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Why Liu Kang Is Broken: A Breakdown

ExpectFlames

ExpectFlames

Lord of embers
Honestly @Chernyy Volk I dont disagree with this. My question would be kang was already super good from the beginning there are aids characters waiting in the wings, erron geras jax is kang when arms heated. How should NRS balence in the futrue I'm terrified that once kang is nerfed any of those aids ones will be next.
 
Chernyy Volk

Chernyy Volk

Wolf lord, footsie bully, chronic corner abuser.
ExpectFlames said:
Honestly @Chernyy Volk I dont disagree with this. My question would be kang was already super good from the beginning there are aids characters waiting in the wings, erron geras jax is kang when arms heated. How should NRS balence in the futrue I'm terrified that once kang is nerfed any of those aids ones will be next.
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I was constantly saying pre-patch they also needed to nerf Liu and Kabal or they'd just be grossly overpowered compare to the rest of the cast if the top tiers got nerfed. I think Kabal is fine now but my prophecy about Liu definitely came true.
 
ExpectFlames

ExpectFlames

Lord of embers
Chernyy Volk said:
I was constantly saying pre-patch they also needed to nerf Liu and Kabal or they'd just be grossly overpowered compare to the rest of the cast if the top tiers got nerfed. I think Kabal is fine now but my prophecy about Liu definitely came true.
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When characters like raiden who by the way doesnt have a single winning matchup are sooo bad it makes me wonder if they can even get it right.
 
JeffX

JeffX

Remove armor on fatal blows now
Chernyy Volk said:
I'm done grinding MK11 and trying to compete since I find the game rage inducing, but I still like making content for youtube and shit so I figured I'd do this video. Enjoy.

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I understand your frustration with the game. I too am no longer playing online, and just watching contently until they make some large quality of life changes. And I'm sorry the community has taken it upon themselves to shit on you at every opportunity. You've made some mistakes, but this breakdown is 100% spot on. It feels like evolution top 16 against almost every Liu Kang player.

I'm not sure if this is consistent with every character, but I did resort to just using d2 against low fireball and mb fireball. It's still 14% and I'm not wasting a bar, and most of the cast can consistently punish. Not sure why it doesn't Krushing Blow though.
 
wsj515

wsj515

This is my billionth life cycle.
deathstroke187 said:
im been honest great video Chernyy but im really convinced that Liu lose to Sub DoW and Johnny but besides that your right about everything els.
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Johnny is at least arguable because of the hotbox inconsistencies, but why would Liu lose to DoW? There is no reason that would be the case.
 
JeffX

JeffX

Remove armor on fatal blows now
wsj515 said:
Johnny is at least arguable because of the hotbox inconsistencies, but why would Liu lose to DoW? There is no reason that would be the case.
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I could see it with the 6 frame d1 and the projectile trade. Buffalo has beaten sylerrye in tournament multiple times with DOW.
 
deathstroke187

deathstroke187

Warrior
wsj515 said:
Johnny is at least arguable because of the hotbox inconsistencies, but why would Liu lose to DoW? There is no reason that would be the case.
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liu cant zone againts sub dow at all , he also cant jump because of sub b2 into full combo. liu cant play footsies with sub b1 and d4 he has to play sub neutral the whole time thats why and if sub auto footsies f4 get blocked its time to get mixzero

also he can abuse his 6f d1 on mash to get into that -7 punish of liu staggers wich not all characters has that luxery. people are downplaying sub to hell.
 
ExpectFlames

ExpectFlames

Lord of embers
deathstroke187 said:
liu cant zone againts sub dow at all , he also cant jump because of sub b2 into full combo. liu cant play footsies with sub b1 and d4 he has to play sub neutral the whole time thats why and if sub auto footsies f4 get blocked its time to get mixzero

also he can abuse his 6f d1 on mash to get into that -7 punish of liu staggers wich not all characters has that luxery. people are downplaying sub to hell.
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Isnt d4 to slow to contest f4? I mean I understand the range but a single WD and kang's basically from fullscreen, also wont f4 beat b1? I understand in theory sub should win FS against kang but nah I dont buy it Amp ice ball in a necessity for his mix if he spams it contesting fire balls hes bascically everyone else without meter maybe worse.
 
L

lordlosh

Apprentice
PapaRegadetho said:
Is this coming from a guy who said prepatch Scorpion was not broken? xD
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As much as i dont like this Cherny guy, he is completely right on both topic - Kang broken, and there was nothing wrong with Scorpion pre-patch.
It was just bad players, who doesnt know how to play that match or they are just bad and dont like to use Block button ....
Just saying. Not a single Scorpion player in top 16 pre-patch .... Just saying ....
Balance is made at highest possible level, not at lowest. Scorpion was never being a problem, forget about being broken.

