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General/Other - Sub-Zero Sub-Zero General Discussion

Tender

Noob
Been having issues with fast poke character like Lao, when I get caught they just spam me with down one and there's nothing I can do about it.
 

Northern Slasher

Heads or Tails X
Block it and poke back with your D3. You can D3 and try to jump out, or D3, block his poke, grab his ass and throw him into Grandmaster jail.
 

Northern Slasher

Heads or Tails X
Just whatever you do, don't panic. Also another thing you could/should do is watch Madzins Sub against Foxys KL, or just his Sub in general. You could learn a lot.
 

Hor_PeT

Kombatant
Block it and poke back with your D3. You can D3 and try to jump out, or D3, block his poke, grab his ass and throw him into Grandmaster jail.
Only problem if you lose the frames online due to the lag and the opponent abuses it. But that shouldn't be a strategy lol.

New online is very good though.
 

Tender

Noob
11 whiffs for me when they do d1 , blocking gives them a 50/50 window so the only thing I try to do now is poke back and jump, that's assuming they don't caught me again with continuous poke from the faster frame data :/
 

ChaosTheory

A fat woman came into the shoe store today...
What's the punish for Mileena's Tele-Kick into (delayed?) Air Sai? In the flow of the matches, I just crouched the Sai then d1 into f4,2. Was I under punishing?
 

Northern Slasher

Heads or Tails X
Share a little more with us. What's happening in the MU that's giving you trouble?
I feel like I can never get in. I use slide to avoid rockets and get in but my recovery is too long and I get punished. He literally just plays keep away the entire time and I feel like I'm in a constant up hill battle.

His mobility makes it very tough for me to get him and keep him in the corner. And I get outpoked after anything neutral since Subs pokes are 9f minimum.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
I feel like I can never get in. I use slide to avoid rockets and get in but my recovery is too long and I get punished. He literally just plays keep away the entire time and I feel like I'm in a constant up hill battle.

His mobility makes it very tough for me to get him and keep him in the corner. And I get outpoked after anything neutral since Subs pokes are 9f minimum.
Keep away can work in your favor, since he's likely pushing himself to the corner. Slide should basically get you in for free, no matter what rocket he's using. Try to use it more preemptively if he's punishing you. If he's too predictable with his rockets, use MB ice blast and take the trade.

After blocking Triborgs pokes, it's basically your turn. Throw an f4 xx clone instead of a poke of your own and wait to see what he does. This is the spine of SZ's game plan in general. Keep in mind that his 1114 and f43 are both +2, but they have gaps as well. Respect the follow up, or hit the gap with MB frost bomb.

As far as Triborg's neutral goes, SZ's d4 should absolutely dominate. Get familiar with his pokes and space a little more carefully. You can duck and punish his only mid string and low profile almost everything else. After d4 hits, take the +19f it gives you and pressure him with run b12 or f33. If he tries anything but block, you'll hit him.

Once he's cornered behind clone, wait for him to make a move. If he air dashes or teleports, punish and put him back in the corner. If he jumps, slam him with b2 on the way down. If he blocks, run up and throw him into the clone.

With such a powerful low poke and the ability to move around zoning, SZ shouldn't have so much trouble with this MU. Play smart and you'll exhaust his options quickly.
 

Northern Slasher

Heads or Tails X
Keep away can work in your favor, since he's likely pushing himself to the corner. Slide should basically get you in for free, no matter what rocket he's using. Try to use it more preemptively if he's punishing you. If he's too predictable with his rockets, use MB ice blast and take the trade.

After blocking Triborgs pokes, it's basically your turn. Throw an f4 xx clone instead of a poke of your own and wait to see what he does. This is the spine of SZ's game plan in general. Keep in mind that his 1114 and f43 are both +2, but they have gaps as well. Respect the follow up, or hit the gap with MB frost bomb.

As far as Triborg's neutral goes, SZ's d4 should absolutely dominate. Get familiar with his pokes and space a little more carefully. You can duck and punish his only mid string and low profile almost everything else. After d4 hits, take the +19f it gives you and pressure him with run b12 or f33. If he tries anything but block, you'll hit him.

Once he's cornered behind clone, wait for him to make a move. If he air dashes or teleports, punish and put him back in the corner. If he jumps, slam him with b2 on the way down. If he blocks, run up and throw him into the clone.

With such a powerful low poke and the ability to move around zoning, SZ shouldn't have so much trouble with this MU. Play smart and you'll exhaust his options quickly.
Thank you very much for your input. I'll definitely be working on all these aspects you've laid out.
 

AGRxShiroKuma

The White Bear
How good is sub zero tier wise in mortal kombat x? I use cryomacer most of the time but will resort to one of the other variations if I feel like I would stand a better chance.
 

STB BroZki

Don’t know what to put here
So I'm having lost and lots of trouble with Dvorah. I've been using Cryomancer against her since I think it's better. Any tips guys? Just having a tough time getting her off of me really. I feel once she's in your face she just goes apeshit lol
 

Snoop88

Noob
So I'm having lost and lots of trouble with Dvorah. I've been using Cryomancer against her since I think it's better. Any tips guys? Just having a tough time getting her off of me really. I feel once she's in your face she just goes apeshit lol
Dvorah is Subby's worst match up. SQ 7-3. Really hard time. Any tips.. hmm she does have only one armored special. Weak wake up options. However she does have answer for almost every subby's option.

 

Dankster Morgan

It is better this way
So I'm having lost and lots of trouble with Dvorah. I've been using Cryomancer against her since I think it's better. Any tips guys? Just having a tough time getting her off of me really. I feel once she's in your face she just goes apeshit lol
Imo Cryomancer is the way to go for D'Vorah. But this matchup got harder after the patch. Before you could crush her wake up with jump in 1 1 after a hammer ended. Idk if this is a thing now that her armor is faster... This is gonna be a tough match any way you slice it. Don't use ice ball, it's useless in this matchup. I suppose something that could help is when doing a one bar combo, just F42gap xx ice blast F12 for the frame advantage and force the mixup. Anything that keeps the momentum from D'Vorah. Another thing is that she neglects one of Cryomancer's strengths. Usually you shouldn't break, because Cryomancer can deal more damage to make up for it but D'vorah goes blow for blow dealing just as much damage sometimes meter less. Breaking might be a good option to take away her stamina. I'd recommend trying to stay just outside F4 range and try to force something to whiff, or do a cross up, or a D4. D4 tends to be a good help in this match, good range and it's like plus 17. Air hammer is good if you get her in the corner because it crushes wake ups. And if all else fails, 50/50. This is a really tough matchup but it's not unwinnable imo, it's just really dumb.