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Which characters and what should be normalized on them?

1man3letters

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
Big Pampering said:
I am discussing this while respecting your opinion, why are you being so defensive? I know the move is really good, please don't put words in my mouth. The change you suggested just doesn't apply to almost everything you just said and that is not a matter of opinion. I just disagree with the change, because you aren't actually providing a reason/justification for the change.
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what is hat currently when you just run into them/on oki that you said it isnt -3 like when a normal is cancled into it?

i already provided a reason, i think -3 is too good for what the move does and at -5 it would still be safe
 
JDM

JDM

Warrior
Reptile: Buff Nimble frame data so non-EX version is usable. Buff Forceballs recovery/startup

Predator: Damage Normalization (I'm sure this is going to happen) Maybe make Scimitar Stab slightly fast to compensate since his wakeups are really bad, if he's sacrificing damage maybe give him some sort of defense.

Quan Chi: No Nerfs/Buffs

Johnny: Fix hurtboxes on certain moves.

Hellfire Scorpion: Fix him, jesus he's terrible now. Overnerfed imo. Change 214's cancel advantage so the run cancel is more around +13-15 instead of +8

Jason: Make 24 (I think this is the string) a mid so it doesn't whiff on crouching characters.

Raiden: B2 is now uncancellable (this isn't truly needed, but I think Raiden is still top 5 easy and in all honesty he shouldn't have a safe 50/50 along with carzy corner carry)

These are all the characters I know well enough to determine what they need in the next patch whether it be nerfs or buffs.
 
Big Pampering

Big Pampering

Master
1man3letters said:
what is hat currently when you just run into them/on oki that you said it isnt -3 like when a normal is cancled into it?

i already provided a reason, i think -3 is too good for what the move does and at -5 it would still be safe
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The hat spin on block while being activated already, doesnt have block advantage and kung lao can move freely when it's already activated, so you just make it so hat spin transitions into your string perfectly otherwise people can armor you.

With reason I meant your are not actually explaining what a -5 hat spin would do instead of a -3 hat spin.
 
KeyserSoze

KeyserSoze

Fabled Villain
I really, really, really, really want to see unstoppable Jason buffed.
I would very much appreciate being able to play my favorite variation in the game, while actually having a chance against decent players.

In general, I want NRS to focus on making some of the useless variations in this game actually competitively viable. I want to see a much larger variety of variations in tournament play than currently exists.
 
DrFolmer

DrFolmer

AKA Uncle Kano
Kano:

Cybernetic need more advantage on the Eye Laser. It's just impossible to execute the combo extender online - the window is incredibly small.
Cutthroat needs b1 to have longer range. I remember practicing with cutthroat and sometimes the jip into b1 would whiff. It is a really important string for this variation.
Commando needs reliable parries. Some high moves are parried with low parry and some low moves are parried with high parry. Also, his standard choke is - on hit, which actually makes parrying advancing wakeupattacks somewhat difficult but you can always just block as a player and punish with a string into choke or something.

I remember someone putting up a video showing a lot of Kano's flaws (I mean seriously, it was bugged), stuff I dont even recall now.

Also, let's do something about fisticuffs, let's give him that SPEEDbag he sacrifices everything for.
 
MadeOfMetal

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
what does everyone think about Female hitbox issues... certain moves can't be punished because of thier small hit box, while it works on every other character?

example: mileena has a roll thas -31 on block but some times on falling down or after you wiff her completely due to hitbox issues.


here is another example..

we all know how subs clone wont catch in corner with her unless you change to F33 instead of B2 which works on the rest of the cast.

what do you think about the female hitbox issue...??????????????????

there are many more examples and im sure you guys know them..

i also would like to see millena closer to the top, she has always been a fav of mine
 
STRYKIE

STRYKIE

Are ya' ready for MK11 kids?!
Out of all the Tanya nerfs so far, I'm still bamboozled as to why Kobu Jutsu's armor breaking armored starter with 2 hits of resistance is -8 on block.... universally unsafe or GTFO.

JDM said:
Reptile: Buff Nimble frame data so non-EX version is usable. Buff Forceballs recovery/startup

Predator: Damage Normalization (I'm sure this is going to happen) Maybe make Scimitar Stab slightly fast to compensate since his wakeups are really bad, if he's sacrificing damage maybe give him some sort of defense.

Quan Chi: No Nerfs/Buffs

Johnny: Fix hurtboxes on certain moves.

Hellfire Scorpion: Fix him, jesus he's terrible now. Overnerfed imo. Change 214's cancel advantage so the run cancel is more around +13-15 instead of +8

Jason: Make 24 (I think this is the string) a mid so it doesn't whiff on crouching characters.

Raiden: B2 is now uncancellable (this isn't truly needed, but I think Raiden is still top 5 easy and in all honesty he shouldn't have a safe 50/50 along with carzy corner carry)

These are all the characters I know well enough to determine what they need in the next patch whether it be nerfs or buffs.
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This is unnecessary IMO. The new metagame is superior in the fact that you can chew up armor and backdash attempts, and get a big chunk of damage out because they most likely won't have access to breaker for a while.

If this is because Dragon's Fire Liu Kang still has them, then let me tell you, there's no way his are staying put either.

