Are you enjoyin the current meta?

[Javoo On Fire]

I'm starting to see a ton of neutral jump punching. Thought we were done with that shit after MKX, but I guess not. I can see why though. This game is naturally pokey, and many Ji2's are really good. Pretty annoying.

I like njps in this game tho, Njps aren't a launcher and give characters an overhead option that don't have it.

 

[M2Dave]

Scorpion teleport cancel variation is insanely funny. In long sets vs good scorps I can throw maybe one or two projectiles?

If Scorpion had this version of the teleport in Mortal Kombat 9, I am certain he would beat Freddy. LOL.

 

[Gaxkang]

My gauging of the game is that it's really just more of the same NRS gameplay and problems as I see them.

Punishment on block is light in the game, outside of really unsafe stuff or specials and even then you better do it immediately right on the nose. Looking up your fastest string in your move list will be an adventure in seeing how little it punishes. So much being highs and ducking being "meta" I guess helps make that problem worse.

The D1 is perhaps the most important move in the game and fights are filled with them. Blocking a string means hit D1, rather than say, use a string. D1 is used for so much.

Speaking of strings once again advancing strings are real important, and moreso advancing mixups. Mixup dials are real important. But good advancing mixup's are even better.
Stuff you can combo off too.

Speaking of the dials...I wish NRS would ditch the dial system finally and just do inputs as moves connect. Dial combos are unintuitive and encourage or force rushing inputs, which leads to something not working.
It's odd for a game series made out as a casual fighter to use such a backwards, clunky combo system.

The game still retains a certain...clunky feeling NRS can have with movement and flow. Not having a lot of punishment on block or having a lot of pushback can increase clunky feeling. Jumps can feel odd.

I don't feel the game is balanced. What they did to Shao Kahn vs. what other characters have, oh boy...

NRS still seems to have real trouble when it comes to zoning. I wanna see the hitboxes of projectiles or hurtboxes when you jump...because something is huge. You shouldn't have to finesse things to jump over a projectile fired a long distance away.
The amount of zoning that sometimes happens...projectiles from all angles, is just blah. Injustice 2 at least had meter rolls...MK11 has crabwalks and chip death. Zoning issues can also further balance issues. And not every characters has a teleport.

The fatal blow as it is completely changes fights when it's around, and it can feel like a win button. The concept ain't so bad...but it feels a bit strong too.

MK11 is a really well supported game financially speaking....it needs a fighting system to match really. They could have a real great system but they stick with continuing issues, as if it's a brand thing.

There can be great fights, but when I see various issues I keep in mind I am seeing NRS' nonsense continuing on.

 

[CY MasterHavik]

I don't own the game yet, but from the footage I watched so far I am happy to see zoning not be a big part of the game and I like seeing a mix of both rushdown and zoning. It also makes characters all about rushdown have a decent chance in matchups against zoners.

 

[grandabx]

My gauging of the game is that it's really just more of the same NRS gameplay and problems as I see them.

Punishment on block is light in the game, outside of really unsafe stuff or specials and even then you better do it immediately right on the nose. Looking up your fastest string in your move list will be an adventure in seeing how little it punishes. So much being highs and ducking being "meta" I guess helps make that problem worse.

The D1 is perhaps the most important move in the game and fights are filled with them. Blocking a string means hit D1, rather than say, use a string. D1 is used for so much.

Speaking of strings once again advancing strings are real important, and moreso advancing mixups. Mixup dials are real important. But good advancing mixup's are even better.
Stuff you can combo off too.

Speaking of the dials...I wish NRS would ditch the dial system finally and just do inputs as moves connect. Dial combos are unintuitive and encourage or force rushing inputs, which leads to something not working.
It's odd for a game series made out as a casual fighter to use such a backwards, clunky combo system.

The game still retains a certain...clunky feeling NRS can have with movement and flow. Not having a lot of punishment on block or having a lot of pushback can increase clunky feeling. Jumps can feel odd.

I don't feel the game is balanced. What they did to Shao Kahn vs. what other characters have, oh boy...

NRS still seems to have real trouble when it comes to zoning. I wanna see the hitboxes of projectiles or hurtboxes when you jump...because something is huge. You shouldn't have to finesse things to jump over a projectile fired a long distance away.
The amount of zoning that sometimes happens...projectiles from all angles, is just blah. Injustice 2 at least had meter rolls...MK11 has crabwalks and chip death. Zoning issues can also further balance issues. And not every characters has a teleport.

