Match-up Discussion Joker Matchup Discussion

[StevoSuprem0]

Guys can someone tell me how am I meant to use these chattering teeth, I know all the button combinations but I don't know how im meant to put them into my play, im a big Joker a fan and bought this game cause he was in it and if he wasn't then I wouldn't have Injustice cause I don't pick a character just cause they can do a lot of damage easily or they are top tier I pick a character cause I like the character himself not his game play and moves but I also don't like losing and I think that if I can learn how to use the teeth I'll win more.

Edit: By the way I read some teeth guides and combos and tried them out in practice mode and I also watched a few video guides but im steel bad with teeth.

Did you see mine? Me and Gilbagz have some good stuff in this thread, in the OP and in some of the comments later on:
http://testyourmight.com/threads/joker-teeth-combos-and-setups.35419/

 

[Espio]

Qwark28 OmegaK Cat @everyone else

Anyone have an updated/current match up chart for Joker? He seems to be one of the only characters with not much data and I'm trying to get a better feel for where he stands. I also get limited experience from Joker players, once in a blue moon at best do a come across one. Thanks in advance .

 

[Qwark28]

Qwark28 OmegaK Cat @everyone else

Anyone have an updated/current match up chart for Joker? He seems to be one of the only characters with not much data and I'm trying to get a better feel for where he stands. I also get limited experience from Joker players, once in a blue moon at best do a come across one. Thanks in advance .

IMO
5 5 lobo
5 5 ares
5 5 harley quin
5 5 scorpion
5 5 batgirl
5 5 shazam
5 5 lex
4 6 hawkgirl
4 6 grundy
4 6 catwoman
4 6 cyborg
4 6 KF
4 6 doomsday
4 6 deathstroke
4 6 WW
4 6 GL
4 6 superman
4 6 bane
3 7 NW
3 7 batman
3 7 black adam
3 7 sinestro
3 7 raven
3 7 zod
3 7 aquaman
2 8 flash
1 9 green arrow

its like im playing subzero all over again

 

[Espio]

IMO
5 5 lobo
5 5 ares
5 5 harley quin
5 5 scorpion
5 5 batgirl
5 5 shazam
5 5 lex
4 6 hawkgirl
4 6 grundy
4 6 catwoman
4 6 cyborg
4 6 KF
4 6 doomsday
4 6 deathstroke
4 6 WW
4 6 GL
4 6 superman
4 6 bane
3 7 NW
3 7 batman
3 7 black adam
3 7 sinestro
3 7 raven
3 7 zod
3 7 aquaman
2 8 flash
1 9 green arrow

its like im playing subzero all over again

I was with you till you got to Green Arrow and Flash...those two are dumbfounding to me, why are those so bad or are you trolling? I'm perplexed lol.

I agree on Hawkgirl being 6-4 in her favor though.

 

[Qwark28]

I was with you till you got to Green Arrow and Flash...those two are dumbfounding to me, why are those so bad or are you trolling? I'm perplexed lol.

I agree on Hawkgirl being 6-4 in her favor though.

green arrows normal arrows completely destroy joker, he has absolutely no way to approach green arrow other than walk and J3 and a dream, a low arrow on hit is +6 or so while on block about +2, a standing arrow is +84 on hit, if he catches you dashing with one he can walk up and get out a string for free, this includes arrows from f23d1 mixups.

now add in electric, fire and ice arrows and you have a character joker can't touch and can zone him forever.

GAs backdash lowers his hitbox and gunshot whiffs, on a knockdown savage blast read joker can only get 17% or 33% for one bar and if GA doesnt do it you wasted all wakeup pressure

savage blast + slide sending you fullscreen are a huge pain in the ass + jokers only legit crossup setup is destroyed by those 2 moves and essentially becomes a 4 way read.

flash is flash, cant keep him out, he an MB charge on reaction to teeth, punish gunshot on whiff with mb charge, joker cant get the lifelead and flashes bnb gives him back 90% of the bar he used for MB LK
he also punishes jokers 21 212 f232 on block for full combo via interrupts. you cant zone, keepaway or even do a fucking string.