However, I do feel Scorpion does have a few problems that people did not previously acknowledge because they were too paranoid about the old blockstring. Not overwhelming problems, but should be brought to NRS' attention. I'll be making a thread soon, I just need a bit more time so I can triple check I have my information straight.
 
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methademic

methademic

UPR Methademic
ESG Jagged said:
mileenas and the rest of the female cast needs to have there hit boxes fixed...

Mileena specific:

most moves git wiffed on her falling, corner wiffs. we all know the sub zero ones, but how about even sonya locking her in corner, trying to combo but every few times wiffs last hit due to hit box, or the fact that you do a njk with anycharacter on her roll, while still very high in air her hit box is low while her hurt box is punishing you.... that roll even though mid is very low profile...

certain Lao combos wiff on her... B321 hatspin, B321 DF1+block, NJP, JIK3,D4,JIK,D4 doesnt always work on her due to that box moving out of range from breath....
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Sub needs his clone back on block at least, do i need to explain that one... sub has always had that clone... and no matter what peps say about it being unfair recall MK1 and MK2...
MK1

MK2
now thats the op days, people on mkx dont even know broken
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Goro needs buffs .

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some times millenas roll is safe on block due to hitbox
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But he didn't get clone until mk3?
 
UsedForGlue

UsedForGlue

"Strength isn't everything"
I can only comment on the characters that I have knowledge of.

Sub Zero Unbreakable MB Aura:
Needs a damage buff, And slight block advantage from Cancels and allow combos to continue on hit when cancelled.
Unbreakable Parry should recover instantly on a projectile parry.
Cryomancer Cold Blooded should give F4 advantage.
Cryomancer Hammer should be safe from B12, F4 and F42. Air Hammer, OH then Low, MB Pop up.
Sub Zero new string in general, 2 hit 0 on block.
MB Iceball should start up faster and stumble back on block.
Basic Sub Zero total overhaul. DLC has made him even more redundant.
Scorpio with a true mid with standing 2.
All Life regeneration moves need buffed, Predator, Mileena, Kang etc.
Reptile Stealth should start and recover as fast as MB version.
Reptile MB Invisibility should combo from 34.
Reptile Acid Spit 8%
Reptile Acid spew with larger puddle area, and quicker start up, also, 20% in total.
Reptile Stealth should stay on block and hit, same with MB version, exactly like predator.
Reptile Forceball start up slightly faster.
Ermac's MB Force Push needs to take more life, and more of the opponents meter.
Ermac's force push safe (Safer?) from full distance.
Ermac spectral should be able to cancel flight and NJP.
Ermac Spectral flight should be generally quicker.
Ermac with general soul ball in all variations, not the combing 3rd soul ball.
Predator damage scaling on MB Slam.
Raiden B11 hitbox fix.
Raiden regular teleport with better recovery.
Raiden MB Teleport, shouldn't be able to hit raiden when he is holding it.
Tempest MB Straight hat should travel slower - Somewhat like a sonic boom
Kung Lao - MB Teleport should track when held.
Hat Trick MB Call back armoured.
Hat Trick back dash speed and length increased without the hat on Lao's head.
Kenshi 32 should be +2 on block and point blank, same with 321 (I believe it's 321?)
 
Scott The Scot

Scott The Scot

Where there is smoke, there is cancer.
Guys, Predators damage is fine-ish! I'd argue he needs more:

->60% for 2 bars
->30% for 1 bar
->15% for 0 bars

:DOGE
 
S

StealthyMuffin

Earth's Mightiest Knucklehead
Nerfs:
-Kobu Jutsu's Rekka
-Kitana's everything on block
-Erron's 21122 guessing game
-Universal decrease in damage (preference)

Buffs:
-Goro
-Jaqcui's midscreen combo potential
-Takeda's meterless combo potential
-Jaqcui's wackboxes
-Takeda's wackboxes
-Takeda's teleport is not in line with other teleports
-Takeda's run cancellable move is not in line with similar moves
-Takeda's combo enders are not in line with other characters
-Takeda's overall frame data/range balance is very bad
-Takeda's air normals are just dookie (that includes his "godlike" 15 frame NJP)
-Takeda's B2 shouldn't move him foward
-Takeda has a gap in his already garbage 112 string
-Takeda's already useless 21 string is -27 on HIT (kill me)
-Takeda's F122+4 is blockable on hit in some situations (this happens maybe once a match, you just might not realize it)
-Takeda's... Just freakin' buff Takeda!
 
MadeOfMetal

MadeOfMetal

Kenshi Srubtastic,Cyrax, Special Forces Mains
Juggs said:
That's the awful SNES version of MK3. And yes the other videos you posted were MUGEN MK.

Also, I hate this thread.
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yeah i was thinking the same thing, mugen, just wasnt sure if it was an emulator or file mod...

you dislike the Super Nintendo, and Sega versions? did you prefer MUGEN emulators over the original consoles?
 
Juggs

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
ESG Jagged said:
yeah i was thinking the same thing, mugen, just wasnt sure if it was an emulator or file mod...

you dislike the Super Nintendo, and Sega versions? did you prefer MUGEN emulators over the original consoles?
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I liked them as a kid when I didn't know any better. The arcade versions are much better and superior in every way. The only console 2D MK I like is MK Trilogy on PS1 and N64.
 
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