The fatal blow as it is completely changes fights when it's around, and it can feel like a win button. The concept ain't so bad...but it feels a bit strong too.

MK11 is a really well supported game financially speaking....it needs a fighting system to match really. They could have a real great system but they stick with continuing issues, as if it's a brand thing.

There can be great fights, but when I see various issues I keep in mind I am seeing NRS' nonsense continuing on.

The combo system feels like you're unlocking a combo through code instead of hit confirms. Chip kill is baffling in a game where normal attacks chip and dot-damage kills and even drains while laying on the ground.
It's like creating a bunch of weird systems just for the sake of saying they're different.

 

[bumpyface]

My gauging of the game is that it's really just more of the same NRS gameplay and problems as I see them.

Punishment on block is light in the game, outside of really unsafe stuff or specials and even then you better do it immediately right on the nose. Looking up your fastest string in your move list will be an adventure in seeing how little it punishes. So much being highs and ducking being "meta" I guess helps make that problem worse.

The D1 is perhaps the most important move in the game and fights are filled with them. Blocking a string means hit D1, rather than say, use a string. D1 is used for so much.

Speaking of strings once again advancing strings are real important, and moreso advancing mixups. Mixup dials are real important. But good advancing mixup's are even better.
Stuff you can combo off too.

Speaking of the dials...I wish NRS would ditch the dial system finally and just do inputs as moves connect. Dial combos are unintuitive and encourage or force rushing inputs, which leads to something not working.
It's odd for a game series made out as a casual fighter to use such a backwards, clunky combo system.

The game still retains a certain...clunky feeling NRS can have with movement and flow. Not having a lot of punishment on block or having a lot of pushback can increase clunky feeling. Jumps can feel odd.

I don't feel the game is balanced. What they did to Shao Kahn vs. what other characters have, oh boy...

NRS still seems to have real trouble when it comes to zoning. I wanna see the hitboxes of projectiles or hurtboxes when you jump...because something is huge. You shouldn't have to finesse things to jump over a projectile fired a long distance away.
The amount of zoning that sometimes happens...projectiles from all angles, is just blah. Injustice 2 at least had meter rolls...MK11 has crabwalks and chip death. Zoning issues can also further balance issues. And not every characters has a teleport.

The fatal blow as it is completely changes fights when it's around, and it can feel like a win button. The concept ain't so bad...but it feels a bit strong too.

MK11 is a really well supported game financially speaking....it needs a fighting system to match really. They could have a real great system but they stick with continuing issues, as if it's a brand thing.

There can be great fights, but when I see various issues I keep in mind I am seeing NRS' nonsense continuing on.

Man, every gripe I have about the game you listed. This issues are why MK11 can't stand against other quality 2D fighters but I still feel it's a good game. The punishing and the dial-a-combos irk me the most and they're probably related. I was playing against a Kung Lao yesterday online and he did a raw spin which is -17 on block I believe. I blocked the spin while crouching and then hit D1 (not an optimal punish attempt I know) and Kung blocked it. I watched the replay over and over trying to understand why the D1 didn't connect since it's start up is 7. I know spacing and stagger play a factor but the spin doesn't push you out of punish range. MK 11 is a total package but when it comes to gameplay and core mechanics it's behind other 2D fighters.

 

[t3kwytch3r]

I love the Meta of the game. Feels mostly fair, besides a few gimmicks at the top tier and shitshows at the bottom, which is present in every FG in some form or another.

But i tell you what, i'm sick of people saying they dislike the breakaway mechanic. There's nothing wrong with it. At all. While your opponent has the full defensive meter, you can choose to just not finish your string. If they breakaway every time, you can force them to throw away all of their defensive meter, then you're super plus and can apply oki pressure.

If you're getting combo'd, you need to decide the risk / reward of using your breakaway. If your opponent isn't a total fucking scrub, they'll think twice about using full combo's while you have both defensive meter available. If i'm playing against scorpion with his neutral destroying TP that he amplifies, and i time my breakaway just as he launches spear, fuck him, he deserves the full combo punish.

 

[GLoRToR]

No.

I hate how throws work.
I hate how much my main struggles in a lot of matchups.
I hate how there are one-button nonsense characters and get-out-of-jail-for-free cards while we were promised a more honest game.

I have faith in NRS yet, don't get me wrong.
But I want to main Jade and she's not fun to play for me right now, when literally every single character has the odds stacked against what she was said to do good at.

