MK11 Johnny Cage General Discussion

[DrFolmer]

Hit demi-god playing Johnny mostly a few days ago. Dropped out again due to me not being able to compete with everybody in higher ranks playing Cetrion, Sonya, Erron, Cassie etc. My Jax does not have the same feeling of comfort yet. Started to use Raiden a lot more, but b12 being unsafe is soooooooooo fucking lame, and his d2 is barely an anti-air lol

I still think Johnny holds up against Geras (New Dawn is pretty rough with f2 ticking) and Scorpion pretty well. But then again, the top Johnnies on the leaderboard have seemingly shelved him for other characters. I really don't (from a competitive standpoint) see the point in playing Johnny when Cassie exists. Yaas Queen is literally Showstopper but actually good.

I'm so sick of having to make specific reads like are they gonna delay wake up to jump? Then I gotta prepare for that and do a s1 or something to juggle or just beat them out of their getting up, meet them with a jump normal of my own. And the times f3 hits but they fall out of the air causing 44 to whiff and you eat a full combo. So many top tiers have their mainstrings be super safe on whiff. Then there's Erron b2 string that just works as an all-in-one solution - has built in mixups, safe, catches you out of the air. Is he gonna cancel into Scud before the string ends? Is he gonna amp it sending me almost fullscreen forcing me to deal with his BS zoning and counter-zoning? It's just a matter of there's multiple ways to blow up Johnny compared to Erron for instance. At high level it means you have to commit to some really ballsy risks all the while Erron simply has to decide "oh okay Johnny gonna advance so I'll just d4 for days. I know there are ways around that but you guys get the picture I hope LOL

 

[Name v.5.0]

Hit demi-god playing Johnny mostly a few days ago. Dropped out again due to me not being able to compete with everybody in higher ranks playing Cetrion, Sonya, Erron, Cassie etc. My Jax does not have the same feeling of comfort yet. Started to use Raiden a lot more, but b12 being unsafe is soooooooooo fucking lame, and his d2 is barely an anti-air lol

I still think Johnny holds up against Geras (New Dawn is pretty rough with f2 ticking) and Scorpion pretty well. But then again, the top Johnnies on the leaderboard have seemingly shelved him for other characters. I really don't (from a competitive standpoint) see the point in playing Johnny when Cassie exists. Yaas Queen is literally Showstopper but actually good.

I'm so sick of having to make specific reads like are they gonna delay wake up to jump? Then I gotta prepare for that and do a s1 or something to juggle or just beat them out of their getting up, meet them with a jump normal of my own. And the times f3 hits but they fall out of the air causing 44 to whiff and you eat a full combo. So many top tiers have their mainstrings be super safe on whiff. Then there's Erron b2 string that just works as an all-in-one solution - has built in mixups, safe, catches you out of the air. Is he gonna cancel into Scud before the string ends? Is he gonna amp it sending me almost fullscreen forcing me to deal with his BS zoning and counter-zoning? It's just a matter of there's multiple ways to blow up Johnny compared to Erron for instance. At high level it means you have to commit to some really ballsy risks all the while Erron simply has to decide "oh okay Johnny gonna advance so I'll just d4 for days. I know there are ways around that but you guys get the picture I hope LOL

You’re not kidding with the risky reads. I think I about have a heart attack every time I do 124 on block and follow it with F4~Nut punch.

KL is fucking rough. I’ve been using nothing but Johnny and it seems that almost everyone counter picks. I guess that’s not too hard against Johnny though.

 

[Rodney Quillz]

You’re not kidding with the risky reads. I think I about have a heart attack every time I do 124 on block and follow it with F4~Nut punch.

KL is fucking rough. I’ve been using nothing but Johnny and it seems that almost everyone counter picks. I guess that’s not too hard against Johnny though.

Yeah I’m at the “fuck it point” I’ve been doing 121 mid screen into ex forceballs, they almost always block the last hit of 1 or try to jump and get clipped by it, I’ve been getting respected lmao.

 

[Error404]

You’re not kidding with the risky reads. I think I about have a heart attack every time I do 124 on block and follow it with F4~Nut punch.

KL is fucking rough. I’ve been using nothing but Johnny and it seems that almost everyone counter picks. I guess that’s not too hard against Johnny though.

