MK11 Johnny Cage General Discussion

[SwiftEagle]

SwiftEagle is right.




This is the buff no one is talking about. As far as I’m concerned, it’s the one we need the most. Easier brutalities. If they fix that, I think we can rest easy in top tier.

It's not really a buff. Are you being sarcastic? It just makes Cage more rewarding to play. Yet another mechanic he really misses out on. I mean no nut punch brutality? Come on. I liked how simple they were in MKX. A lot of them were grabs or combo enders which gave players the incentive to do them. This also prevented annoying fatalities in sets.

 

[SwiftEagle]

I'm better than your average player I guess. I mean however good knowing the games mechanics well enough gets you. I find I am very reliant on his f4. I honestly use it a bit too much. I just don't like getting poked out of my f344 (which barely even happens).

I also use his d4 like every 5 seconds. It's plus 17 on hit, so I go into f3,f4,or a throw. When on recovery they start doing pokes i just stay back and forceball. B34 I try to using sparingly. People tend to react to it on okie, and it's bad against people who jump.

I enjoy canceling strings into ex balls.... Well when it works. After landing ex forceballs I like going in with 124 I believe(the +6 one) to set up the spicy frame traps. Lastly, unless I'm forgetting something else, I started using b2. Nobody punishes it, and it's an ok anti air and can beat some pokes

I've yet to see someone mention 244. You can do it in close range instead so they can't duck. It's dangerous in the wall.

 

[lionheart21]

I've yet to see someone mention 244. You can do it in close range instead so they can't duck. It's dangerous in the wall.

I've mentioned it

 

[lionheart21]

Johnny in the current meta:

Johnny: "Hey, why wasn't I your chosen one?"
Player: "Do you have all day?"
Johnny: "Yeah...I do."

 

[DaZengie]

I think the brutality requirements are quite stupid too. "Don't block an attack during the final round" is ridiculous. That goes for every character. The other two have to be done with his other variation. I can't unlock Cage's Tower, because I have to perform 10 brutalities.

You can just do the universal d2 "The Klassic" brutality.

 

[SwiftEagle]

I've mentioned it

My mistake then.

You can just do the universal d2 "The Klassic" brutality.

You have to win the match without blocking in the final round.

 

[FreshPrinceOfPine]

Question for you Johnny mains: I main Jacqui but have had my eye on Johnny since his Kombat kast. Would it be redundant to play both of them? Since both theyre game plans are basically pressure with good frame data. Like what I just be better off perfecting my Jacqui instead of trying to play both?

 

[Javoo On Fire]

I like cage I really do, but nrs has to fix the freaking low profiling issues on crouching blocked characters, alot of Johnny's best strings that give him plus frames are highs and its driving me insane lol

 

[Frank Reed]

I don’t know if this has been discussed but being able to special cancel out of D4 is really good. D4 into unblockable caged rage is really amazing and of course you can always D4 into ex ball.

 

[DragonofDadashov24]

I like cage I really do, but nrs has to fix the freaking low profiling issues on crouching blocked characters, alot of Johnny's best strings that give him plus frames are highs and its driving me insane lol

His bf2 WHIFFS ON BLOCK
WHAT THE FUCKA

 

[DragonofDadashov24]

I don’t know if this has been discussed but being able to special cancel out of D4 is really good. D4 into unblockable caged rage is really amazing and of course you can always D4 into ex ball.

Yeah but when you hit that Cage rage you’re back in neutral. With no mids. And a 18f low. Try doing a throw and you eat d2 KB. Got into that multiple times

 

[Wigy]

I don’t know if this has been discussed but being able to special cancel out of D4 is really good. D4 into unblockable caged rage is really amazing and of course you can always D4 into ex ball.

That's a horrible Gamble and people are always ready to hit you back with something after a blocked poke.

 

[M.D.]

If a char (not giving any SPECIFIC names, HHHHHHHHINT) has a 6 frame d1 then you're pretty much screwed as any string or special that he does -8 or less makes your mids irrelevant, so you literally have to d1 and d4 the entire game.

I know that's all he has, but we have to stop selling this as THE gameplan. It's not a gameplan, it's a patched workaround for not having a proper toolset.

 

[DragonofDadashov24]

If a char (not giving any SPECIFIC names, HHHHHHHHINT) has a 6 frame d1 then you're pretty much screwed as any string or special that he does -8 or less makes your mids irrelevant, so you literally have to d1 and d4 the entire game.

I know that's all he has, but we have to stop selling this as THE gameplan. It's not a gameplan, it's a patched workaround for not having a proper toolset.

I enforce them to d1 and after my poke I just walk back and they eat the low. Think he was intended this way as a punishing character. But there were no words about him whiffing his advanced moves and his knee sucks

 

[ShepherdOfFire]

I think the brutality requirements are quite stupid too. "Don't block an attack during the final round" is ridiculous. That goes for every character. The other two have to be done with his other variation. I can't unlock Cage's Tower, because I have to perform 10 brutalities.

Go in Survivor tower, very easy and it should be done in 10 minutes. Just play without blocking and d2 the opponent at the end of the round, works everytime (there's only one round per game). That's how I completed the brutalities challenge for Cage's tower.