 

[Qwark28]

vs ga he cant zone, he cant rushdown, he cant jump because stupidly enough, arrows j3 has priority over jokers and his D2 is now godlike, up close d1 arrow and d1 savage blast dominate

its jokers worst matchup and pretty much unwinnable at the highest lvl

 

[Espio]

green arrows normal arrows completely destroy joker, he has absolutely no way to approach green arrow other than walk and J3 and a dream, a low arrow on hit is +6 or so while on block about +2, a standing arrow is +84 on hit, if he catches you dashing with one, he can walk up and get out a string for free, this includes arrows from f23d1 mixups.

now add in electric, fire and ice arrows and you have a character joker can't touch and can zone him forever.

GAs backdash lowers his hitbox and gunshot whiffs, on a knockdown savage blast read joker can only get 17% or 33% for one bar and if GA doesnt do it you wasted all wakeup pressure

savage blast + slide sending you fullscreen are a huge pain in the ass + jokers only legit crossup setup is destroyed by those 2 moves and essentially becomes a 4 way read.

flash is flash, cant keep him out, he an MB charge on reaction to teeth, punish gunshot on whiff with mb charge, joker cant get the lifelead and flashes bnb gives him back 90% of the bar he used for MB LK
he also punishes jokers 21 212 f232 on block for full combo via interrupts. you cant zone, keepaway or even do a fucking string.

Thanks for your insight, that's interesting and unexpected for worst match ups.

Flash interrupts his strings with down 2 or a MB special? Just curious on that.

 

[Qwark28]

Thanks for your insight, that's interesting and unexpected for worst match ups.

Flash interrupts his strings with down 2 or a MB special? Just curious on that.

d12/d2/

 

[medhood]

Did you see mine? Me and Gilbagz have some good stuff in this thread, in the OP and in some of the comments later on:
http://testyourmight.com/threads/joker-teeth-combos-and-setups.35419/

I tried everything shown in that thread and read the combo's and watch the videos over and over multiple times but failed to pull the combos off.

Edit: By the way is release check on better for Joker or off currently im playing with off.

 

[Student]

I tried everything shown in that thread and read the combo's and watch the videos over and over multiple times but failed to pull the combos off.

Edit: By the way is release check on better for Joker or off currently im playing with off.

I think I'll chime in here only because I too was recently in the exact same position as you. I struggled with learning those combos and over time was able to figure out how to do them.

First, I play with release check off and alternate controls off, and I'm able to execute at least Combo 1 mentioned in StevoSuprem0's thread. Secondly, it's important to remember that when executing far teeth within a combo sequence, you have to incorporate a slight delay before pressing foreword after the qcb3. If you enter qcb3f really quickly, there's a chance that the game will give you bf3, which is crowbar.

You have to attack the combos in little pieces and commit each piece to muscle memory, then attempt to combine all of them into one big combo. For myself, I began in training mode by throwing out far teeth (with both characters reset in the middle) and then ji2 cancel into far teeth (I'm not sure if it's considered a true cancel but I basically input the qcb3 immediately after the ji2). I did that repeatedly until I felt like I had it down. I then moved on to adding in a ji3 cancel into far teeth (again, I don't know if it's a true cancel. I input the teeth immediately after the crowbar connects, delay slightly, and then press forward). And on and on until I accomplished the whole combo. Basically everything after the b+3 is pretty basic if you're familiar with some of joker's bnbs. Anyways, I hope this helps you with executing some of those teeth combos, and sorry for any confusion regarding the canceling.

 

[medhood]

I think I'll chime in here only because I too was recently in the exact same position as you. I struggled with learning those combos and over time was able to figure out how to do them.

First, I play with release check off and alternate controls off, and I'm able to execute at least Combo 1 mentioned in StevoSuprem0's thread. Secondly, it's important to remember that when executing far teeth within a combo sequence, you have to incorporate a slight delay before pressing foreword after the qcb3. If you enter qcb3f really quickly, there's a chance that the game will give you bf3, which is crowbar.