Yeah against some people you just need to do it or they will never respect you

 

[Error404]

Recently I've been ending combos in ~121 x flipkick and going for dash into meaty b3/throw. It's super risky ,because forward roll will kill you , but it does punish mashing on wake up

 

[NewMK11Player]

Im taking a long break from Kombat League until they fix this garbage mess , too many issues

 

[Name v.5.0]

Has anyone here made it out of Demi God in KL just using Johnny? I just cant fucking do it. I’ve fallen back into Grand Master a few times too.

These MUs are just way too bad for Cage. I’ll fight a Sonya or Cassie every couple of fights and most times I lose to them.

Again, I’m only using Johnny and I just want to see how far people are getting doing the same.

 

[heildan]

I've been in the lab trying to discover or create new Johnny tech. Have you guys found anything useful lately?

 

[Derocus]

Heyup, lads. Some of you might remember ye olde 'Ranking With Johnny' series. Didn't wanna make a thread just for this video, but I'd like you guys to take a look.

It's mostly for comedy reasons ofc, but I'd consider myself a decent Johnny. Baring in mind these fights are, like, a month old at this point.

 

[FoughtDragon01]

Heyup, lads. Some of you might remember ye olde 'Ranking With Johnny' series. Didn't wanna make a thread just for this video, but I'd like you guys to take a look.

It's mostly for comedy reasons ofc, but I'd consider myself a decent Johnny. Baring in mind these fights are, like, a month old at this point.

Holy shit, I forgot how funny these are. That first fatality damn near made me choke on my coffee.

 

[Tundra81]

Heyup, lads. Some of you might remember ye olde 'Ranking With Johnny' series. Didn't wanna make a thread just for this video, but I'd like you guys to take a look.

It's mostly for comedy reasons ofc, but I'd consider myself a decent Johnny. Baring in mind these fights are, like, a month old at this point.

Damn I didn't realize this was you, I used to watch the Derocus and RizRAz MKX videos back in the day. This shit's hilarious!! Take my sub good sir.

 

[NewMK11Player]

I got Jax to demi before I quit KL , thining

Heyup, lads. Some of you might remember ye olde 'Ranking With Johnny' series. Didn't wanna make a thread just for this video, but I'd like you guys to take a look.

It's mostly for comedy reasons ofc, but I'd consider myself a decent Johnny. Baring in mind these fights are, like, a month old at this point.

LOL

 

[FoughtDragon01]

Do we know how many other characters' good strings whiff against Johnny on block? I know that Liu Kang's F43 can whiff, as well as Geras' F212. Do we know about any others? Probably should've asked sooner since those'll likely get fixed soon, but it might be something worth adding to the guide until then.

 

[Wigy]

Do we know how many other characters' good strings whiff against Johnny on block? I know that Liu Kang's F43 can whiff, as well as Geras' F212. Do we know about any others? Probably should've asked sooner since those'll likely get fixed soon, but it might be something worth adding to the guide until then.

Errons f32 or whatever that string is. If you unblock just as the second hit is coming it whiffs.

B32 with frost.

 

[SwiftEagle]

Whiffing against females is still a problem in MKX, so there's a chance it won't be fixed here.

 

[Derocus]

That's a good point. NRS probably doesn't even know how to fix it. If they did, the game probably wouldn't have shipped with the same whiffing problems as the previous title.

How hard can it be to give every character the same size hitbox? Other games have done it.

 

[SwiftEagle]

That's a good point. NRS probably doesn't even know how to fix it. If they did, the game probably wouldn't have shipped with the same whiffing problems as the previous title.

How hard can it be to give every character the same size hitbox? Other games have done it.

Fanboys usually use characters like Scorpion, Sub Zero, Erron Black, etc. They have the largest playerbase. Because their characters are fine and have every tool for every situation, the rest of us should just shut up. Try to bring up whiffing issues in any other thread and you'll get shot down.

 

[Matador Fiend]

What are ppls thoughts on ending w nutpunch? Ive been doing it at rhe cost of damage (new cage player) but im leaning toward it not being a good idea. Nutpunch being only +5 means nothing is guaranteed aside from a poke. Once people respect the poke, it DOES open up f3, but im not sure its worth it.

 

[lionheart21]

What are ppls thoughts on ending w nutpunch? Ive been doing it at rhe cost of damage (new cage player) but im leaning toward it not being a good idea. Nutpunch being only +5 means nothing is guaranteed aside from a poke. Once people respect the poke, it DOES open up f3, but im not sure its worth it.

