think it's been established already that MK hasn't been MK since (pretty much) after UMK3, arguably after MK4."

adding something or taking away something doesnt make it not MK.. there was no run button in MK and MK2, but there was one in MK3-MKG. adding the run button doesnt make those games "not MKish" its just an added element.

 

[Shark Tank]

Another thing I think people are overreacting to is the "status effects" they mentioned some X-Rays will yield. I don't think they're going to disable your block for half the round or disable your jump half the round or anything like that. I actually think we've already seen one of the effects. Go back and look at Kung Lao do his X-Ray in the Dead Pool. He lands it, the opponent staggers for like a second and Kung Lao is able to quickly dash forward and finish with another ground-dial. The combo ended up being a little over 35% or something, I believe.

This is what I thought. I think Boon just translated X-rays you can combo out of as "not being able to block".

Anyway just to speculate, we've seen most of the x-rays have been physical attacks, either from direct hit or by counter(which is the only exception I've seen so far)

I wondering if we'll see another type, like a grab or...dare I say...a projectile X-ray

 

[THTB]

We have a projectile X-Ray in Sub's, Sektor's and Cyrax's.

 

[9.95]

1. X-rays in high level will be banned for being broken

or

2. X-rays in high level will be useless because breakers and ex-moves = better strategy than wasting them for an extra 4% in a combo

 

[THTB]

For the most part, that's what I see, though I think it's highly doubtful that they'll be broke. There aren't even invincibility frames on them. They're just fast.

For some matchups, though, they might be useful...and I can see people risking to wait for the X-Ray for the ones with counter X-Rays.

 

[Shark Tank]

We have a projectile X-Ray in Sub's, Sektor's and Cyrax's.

0_0

Damn, I thought he teleported into it. Now I have to rethink this. :throwcomputer:

 

[THTB]

Cyrax's is probably the scariest one of those three since his is angled into the air for AA purposes.

 

[MKF30]

Won't know until we play the game.

The safe and logical answer ^ realistically speaking yet obvious in the same respect. But we can speculate til then although it's no more gimmicky then SF4's meters or SC's meters or any fighters with a meter for that matter...if its' apart of the gameplay, I definitely don't see it as gimmicky...I think all fighters milk the whole "meter" thing now IMO.

Now, my theory personally I THINK but obviously am not sure for certain but believe that it will be used in SOME cases in high level play, others not so much..I'm thinking people will manage the meter and use their breakers in more tight situations and perhaps with special move extenders for more combo damage. Now, you can save your X-ray for more damage but think about it...if you use it, and your foe blocks it or dodges it then you just wasted a whole meter...so the X-ray is really "risk vs. reward" if you think about....nail your foe for easy 45%+damage or miss it/screw it up and waste an entire meter and have nothing....lol

I'll tell ya right now lol it's going to come down to easiest set ups, most damaging X-ray attacks and easiest ones to do...the scrubs will try to win off that alone(we all know this as well as the players who get desperate and have no actual "game" aside from owee "my meter's full!, X-ray time!"

I think it will be something that will attemped to be used and abused but only in key situations and in the right hands of a smart, elite player will they be really useful.

Few other things I have to say here, 3 breakers=bad idea IMO.....I'd much rather the chance to earn more breakers depending on how the match is going instead of using 3 breakers or as in some cases(in MK D and MKA) the 2 for 1 breaker glitch was retarded...you lost 2 breakers right there(example, think JC in MKA and I think it was who?Havik in MK D?) Either way...I am very against having limited breakers of just 3 again...

As for wasting damage on X-ray's....I don't think that's entirely true(if every one of us could do 45-50% guaranteed combos given any day) then perhaps...but since majority can't do over 100% combos on a daily basis I'd say that's not true. Besides, that 4 or 15% can make a difference in a close, down to the wire match...then that's more then enough to bank the win. Is it not? Just saying something to think about if it's a close match down to the wire and both people have X-ray's and one player can do that extra 5% more to end the match for good. I don't really see it as being a waste.