You have to attack the combos in little pieces and commit each piece to muscle memory, then attempt to combine all of them into one big combo. For myself, I began in training mode by throwing out far teeth (with both characters reset in the middle) and then ji2 cancel into far teeth (I'm not sure if it's considered a true cancel but I basically input the qcb3 immediately after the ji2). I did that repeatedly until I felt like I had it down. I then moved on to adding in a ji3 cancel into far teeth (again, I don't know if it's a true cancel. I input the teeth immediately after the crowbar connects, delay slightly, and then press forward). And on and on until I accomplished the whole combo. Basically everything after the b+3 is pretty basic if you're familiar with some of joker's bnbs. Anyways, I hope this helps you with executing some of those teeth combos, and sorry for any confusion regarding the canceling.

Ok thanks for the advice but I got a few questions, firstly do you use a arcade stick or controller cause im using my PS3 controller as I never bought an arcade stick since I've been a big fan of an fighting game until I just casually played them but when I bought Injustice because it was on sale and I like the Batman movies and cartoons and Joker I loved the game and I want to know if these combo's are possible on a PS3 controller.
Second question, after I throw my first set of teeth and I input the commands for the jump in 2 do I input the commands for my second set of teeth during the jump (after I pressed 2 for the kick) or after I land the kick thank you?

 

[StevoSuprem0]

Ok thanks for the advice but I got a few questions, firstly do you use a arcade stick or controller cause im using my PS3 controller as I never bought an arcade stick since I've been a big fan of an fighting game until I just casually played them but when I bought Injustice because it was on sale and I like the Batman movies and cartoons and Joker I loved the game and I want to know if these combo's are possible on a PS3 controller.
Second question, after I throw my first set of teeth and I input the commands for the jump in 2 do I input the commands for my second set of teeth during the jump (after I pressed 2 for the kick) or after I land the kick thank you?

Controller- I have done them on PS3 after a bit of practice. I use an Xbox controller and I find them a bit easier on there, but I think it's more just because that's what I'm accustom too since I kinda roll around the Dpad when doing there and that's easier to do on an Xbox controller. But yeah, they are definitely possible on PS3.
As for throwing the teeth, it depends on which jump in you are doing. If you do ji3, you have to wait until you touch the ground to finish the input, so start buffering it right before you hit with db, hit 3 when you land, then hit forward to get far teeth. Like mayday said, if you hit forward too soon, you'll get crowbar instead of teeth. However, if you are using ji2, you can buffer the entire db3 in air, then press forward after you land (again, to prevent using crowbar instead). They can take some time to master, it's kind of more of a rhythm thing than anything else, at least in my opinion. To be honest, while they are some of his hugest sources of damage, it is vastly more important to master his footsies game and just general usage during a fight because most of the teeth setups are easily escaped unless you are outside of the corner. But anyways, hope this helps!

 

[Student]

Ok thanks for the advice but I got a few questions, firstly do you use a arcade stick or controller cause im using my PS3 controller as I never bought an arcade stick since I've been a big fan of an fighting game until I just casually played them but when I bought Injustice because it was on sale and I like the Batman movies and cartoons and Joker I loved the game and I want to know if these combo's are possible on a PS3 controller.
Second question, after I throw my first set of teeth and I input the commands for the jump in 2 do I input the commands for my second set of teeth during the jump (after I pressed 2 for the kick) or after I land the kick thank you?

They are definitely possible on the ps3 pad. In fact, check out this guy http://www.twitch.tv/mufasarawrzandhisgames on twitch. He fluctuates between #1 and #3 on the ps3 leaderboards and he uses the stock ps3 pad. Take a look at his past broadcasts to see some of his games. Otherwise, what StevoSuprem0 said should explain the timing.

To be honest, while they are some of his hugest sources of damage, it is vastly more important to master his footsies game and just general usage during a fight because most of the teeth setups are easily escaped unless you are outside of the corner. But anyways, hope this helps!

Have there been any threads that focus on footsies with The Joker? If not, I think that would be a very interesting topic to expand on, because at least I myself would learn a lot from it.

 

[StevoSuprem0]

They are definitely possible on the ps3 pad. In fact, check out this guy http://www.twitch.tv/mufasarawrzandhisgames on twitch. He fluctuates between #1 and #3 on the ps3 leaderboards and he uses the stock ps3 pad. Take a look at his past broadcasts to see some of his games. Otherwise, what StevoSuprem0 said should explain the timing.

