The Amplifier Meterburn Thread

[Kroaken]

I really hope they don't return, that system is terrible.
Imagine how is that you want to block and you end up enhancing your special.
you want an enhanced special after you block only to not come out.

The flawless block system also takes advantage of this change, i would honestly advise people to chill and wait having contact with the game.

I mean I super agree with you. It is a better system in a handful of ways, at least on paper. But it's easy to forget how massive the casual audience is. I forget all the time.

"When I go to learn a new character, am I supposed to spend an hour learning their moves?" Is an actual statement I just heard.

 

[Eddy Wang]

I mean I super agree with you. It is a better system in a handful of ways, at least on paper. But it's easy to forget how massive the casual audience is. I forget all the time.

"When I go to learn a new character, am I supposed to spend an hour learning their moves?" Is an actual statement I just heard.

there are games harder than Mortal Kombat and have a bigger casual adience and much more complicated commands.

Do you think, pressing an extra button that is not block hard?
Imagine having to press two buttons at same time and release one after one frame?
Imagine a Shoryuken motion where your perfect execution has to be just frame otherwise your character is garbage.

Not really on anyone's toe here, just an example that there is way harder games out there, and the casual crowd for that game is also bigger.

A fighting game shouldn't be to make everything easier, specially when you present consequences of having the block button multitasking with offense and defense, if you think this way, casuals will always get in the way of balancing a game which they could benefict when they get better, not only yo make things easier for them, but casuals aren't the only type of players beneficting for that change, pros take bigger advantage of things that was made easier when it was there to regulate them in first place.

A fighting game should give you layers to improve on, every pro or competitive fighter was a casual at some point in time.

 

[Kroaken]

there are games harder than Mortal Kombat and have a bigger casual adience and much more complicated commands.

Do you think, pressing an extra button that is not block hard?
Imagine having to press two buttons at same time and release one after one frame?
Imagine a Shoryuken motion where your perfect execution has to be just frame otherwise your character is garbage.

Not really on anyone's toe here, just an example that there is way harder games out there, and the casual crowd for that game is also bigger.

A fighting game shouldn't be to make everything easier, specially when you present consequences of having the block button multitasking with offense and defense, if you think this way, casuals will always get in the way of balancing a game which they could benefict when they get better, not only yo make things easier for them, but casuals aren't the only type of players beneficting for that change, pros take bigger advantage of things that was made easier when it was there to regulate them in first place.

A fighting game should give you layers to improve on, every pro or competitive fighter was a casual at some point in time.

Yeah I absolutely agree. I don't want mk11 to be sfv. I remember spending hours upon hours in the lab with hakan in sf4. Then sfv came along and I could do max damage with 15-20 min in training mode. It was such a stark difference. And I wasn't a fan.

But some of the comments make me think that there are a lot of players that don't care about having something to strive for in the lab.

 

[Eddy Wang]

Yeah I absolutely agree. I don't want mk11 to be sfv. I remember spending hours upon hours in the lab with hakan in sf4. Then sfv came along and I could do Max dmg on my char in maybe 15-20. It was such a stark difference. And I didn't like it. But I don't think some players care about having that goal to work for. They want it right away and I just can't wrap my head around it.

Those who want everything right now, are also the ones who don't lab and complain about everything.

We need more players who are willing to learn, to investigate before judging, though this simple execution barrier shouldn't really alienate anyone tho.

 

[MagicMan357]

The only thing i believe is that the amplify command should require the same button as the regular one (ExF1xf1)

BTW i dont even get the logic behind saying there is a lack of combos. I think you guys want the same easy and safe 50/50 combo into 35% no meter.

 

[Kroaken]

Those who want everything right now, are also the ones who don't lab and complain about everything.

We need more players who are willing to learn, to investigate before judging, though this simple execution barrier shouldn't really alienate anyone tho.

Yeah. Ultimately I think it would be a positive direction. With run cancels gone, which were the only challenging part of combos in mkx, this is about the biggest hurdle I'd imagine a learning player would face.

 

[Kroaken]

The only thing i believe is that the amplify command should require the same button as the regular one (ExF1xf1)

I could get on board with the amplify input being of the same button as the move it's amplifying. But I also understand why they did it the way they did.

 

[Eddy Wang]

I could get on board with the amplify input being of the same button as the move it's amplifying. But I also understand why they did it the way they did.

Yep, sometimes we mash, i do press a button twice sometimes. having to amplify with the executed button might end up you accidentaly amplify moves.

 

[Kroaken]

Yep, sometimes we mash, i do press a button twice sometimes. having to amplify with the executed button might end up you accidentaly amplify moves.

Yeah. If they end up as the same button, we'd just have to tighten our execution, which is fine. Usually only happens in lag when I want to make sure my input doesn't get eaten.

 

[Darth-Nero]

I still refuse the notion that it's only a casuals issue, This will affect all tiers of play. It's much more a memory complexity than a skill barrier.

If you play both Sonya and Baraka and both of their projectile commands are df2 yet to enhance Baraka's projectile you press 1 and for Sonya's you press 2 again, When you are in the heat of battle and thinking about a million things while trusting commands to your muscle memory, it's so easy to mix the commands identical specials.

We've all had that Ermac main friend who picked up Scorpion and he just keep dropping combos because both teleports behave very similar and have the same db command yet one tied to 3 and the other to 4. Sure the player blames himself but deep down he's like " couldn't both teleports just had db4 input?"