 

[BecomingDeath13]

Now, my theory personally I THINK but obviously am not sure for certain but believe that it will be used in SOME cases in high level play, others not so much..I'm thinking people will manage the meter and use their breakers in more tight situations and perhaps with special move extenders for more combo damage. Now, you can save your X-ray for more damage but think about it...if you use it, and your foe blocks it or dodges it then you just wasted a whole meter...so the X-ray is really "risk vs. reward" if you think about....nail your foe for easy 45%+damage or miss it/screw it up and waste an entire meter and have nothing....lol

That's exactly how I want it too work.. I just hope it doesn't wind up controlling the match, and if i were in a nail biter match I wouldn't use an X-ray.. That's overkill and far too risky. I'd just go for a simple 5-10% combo and back off it didn't do him in lol.

 

[STORMS]

One of my questions about the x-rays, which may have already been answered is... what moves can trigger an x-ray? Like, will we be able to combo into them or will there be certain ways ONLY that you can execute it? Im alittle foggy on that one...

 

[Check]

Might of been a glitch, but when sub zero does his xray to scorpion in that one match (snake eater vs someone), the damage for the xray does not show up for a good 5 seconds after it is done. Perhaps during that time is when the properties have changed. Just an observation.

And when an x ray move is performed but blocked or avoided, do you lose your meter? Probably not from what im reading on here. And the moves that can be done off it? Any move? Or just some moves? Regardless, using it will feel just as natural as using a special move on its own. If you used L Canceling in MKDC, then it should be no problem.

So if there is no meter loss in attempting it, then it is useful. It wont be breakable either most likely, just like Rage Combos, so it can be used to counter a person with a breaker (useful when opponent is down to 40% or whatever). a single hit linked into a special(which does an xray) is very useful, where as you face the risk of being breakered on that second hit from other moves (besides hellfire etc). Even more so, the xray combo can leave them with little bit of life left with no hope of catching up most likely.

The one thing thats cool about the meter is the fact you can only hold one breaker at a time. This will help balance the meter and allow a player to catch up. Using a breaker off 3 bars will still leave you with 1, and thats an important strategy since you can match the damage from a combo using promove to the damage of an xray. Only difference is one is breakable (probably). Or save that one bar and build another for a breaker (another important strategy).

So simply weigh out the factors and situations as i have, and ive seen some of you have with specific xrays like cyraxs (i havent seen his very much to see how good itll be) and comparing those situations to ones regarding breakers and promoves. You will be allowed to use all 3 meters for 3 promoves, but with MKDC's combo system, it is unlikely that more than a single hit will be possible in between promoves, so the combos will be at most 60%. Use Sub zero for an example

3 hit combo(18%), promove slide (11%), 2 to 3 hits (10%), promove slide (7%), power punch (normally 10% or so, by now about 5%), promove slide (3%), power punch~slide (5%)

18
11
10
7
5
3
5
=
59%... and that would be wasting a meter on a already reduced damage combo since thats how MKDC combo system works. And the power punch would have the same property as always, so it wouldnt fall victim to MKDC's flop system (after each hit, the opponent drops faster).

^^^It would be best to just take the 40%, save your meter, and continue fighting.... those 60% combos will be meant for showing off or for combo videos. Most likely only possible on a empty meter as well.


Let us hope that breakers are assigned to a different button then block this time..... or else wasted breakers/meter will be back when trying to walk forward and react to block, or even letting go block to punish but need to walk forward a tiny bit (im sure you all know what i am talking about...)


Back to Java

 

[THTB]

That type of scaling is exactly like SSFIV's actually...just a huge waste of meter for a minimal amount of extra damage. But that extra damage could be useful for ending matches.

And it's been shown you lose all your meter for performing X-Rays period...whether it lands or not.

 

[DanCock]

Let us hope that breakers are assigned to a different button then block this time..... or else wasted breakers/meter will be back when trying to walk forward and react to block, or even letting go block to punish but need to walk forward a tiny bit (im sure you all know what i am talking about...)


Back to Java

i agree big time!! i hope they do change that. i thought i was the only one that had this problem LOL use to drive me nuts.

And it's been shown you lose all your meter for performing X-Rays period...whether it lands or not.

i really want to see this. if u find a video please re post it here. thanks in advance

 

[Check]

I've never played sf4 or ssf4, so i wouldnt know.