 

[versavices]

Game is really well done and lots of fun. I think the stages are the best out of any NRS game. 19 DLC leak makes me hype af if it’s true. I really like the way zoning works in this game. It’s inherently riskier and there doesn’t seem to be a Deadshot BF1 move to just endlessly spam. Most of the best zoning specials require directional distance inputs and all projectiles are pretty slow start up.

The game does have a few issues that will hopefully be fixed.

Krushing Blows - I really like this new system but it needs to be more accessible to the whole cast. I think every character should have their accessibility increased to be more like Geras when it comes to KBs. This is a ton of damage in a match and it’s a big problem when only a few characters can actually use them.

Variations - I wanted kustoms from the get-go but was ok to try out tournament variations. I had some faith that NRS was going to take off the skill point cap for just tournament variations and give them some sort of advantage over kustoms. Welp, this is not the case and I can pretty confidently say this system is atrocious. There are maybe 5 variations that actually make sense and some are just comically awful. Shout out to Kung Laos first variation that can spend 4 bars let him spin 2 hats around him OR 4 BARS TO INCREASE THE RANGE OF THE NEGATIVE ON BLOCK HAT. What?? Who made these variations dog


8.5/10 overall so far

 

[Kanalratte]

There can be great fights, but when I see various issues I keep in mind I am seeing NRS' nonsense continuing on.

Day 1 Alien, Day 1 Deadshot, Day 1 Erron etc. NRS' credo: lets give this character these awesome tools! but it doesn't seem balanced, obviously! well it does not matter. we can still patch this. Til then: Deal with it OR git gud!

 

[Jbog]

Really enjoying this game love the footsies and tamed down zoning! But reallly hate the wake up system give all charaters a mid uncomboable armored wake up of their own moves and 1 launcher un armoref done deal plus balans kb a bit and get rid of the killer blow. The last power under 5 percent should chip at 1 ppl ercent old school mk style if they loo eave killer blows the same

 

[M2Dave]

I don't own the game yet, but from the footage I watched so far I am happy to see zoning not be a big part of the game and I liek seeing a mix of both rushdown and zoning.

What zoning?

You know zoning is at an all time low when Sonya, a rush down character, has a better projectile than advertised "premier zoning characters" like Cetrion and Noob.

 

[PLAY FOR KEEPSIES]

It's not the teleport itself it's all the inherent pressure and openings that exist because of the threat of teleport. Game is supposed to be neutral and footsie heavy, but you have this character than can just randomly hit you anytime you let go of block. Then let's say you block it... well he amped it so you got hit anyway, or he didn't amp it but you had to guard the threat of amp so it's still his turn, or you blocked both the teleport and the amp but the punishment window is super small. O AND FUCK ANY OF THIS UP and eat a 3rd of your life worth of damage or more.

wait till you play against one who mixes Tele-fakes -> throws and starts fuckin you up on attempts to punish that too with his great buttons. the character is just too much.

 

[Bliss]

Hated it at first; like it now. I guess it is because It felt so foreign to me without all the juggle shit all these Mortal Kombats usually have. I haven't played a human yet, because I'm still playing offline to unlock "rewards."

 

[CY MasterHavik]

What zoning?

You know zoning is at an all time low when Sonya, a rush down character, has a better projectile than advertised "premier zoning characters" like Cetrion and Noob.

That's a fucking good thing! But I still see small moments of people throwing a projectile out in neutral to control space but it isn't like inj 1 Superman with doing a combo and then jumping doing his laser and doing it to win a game.

 

[Gaxkang]

The combo system feels like you're unlocking a combo through code instead of hit confirms. Chip kill is baffling in a game where normal attacks chip and dot-damage kills and even drains while laying on the ground.
It's like creating a bunch of weird systems just for the sake of saying they're different.

Yeah coming from another fighting game someone will always notice the awkward NRS dial combos. There's no reason for them to exist...I guess NRS feels its their brand and sets them apart, plus reusing the same thing over and over is easier than adjusting the whole thing I suppose.
If only it was input as moves connect, people would see a world of difference.

And chip kill...if I had my way projectiles would not do chip damage, and definitely would not chip kill. If there must be chip damage and death, let it be from someone having to come in and fight.

 

[Gaxkang]

Man, every gripe I have about the game you listed. This issues are why MK11 can't stand against other quality 2D fighters but I still feel it's a good game. The punishing and the dial-a-combos irk me the most and they're probably related. I was playing against a Kung Lao yesterday online and he did a raw spin which is -17 on block I believe. I blocked the spin while crouching and then hit D1 (not an optimal punish attempt I know) and Kung blocked it. I watched the replay over and over trying to understand why the D1 didn't connect since it's start up is 7. I know spacing and stagger play a factor but the spin doesn't push you out of punish range. MK 11 is a total package but when it comes to gameplay and core mechanics it's behind other 2D fighters.