Have there been any threads that focus on footsies with The Joker? If not, I think that would be a very interesting topic to expand on, because at least I myself would learn a lot from it.

In what way? In that thread I posted I did a little bit involving teeth and footsies (thread focused on teeth stuff in general). Otherwise, if you're just talking what footsies are most useful and such, I generally use b13, f21, and 213 (as mixup when they are expecting a RLG). As for how best to incorporate them, I tend to start out with pokes (d1) after I block something, then straight into one of them to get myself on the offensive, then you go from there as to how you follow up offensively. That's all pretty basic though...

 

[Student]

In what way? In that thread I posted I did a little bit involving teeth and footsies (thread focused on teeth stuff in general). Otherwise, if you're just talking what footsies are most useful and such, I generally use b13, f21, and 213 (as mixup when they are expecting a RLG). As for how best to incorporate them, I tend to start out with pokes (d1) after I block something, then straight into one of them to get myself on the offensive, then you go from there as to how you follow up offensively. That's all pretty basic though...

Yeah, I meant in more of a general sense. But that info is actually really useful to me since I'm still familiarizing myself with The Joker, so thanks. I'm pretty familiar with the spacing for b13 but I'll have to check out f21 and 213 and get used to the spacing of those. Something I'm curious about though is given the horizontal hitbox on d2, do you ever incorporate that into your ground game or do you just mainly use it as AA?

 

[StevoSuprem0]

The hitbox on d2 is insane. It's good for AA and ground stuff, and if you catch them on the ground, you can cancel it into MB RLG into b3 and your BnB of choice. Also, forgot about 113, another really good footsie string, and you can use it for setups when you get them to the corner.

 

[Student]

The hitbox on d2 is insane. It's good for AA and ground stuff, and if you catch them on the ground, you can cancel it into MB RLG into b3 and your BnB of choice. Also, forgot about 113, another really good footsie string, and you can use it for setups when you get them to the corner.

Great, I'll definitely play around with that string too. With d2 into MB RLG (or far teeth for that matter, as I've seen in some other BnBs), I feel like canceling requires you to input the MB RLG instantly after the d2. I could be wrong, but I've just begun doing acid blossom after catching someone with a grounded d2 because it's so much easier to hit confirm. Do you hit confirm into a RLG or do you just input the RLG (or teeth) regularly after a d2 and hope that the d2 hits?

 

[LOECYPHER]

Hey guys love what you hav done with the joker just wanted to say thanks and contribute a lil tech that I have with him . Insta jump 2 is a instant overhead on every 1 crouching and 11xxRLG is a combo a funny lil thing about it is it snuff some wake ups I've hit doomsday out of well every thing on wake up excerpt his meteor smash and lex out of all waks except super trees some others too but I don't feel like posting when I et the chance I will. Try it out tell me what you think.

P.s. did they fix the hotbox of 21 cuz now it hasn't whiffed on catwoman crouching for me yet but it used to I love the move a lot the mix up potential is fantastic

 

[LOECYPHER]

Sorry about the double post just need to say the the jump is a neutral jump straight up

 

[Qwark28]

Sorry about the double post just need to say the the jump is a neutral jump straight up

we already know about the instant overhead, its useless if you cant combo off of it though, same thing as adon in sf4 but without the combo

 

[LOECYPHER]

But you can get a full combo j2, 11xx mb RLG combo of choice

 

[Qwark28]

But you can get a full combo j2, 11xx mb RLG combo of choice

have you tried it on small hitbox chars?

 

[LOECYPHER]

Yes all chars I've tried it on it works trust me try it out on cat woman then flash and frost you will get the same results it hits them crouching also

 

[Qwark28]

Yes all chars I've tried it on it works trust me try it out on cat woman then flash and frost you will get the same results it hits them crouching also

awesome, any idea on how many frames the overhead is?

 

[LOECYPHER]

Well the only thing that connect are 11 d1 and I think b1 cuz you lose a lot of frames from landing but if you have meter 11 mb RLG combos after for around 40ish dmg with the teeth loop hit some1 with that a couple times and they will be scared to block low and like I said it stop certain wake ups completely