 

[Javoo On Fire]

I don’t know if this has been discussed but being able to special cancel out of D4 is really good. D4 into unblockable caged rage is really amazing and of course you can always D4 into ex ball.

too bad caged rage is like 1000 frames of start up and its completely reactable, the first hit can easily be ducked, no wait a minute doesn't it whiff on characters block ducking with small hurt boxes. Oh hai eat a d2 kb. Lol nrs is slacking fix the hit boxes already idk what other characters have the most problems with hit boxes besides Johnny.

 

[DrFolmer]

Question for you Johnny mains: I main Jacqui but have had my eye on Johnny since his Kombat kast. Would it be redundant to play both of them? Since both theyre game plans are basically pressure with good frame data. Like what I just be better off perfecting my Jacqui instead of trying to play both?

They play differently. Johnny is at his core a footsie character. Jacqui got some good fast mids for once she gets in. It makes her very dangerous especially if it's the variation with the cancels. People are more reluctant to spam pokes because they can get full combo punished from a 9 frame mid. If you go into Johnny with the same mindset as with Jacqui it's gonna be a dissapointment. If you're looking for someone with more of an emphasis on spacing and whiff punishing Johnny is an option.

So, I wouldn't say it's redundant to play Johnny on the side. I will say that playing Johnny teaches you good fundamentals because he absolutely relies on it. And that will translate to your Jacqui most likely

 

[Kreeg]

how do you setup brass knuckles?

 

[Rizz091]

how do you setup brass knuckles?

I've honestly been ignoring this move because it doesn't seem worth using right now. You can end a combo with 121 cancelled into brass knucks to activate it safely tho.

 

[Kreeg]

anyway this is my thoughts about JC

1. need more KB or balance existing ones
2. brass knuckles. remove 6-10 frames on recovery
3. shorten the Fatal Blow's refresh time after cancelling to 4-5 secs. Maybe the less you have HP the less you have refresh time
4. then brass knuckles are active throw must do 150 or more damage. Maybe the less HP the more damage / chip damage.
5. maybe f3 mid
6. db4 on stage 2 on hit = KB
7. db4 on stage 3 amp add plus on hit to perform combo at corners

 

[ShepherdOfFire]

Do you use the brass knuckles frequently ? It's so hard to setup safely that I almost never use it. And even when you can setup it in a safe way, it's usually after a 121 but the problem is that it has a great pushback on hit and you can't really take advantage of it. Same thing if you take advantage of being in a fullscreen situation to trigger the buff, the opponent will do anything he can to keep you away while it's active. So most of the time I end the 121 combo with a shadow kick because I prefer securing the 3~4% of damage than going for the brass knuckles and take the risk of dealing 0% chip damage while it's active

I've read somewhere that the pissed off ability (the combo ender with the dbf input) does extra damage with the brass knuckles on. That's a great idea but... Why didn't they make a tournament variation with both moves included if they are complementary ? I mean they did the same thing with Kano Dirtbag with the Molotov and Chemical burn allowing for an unblockable setup when both moves are combined, so why didn't they give Johnny a similar kit ?

 

[Name v.5.0]

Just beat Darth Arma’s Sub Zero in ranked. Feeling myself a little. Hahahahha.

 

[Wrath0594]

GUYS, I DID IT. I FINALLY GOT YOU ALL SOME CAGE GAMEPLAY!!!
It just isn't me playing as him...

This guy legit had me worried, though. It was to the point I nearly switched to Skarlet after game 1, but I'm glad I didn't. Elected not to play the mirror because I hate hitbox bugs. Dude's name was Flash, but he hasn't accepted my friend request yet. Flash- if you're here, add me, dude.

I ate a lot of f4's, but by game 3 and 4 I decided to see how much neutral crouching I could get away with. I have no doubt he would have stomped me if I wasn't a Cage main, myself. Was the only reason I knew to do things like try d1 when I got nutpunched, what I could check him with after blocking f344, and where to respect his + frames. Not to say he didn't know Liu Kang counterplay as well. You'll notice he was aware enough to tech backthrow which is the one that leads to oki, and he flawless blocked my f43u4, but he missed the u2 timing.

If anyone is wondering what he could have done, or currently midway through typing "this is why we need buffs!" there are a couple of ways he could have won. Firstly, he could have contested more of my f43's with d3's or 121's to get me to change options to fireball or parry cancel, since both are punishable on read. He really needed to take his turn after blocking these. Also could have forced me to approach, since we both saw that forceballs are faster than fireballs. He also could have worked in more d4's and f4's in neutral, especially on wakeup where he kept trying f2 instead which was whiffing. Didn't throw me enough on wakeup either, so I was free to reset the gamestate a lot. Gave me too many jump in 2's as well, needed to get more anti air conversions. Plenty of smaller things as well.

 

[Owerbart]

i remember people complained a bit about the 244 funky input timing so this is a small video i made, hope it can help someone!

 

[Rodney Quillz]

I absolutely can’t stand Liu kang, so obnoxious.