I had hoped with 11 NRS would truly polish it up but more I play the more I eyeroll at various things.

Latency online can also be a factor...the online can look smooth, but I think can have some issues.

And hitting D1...that's my go-to too, it feels like it's the only thing you can do a lot of the time. When it doesn't work...there's like, nothing left heh.

 

[Gaxkang]

What zoning?

You know zoning is at an all time low when Sonya, a rush down character, has a better projectile than advertised "premier zoning characters" like Cetrion and Noob.

Oh there's still plenty of NRS style zoning in the game...just there are characters you can't zone against period due to getting hit with a big combo even if across the screen. Teleporty ones for example.

Sub Zero is almost like that, but projectiles along the ground neutralize his slide and if he's at full screen, he won't have fun since he gets to play the NRS crabwalk/try to avoid super fast projectiles with huge hitboxes (or whatever makes them so hard to jump over). While taking chip from any projectile he has to block.

But if NRS was doing Street Fighter, Ryu's normal hadoken would always be like what his EX version is while in V trigger. Or Guile's EX sonic boom in v-trigger. That's NRS's idea of zoning and projectiles. The EX versions would just instantly hit you heh.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

What zoning?

Dragon seems to think otherwise. Showing these fools how it's done.

 

[Rpgz]

Im actually confused abt the meta...What am I supposed to do after I get to top 100 in ToT? Im doing ok then right?

Still gonna keep playing...fyi...

 

[Rpgz]

Also what am I supposed to do with all my extra souls and hearts? already beat krypt...

 

[magandi]

Im actually confused abt the meta...What am I supposed to do after I get to top 100 in ToT? Im doing ok then right?

Still gonna keep playing...fyi...

I'm sure this thread is about the gameplay meta.

 

[Methysan]

I've spent more time watching Summit than playing so far but watching Geras is just disgusting. Why does a grappler get to block and punish projectiles from full screen?

Some other things I don't like:

1. Some matches are so slow that every time someone finally lands a hit, break away is ready again.

2. Erron Black doing full screen drop kicks and getting away with it because the opponent guessed he would meter burn and he didn't.

3. I'd much rather there be more mix in this game and have throws not be a 50/50 tech.

4. I've disliked variations since MKX, just give me one complete good character. Letting us totally customize variations in MK 11 however, will be a mess and drastically increase tournament run time. Also try learning matchups when a character can have 20 different combinations of specials and strings. I think there are too many moves for full customization at this point and they might be better off adding a 3rd variation like MKX had, while also retooling existing ones by making them focused around a single playstyle and swapping out useless moves. Digital Soldier Cassie wouldn't miss flippy guns at all, for example.

5. I don't like offensive meter being tied to a timer instead of damage taken/dealt/moving forward etc. It limits your combo potential and damage output when you're doing well, and helps you catch up when you're getting hit a lot. In terms of spectacle, without meter, most combos are string xx special and that's it. Bleh.

6. I hate hate hate dial a combo system. Is there ANY benefit to this? Call me a scrub but it's so counter intuitive and feels like I'm never truly in control of my character. I've been playing fighters for 9 years, and my execution has come a long way. But NRS games make me feel like I'm playing cross handed and blindfolded sometimes.

 

[magandi]

dial a combos are just part of nrs gameplay. it's unique and defines them.

 

[M2Dave]

Dragon seems to think otherwise. Showing these fools how it's done.

Dragon is an exceptional player, but nobody aside from Sonic Fox is taking advantage of the gap between the MB wall. The second hit can be flawless blocked or even interrupted and punished. I give props to @SaltShaker who was the first person I saw bring this issue to the community's attention. The gap will have devastating effects for Cetrion long term as people invest more time in the match up.

Gross's zoning with Cassie versus DJT's Baraka is a far superior example of zoning in Mortal Kombat 11 if you are trying to prove zoning effectiveness in Mortal Kombat 11.

My problem is that the current top characters (i.e., Erron Black's projectile parry, Geras's sand trap, Sub Zero's EX ice ball, etc.) who are exclusively all rush down characters are also the ones with the best zoning and anti-zoning tools, yet the characters who were advertised as "premier zoning characters" (i.e., Noob) have absolutely nothing to do with zoning.