It's for that very reason Shoryuken, Tiger uppercut, Jet upper..,etc all have the exact same input. There is no reason to add a complexity that screws up your muscle memory on purpose. It's not a good design.

 

[BecomingDeath13]

I vote we turn all amplify inputs into pretzels

 

[Kroaken]

I still refuse the notion that it's only a casuals issue, This will affect all tiers of play. It's much more a memory complexity than a skill barrier.

If you play both Sonya and Baraka and both of their projectile commands are df2 yet to enhance Baraka's projectile you press 1 and for Sonya's you press 2 again, When you are in the heat of battle and thinking about a million things while trusting commands to your muscle memory, it's so easy to mix the commands identical specials.

We've all had that Ermac main friend who picked up Scorpion and he just keep dropping combos because both teleports behave the very similar and have the same db command yet one tied to 3 and the other to 4. Sure the player blames himself but deep down he's like " couldn't both teleports just had db4 input?"

It's for that very reason Shoryuken, Tiger uppercut, Jet upper..,etc all have the exact same input. There is no reason to add a complexity that screws up your muscle memory on purpose. It's not a good design.

If it encourages character loyalty, I support it.

 

[Darth-Nero]

If it encourages character loyalty, I support it.

Sure but what about ppl who like to explore more options or love more than one character? Why would we wanna screw them over or make it more difficult for them to get better with multiple characters?

 

[Kroaken]

Sure but what about ppl who like to explore more options or love more than one character? Why would we wanna screw them over or make it more difficult for them to get better with multiple characters?

I'm sorry, but that is part and parcel with learning a new character. I could easily make the argument for why combos or specials should be the same between the two characters so that I didn't have to change or risk messing up in the heat of the moment. You'd scoff but are they really that dissimilar of stances? I don't think they are.

 

[666 I HazeOner]

I would rather have ex moves tied to a universal button, but it is what it is. I just hope that the amplify buttons are in line with the animations as it makes 'm more easy to remember.

Maybe they had to change the command because some ex moves interfered with the flawless block mechanic?

 

[Badboy Takuma]

But is it complicated tho?

i dont know but they are doing petitions because of it as you know hehe

Why i'm having a sense of deja vu here?

Spoiler: well

something had to be done because... no one else did... thing is we dont need such petition threads being on top on tym for multiple reasons. lot of people are looking for infos about everything mk11 and tym should be that place. petition threads and such being on top for days creates an wrong impression about mk11 already. other then tym there is discord , twitter or reddit but that does not work because people need to be familiar with the scene in order to be able to find the right infos there. yt could be a right place, like tym to get infos but do we want them to watch xXxUNCAGEDgameZZxXx or any of those full on scrubs? i mean we talked about this in that storms thread months ago lol.

 

[RyuKazuya]

I m curious how this is gonning to work out, therefore I am waiting for the beta, so I can see for myself. For now from what i ve seen so far, it looks like that the game is gonna be deep and will definitely take more than a day practice mode to get good with a character.

I guess if there is someone in MK11 who manages to be good with more than 3 characters, he will be showered with respect.

 

[Barrogh]

I can see the wanting to block ASAP after a special causing Ex version to come out unintentionally as an issue this input system can avoid, but I think it could be done in a more intuitive fashion (same button, stance flip, whatever).

Other than that I still believe that FG controls should be designed on the the same principles interface for any software should be - to enact whatever user wants with maximum precision and minimum resistance.

 

[BecomingDeath13]

I guess if there is someone in MK11 who manages to be good with more than 3 characters, he will be showered with respect.

That man will be REO

 

[Inzzane_79]

Instead of the block button change it to the stance button. No accidental meterburning when you want to block fast after a special.

Personally I want to play it like it is at the moment first before jumping to "meeeh, I want my 1-button meterburn back". Just so I can decide for myself what fits better.

Maybe we get both in the end? They could make it a setting that we can change like a lot of other input stuff (negative edge for example)

 

[Scott The Scot]

https://twitter.com/DecayNRS/status/1088440382676000768

It makes sense, really.

 

[theotherguy]

Maybe we get both in the end?

Stupid idea. Why would anyone what to choose the more complex option? Unless you didn't know you could change it or you just like a challenge.

If it stays and everyone uses it then at least everyone is on the same level. If one person is using block and the other is doing finger gymnastics i don't think that's fair.

Although the more i think about the current way they're done the more i like the idea of different inputs for them.

But I also understand why they did it the way they did.

Same here. And it actually makes a lot of sense. But my problem with it is that you don't know what the input is until you learn it. So there's no way to infer what the amplify input might be. Projectile DF1, then amplify with 1 you could probably guess. But DF1 then 4 or B3 because Sub moves back then does a kick, you'll never guess unless you've seen the move before or seen the movelist.

Sure previously you had to learn all your characters moves, but at least you knew move + block = enhanced. Now the amplify could be literally any button or combination. And when there's no rule it just adds another level of complexity that isn't needed.

Like i said, i like this idea, but so long as it's a little more streamlined.

 

[HeavyNorse]

https://twitter.com/DecayNRS/status/1088440382676000768

It makes sense, really.

This is exactly why I hated that the Block button was used for enhancing moves as well. It just felt so awkward.

 

[Scott The Scot]

This is exactly why I hated that the Block button was used for enhancing moves as well. It just felt so awkward.

I've been playing since MK9 so it's not awkward to me, but it just makes sense hearing the reasoning for the change.

 

[HeavyNorse]

I've been playing since MK9

I've been playing since the first MK on the SNES. Not sure what that has to do with anything though. XD