I always thought it was stupid to be honest. Instead of being rewarded for added hits, it just reduces every time. Its like a reverse in skill level in a attempt to let anyone who isn't Check perform a damaging combo. Although this is the problem when you base a game off MKDC. Everyone is on the same level... There is no best. Just top players. Anyone can compete. Thats their goal nowadays. Make the game as casual as possible but with a somewhat deep fighting system for hardcore players.

And yes it is a huge waste of meter/will just build up their meter the same amount for the same hits that are only doing shit damage because of this wacky system. They start falling faster after each hit!!! How is that not adding skill to the combo??? You should be rewarded... But then again, We dont want the combos to get too high. It all comes down to the meter.....

 

[Mr Roguelike]

Maybe they show just bring the Aggressor bar back...

 

[THTB]

It's kinda good since it'll likely reward you for clutch plays like being able to milk out just enough damage to take a match. You're still being encouraged to have technical skills even with the scaling in that regards.

Also:

X-Rays are shown to consume entire bar, regardless of hit or miss.

 

[DanCock]

It's kinda good since it'll likely reward you for clutch plays like being able to milk out just enough damage to take a match. You're still being encouraged to have technical skills even with the scaling in that regards.

Also:

X-Rays are shown to consume entire bar, regardless of hit or miss.

thank you for the link. it happens right before round 1 ends nice

 

[BecomingDeath13]

And when an x ray move is performed but blocked or avoided, do you lose your meter? Probably not from what im reading on here. And the moves that can be done off it? Any move? Or just some moves? Regardless, using it will feel just as natural as using a special move on its own. If you used L Canceling in MKDC, then it should be no problem.

Okay, I can confirm for everyone here that I've witnessed (in video's from pax) that when someone misses an X-ray they lose their entire meter. If they attempt it and fail its gone, if it gets blocked or evaded... All three bars are gone. It's risk reward. Go for the big move or don't.. If you do it and miss you leave yourself open for a big unblock-able combo or whatever else.

The Meter Drain isn't the issue.. It's how quickly the meter builds up thats gonna be the problem.

 

[Juggs]

Okay, I can confirm for everyone here that I've witnessed (in video's from pax) that when someone misses an X-ray they lose their entire meter. If they attempt it and fail its gone, if it gets blocked or evaded... All three bars are gone. It's risk reward. Go for the big move or don't.. If you do it and miss you leave yourself open for a big unblock-able combo or whatever else.

The Meter Drain isn't the issue.. It's how quickly the meter builds up thats gonna be the problem.

I haven't really been keeping up with this game, can you combo into the X-Ray? Also, the X-Ray by itself, is it blockable if not used in a combo?

 

[MKF30]

@Juggernaut, yep you can indeed combo into the X-ray if you know what you're doing. They showed one vid at E3 of Paulo playing vs. Ed during the Gamespot show and whoever was Sektor, did a JK, teleport punch into the X-ray and winded up doing 48% damage on like 5 or 6 hits. Cyrax is another guy we saw during PAX did a nice combo into it. For your second question I believe it's blockable but ONCE you nail someone in it, you can't break out of it.

It's kinda good since it'll likely reward you for clutch plays like being able to milk out just enough damage to take a match. You're still being encouraged to have technical skills even with the scaling in that regards.

Also:

X-Rays are shown to consume entire bar, regardless of hit or miss.

Exactly ^ why I feel the way I do about them lol. I agree, it'll be all about that "risk vs. reward" tactic....you mess up, you wasted a whole bar for nothing lol if you connect that's a lot of damage depending on the set up.

@death yeah I hear ya, I don't think it'll be abused or nearly as much as say the RAGE in MKDC since like Check mentioned if you do it and the other person kills you the meter stops dead on. With MK9 it seems to drain regardless once you use it which I'm fine with lol.

 

[Shark Tank]

@Juggernaut, yep you can indeed combo into the X-ray if you know what you're doing. They showed one vid at E3 of Paulo playing vs. Ed during the Gamespot show and whoever was Sektor, did a JK, teleport punch into the X-ray and winded up doing 48% damage on like 5 or 6 hits. Cyrax is another guy we saw during PAX did a nice combo into it.

An actually, you can combo out of a few as well as combo into them

 

[MKF30]

Yeah, some characters you can combo out of(not everyone though) example Sektor's you can't, Sub's to name a few off hand. But Cage you can.