Its main use is as a restand, so your opponent won't have access to any wakeup tools. You can also condition them to set up your throws.

 

[Wigy]

What are ppls thoughts on ending w nutpunch? Ive been doing it at rhe cost of damage (new cage player) but im leaning toward it not being a good idea. Nutpunch being only +5 means nothing is guaranteed aside from a poke. Once people respect the poke, it DOES open up f3, but im not sure its worth it.

D4 guarantees all your pressure after.

D1 np is good. Can catch people even respecting the d1 or just blow up Mashers.

If you have fatal blow you can use it and instantly cancel to give yourself armour then go into f344 or f4.

Cross over or neutral jump 2 is good.

I have made a thread which shows how to get guaranteed pressure after with a hitbox bug at the cost of a bar.

If you go into the lab and try get a combo where you hit np at Max range, this spaces you a little back and allows you to move back and whiff punish their poke mash after.

Worst comes to worst. Block the poke and reversal grab. People mashing are rarely ready to go into anything after so a reversal grab is great as a counter to mashing

 

[DrFolmer]

What are ppls thoughts on ending w nutpunch? Ive been doing it at rhe cost of damage (new cage player) but im leaning toward it not being a good idea. Nutpunch being only +5 means nothing is guaranteed aside from a poke. Once people respect the poke, it DOES open up f3, but im not sure its worth it.

It's kinda one of his defining features even though it doesn't guarantee much. However, it's a lot more useful in the corner as they are even more limited in options there. It's all about the mindgames. Once you condition them to block you can go for 124 or shimmy. Squeeze in a little throw mixup and it's good to go

 

[Owerbart]

i stopped using nutpunch because being only +5 with no good mid is not worth it. Same way all the +6 strings and ex fireballs arent frametraps at all. They are useless because there's no good mid to keep tjem in check. There's not a single reason for any opp not to block low/wait ducking vs johnny. in fact i think he loses a lot of matchups mostly because other characters have acceptable mids.

for christ sake just make f3 a mid please

 

[Rodney Quillz]

i stopped using nutpunch because being only +5 with no good mid is not worth it. Same way all the +6 strings and ex fireballs arent frametraps at all. They are useless because there's no good mid to keep tjem in check. There's not a single reason for any opp not to block low/wait ducking vs johnny. in fact i think he loses a lot of matchups mostly because other characters have acceptable mids.

for christ sake just make f3 a mid please

Making f3 a mid wouldn’t change cages pressure from being gimmicky, giving him faster buttons would.

I would much rather have a faster b3 than a mid f3.

 

[Name v.5.0]

i stopped using nutpunch because being only +5 with no good mid is not worth it. Same way all the +6 strings and ex fireballs arent frametraps at all. They are useless because there's no good mid to keep tjem in check. There's not a single reason for any opp not to block low/wait ducking vs johnny. in fact i think he loses a lot of matchups mostly because other characters have acceptable mids.

for christ sake just make f3 a mid please

Nut Punch is still good because it negates wake up options of your opponent. It's good to pepper it in here and there for mind games and so you don't become too predictable. Johnny has to take risks and make reads. Is he going to turtle? Throw him. Is he going to poke or D2? Back dash and punish. I tend to always nut punch in the corner because I don't want them rolling out. Sometimes they jump so D1 is convertible into a combo.

It's good. Not great, but good and has it's time and place.

The +6 definitely have use. F4 becomes an 8 frame attack. I've stuffed so many fucking pokes doing 124 followed by F4. Sometimes you go for the yolo F4~NP, or just F44 to be safe. Again, it's reads. If they're pokey, Hesitate and then B3. Defensive? Dash and throw or stagger F3s. There's many other options. Once they respect 124, you can do 12~throw, 12~poke, 12, pause, D4~NP.


Sure, there's a ton of risk involved in all of this, but that's just how you have to play Johnny. He's absolutely not a flow chart character in his current state. You have to keep them guessing and keep up the momentum. I've almost hit God in KL just using Cage, and it hasnt been because I've played safe.

F3 doesn't need to be a mid. It wouldnt actually change anything. F2 on the other hand....

 

[Deleted member 35141]

I don't know of this is common knowledge but noticed f344 the last hit completely misses on erron black.

I've been playing KL lately there's nothing like playing wifi scorpion where the first match all your timing is great then the next 2 matches specials and strings don't come out properly then get tbagged.