As far as Sub DOW beating Kang, dont make me laugh.
Lesser Kang player beat a lot better Sub Zero player.
Sub Zero D1 has s**** range and whiffs. Just because on paper have 6f, doesnt make it good poke.
B1 is ued to whiff punish, if you decide to use it as ranged tool, you going to eat punish, either by low-profiling or by jumping, and Sub going to eat full punish. D4 is slow, and a lot of other option beat him.
And Sub Zero B2 work in range, it wont work in close, and only noobs jump from high range, where you can eat a lot of stuffs.
Sub anti-air is inconsistent at best. Even Sikander said Sub Zero anti-air su****.
But Sub Zero or any character cant jump against Kang player, because they are going to eat it.

You can get hit by Ice Ball, if you are low-mid tier, but at high-pro level if Sub Zero try to zone against Kang, he will eat more damage, then he will inflict, simply because of the low and amplify Fireball + Liu Dragon Kick.
40:07
 
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M.D.

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
Please don't c-ride the theorycrafting "pro" players on twitter with Cage.

Play the matchup and see for yourself.

Literally ALL of the so called "pro" players that say Cage beats Kang :
  1. don't play cage
  2. never played cage against a pro kang.
The Cage whiff "tech" is in the game since day 1 and everyone knew about it, ESPECIALLY pro players.

Yet how many Cage counterpicks did you see for Kang in Destroyer invitationals or dreamhack? ZERO.

So please don't encourage fake theorycraft crap.

Thanks.
 
L

lordlosh

Apprentice
M.D., exactly. Excuse me but some people are just dum*. They just look at raw frame data or some "whiff" issue and goes on the train ....
Neither Sub and Cage have chance against Kang. So far at major i didnt see pro player use the so call whiff "tech" against Kang.
 
xInfra Deadx

xInfra Deadx

Gimmick stolen by Jordan Peele
PapaRegadetho said:
Is this coming from a guy who said prepatch Scorpion was not broken? xD
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Yes.

Scorpion Might Be Dead

So... I feel like NRS took the worst nerf suggestion and applied it to Scorpion. It's not bad that they made it a high, I agree the character was too reliant on it, but he needed buffs if they were gonna do this. So here's the perspective I look at it from now. 1: If they see teleport...
testyourmight.com testyourmight.com

Rambling about the state of Scorpion

I really love what NRS did with him in this game, and I think aesthetically and GENERALLY gameplay wise, he's sick. I like the fact he's more of a samurai than a ninja in this game honestly. However, competitively, I just think this character lacks a lot of things. I'm really tired of this...
testyourmight.com testyourmight.com
 
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Vslayer

Vslayer

Juiced Moose On The Loose
Lead Moderator
I'd like to know how Cage beats Kang, maybe in his second variation with the unbreakable damage? Is that what people are theorizing?
 
M.D.

M.D.

Spammer. Crouch walk hater.
The PRAWHHH players say that Kang whiffs 12 and f43 on Cage's female hitbox,, so he can't do anything because any use of the string will get them full combo punished. Which makes the matchup 7-3 for Cage (LOL).

What they're not saying, and probably never even tried playing Cage to see (or most surely they know but they intentionally don't mention so it doesn't blow up their fake theory), is that f43 does not whiff on cage all the time. There are specific conditions: you have to start stand blocking the f4 and then crouch immediately before 3 hits, otherwise you get clipped.

While the timing is not hard, it forces you to always stand block the f4 which means you get opened by the low non stop and eat low projectiles all day.
Forcing you to constantly stand block in fear of f4 also makes his +3 on block 12 not whiff any more. So basically you're still in a blender of deciding where the fk to block low or high to guess what string he does, so you can catch a whiff. Which means you get thrown.

Kang also has f3 that doesn't whiff, which conveniently gets overlooked when discussing Cage matchup.

Also Kang can literally f4 THROUGH all Cage buttons and he will win the contest every time into a full combo. If the Cage player tries to exist, he gets f4-ed.

It beats f4, f3, b3. And it beats them even after his so called "plus frames" from f344 ex forceballs.

At least zoning is close to even, as Kang doesn't crouch on his low fireball any more THANK HEAVENS.

Kang dragon kick is usually a free get in tool against Cage as done at maximum range (same as Jade kick) it becomes literally safe as Cage's fast buttons (1 and 2) don't reach, and he has no fast mid to punish it.

Obviously they don't know that, but no worries, once they start believing their own theories they will pick up Cage and see for themselves.
Can't wait for NinjaKilla to vaporize them crying back to their old mains.
 
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