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Tournament Viable Characters for 2013

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
Kabal, Sonya, Kung Lao, Kenshi, and Freddy... I would also make the argument that Smoke > Cyrax depending on how consistantly the smoke is landing resets.... Also you have to consider that without meter Cyrax is not scary at all.... I'm pretty sure he has the lowest BnB in the game without meter...

I forget the exact %, but (JIP 21Net + NJP + B2 + 21 + 212Ragdoll + Throw) is at least 40%.

Also: The Command Grab > The Fear Of Resets.
The only thing worse than a 70% reset is being CG'd and chipped out for between 20-30% every time you let Cyrax inside, running the risk of getting Netted and looped right back into it, and giving him enough of a lifelead to not HAVE to use that reset. Then Cyrax is keeping bars to break you off, which means now you've gotta work twice as hard to get momentum going, and Cyrax hasn't spent a bar.

IMO, at this point in Cyrax's lifespan, his Grab, pressure mixups, and panic-inciting possibilities are good enough to make him #3 or #4 over the rest even BEFORE you factor in the exploits...except in some of his losing matches ala Kabal, where max damage is absolutely crucial.
 

EGP Wonder_Chef

Official Quan Chi Nerf Demander™
I forget the exact %, but (JIP 21Net + NJP + B2 + 21 + 212Ragdoll + Throw) is at least 40%.

Also: The Command Grab > The Fear Of Resets.
The only thing worse than a 70% reset is being CG'd and chipped out for between 20-30% every time you let Cyrax inside, running the risk of getting Netted and looped right back into it, and giving him enough of a lifelead to not HAVE to use that reset. Then Cyrax is keeping bars to break you off, which means now you've gotta work twice as hard to get momentum going, and Cyrax hasn't spent a bar.

IMO, at this point in Cyrax's lifespan, his Grab, pressure mixups, and panic-inciting possibilities are good enough to make him #3 or #4 over the rest even BEFORE you factor in the exploits...except in some of his losing matches ala Kabal, where max damage is absolutely crucial.
this post is perfect

also remember that he can get a bomb setup after every meterless combo, even if the damage isn't huge.
 

Fractured_Shadow

Really likes to throw things at you.
it has been discussed and agreed by cyrax players that smoke does not beat him in no way shape or form. cyrax takes the game, chews it up, and vomits brokeness.
I'll leave this debat up to you and Sects (who posted on my account).... But I'm just not seeing that, anybody care to explain?
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
this post is perfect

also remember that he can get a bomb setup after every meterless combo, even if the damage isn't huge.
I honestly don't even reset much anymore. I don't see the point, because it leads to more openings in my experience to incite the fear and force errors with pressure, mindjobbing and frame dysfunction than to just go for the kill and lose the safety Net. There's NOTHING Cyrax can put in his pocket more important than a Breaker. My entire Cyrax game is pretty much like my Cage game: Grab trap, shenanigans, pressure, BnB reset, repeat. If I need to make up a huge lead, THEN someone's getting bombed, but it's a much easier time laying on barbed wire when you're wearing gloves, if you dig my dirt.

(...It's less stressful being inventive with Cyrax pressure knowing I have a Breaker -_-.)
 

trustinme

xbl-OBS trustinme
So does Sonya. The matchups are definitely winnable for her, but most of the characters she struggles with are zoners. Hell, even Sindel can shut Sonya right down if the Sonya player doesn't know their anti-zoning strats.
lol anti zoning strats in mk9,what dash blocking?
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
You oughta write one.
...I think I might.

This is gonna be worse than my Cyrax Matchup Thread, just so you know.

Back on topic: I agree with Quan Chi being a terribly designed character (as jamessmk showed me the hard way at NEC), but I also firmly believe his unorthadox capability with Meter makes it impossible for him NOT to be considered tournament-worthy.
 

LEGEND

YES!
Smoke is only viable against people that don't know the MU or have Shitty fundamentals. You can't run through a whole bracket with only a handful of 6-4 MUs and having losing MUs against almost all of the most popular characters.

Whens the last time a solo smoke main made top 8 at a Major? Never?
 

EGP Wonder_Chef

Official Quan Chi Nerf Demander™
Smoke is only viable against people that don't know the MU or have Shitty fundamentals. You can't run through a whole bracket with only a handful of 6-4 MUs and having losing MUs against almost all of the most popular characters.

Whens the last time a solo smoke main made top 8 at a Major? Never?
That xSmokex guy from Canada has I know, and I feel like Wafflez has, but I can't remember what tournaments those all were at.
 

HD Smoke

Mortal
Smoke is only viable against people that don't know the MU or have Shitty fundamentals. You can't run through a whole bracket with only a handful of 6-4 MUs and having losing MUs against almost all of the most popular characters.

Whens the last time a solo smoke main made top 8 at a Major? Never?
This is the best post ever. THANK YOU. People never take into consideration noone rarely does anything with Smoke and usually when Smoke is on stream at a tourament he is losing. He sits at around 12-15th i dont know when people will see that.

All characters that have done better than Smoke in tourys yet Smoke is somehow better than them or viable with them

Kabal
Kenshi
Cyrax
Sonya
Kung Lao
Cage
Jax
Sub Zero
Sektor
Mileena
Kitana
Liu Kang
Freddy
Shang
........im sure there are more.
 

HD Smoke

Mortal
Smoke is only viable against people that don't know the MU or have Shitty fundamentals. You can't run through a whole bracket with only a handful of 6-4 MUs and having losing MUs against almost all of the most popular characters.

Whens the last time a solo smoke main made top 8 at a Major? Never?
Also almost any character can learn the Smoke MU and realize its not that bad and his tools dont make him viable. Shitty Fundamentals is part of why Smoke can blow people up at times. When you learn to block, punish, and pressure Smoke its nothing special. He cant chip, can only get offense damage off his overhead, you have no worries of him armoring you unless its XRAY and thats hella free so even trying that is just wasting meter. You can get out of d1 SB and d4 SB is so easy to see coming. b2,3 is -8....b2 can get blown up with a jump over (just bait it out) Smoke is so predictable its sad. The best chance Smoke has is grabbing a lot like CDjr used to do with him.....wonder why CDjr won with him in the finals and than dropped him!
 

HD Smoke

Mortal
Wafflez also beat up Chris G 3-0 at Season's Beatings. Tommy can't lose a single game to Chris G without the Smoke MU numbers needing to be changed.

I also like how we're told "just don't jump" when Tommy's biggest tears are how Smoke is free to jk.
It made tommy switch because Tommy knows it is an uncomfortable MU for Smoke....if tommy n chris g played 100 times tommy would say its 6-4 reptile even if he is winning. Rushdown crazy Reptile breaks Smoke and dash gets around bomb so easy. Most Smokes hate playing high level Reptiles.

Dont jump on Smoke, i mean sure there is a point where a JK can beat his standing 2 but why jump? Just slowly get in and get around SB (which is free to do) than pressure and bait him.....Smoke has nothing except pokes and a b2. Theres also never a reason to block low.....pokes dont win the game and one combo can end all the poking progress.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
This is the best post ever. THANK YOU. People never take into consideration noone rarely does anything with Smoke and usually when Smoke is on stream at a tourament he is losing. He sits at around 12-15th i dont know when people will see that.

All characters that have done better than Smoke in tourys yet Smoke is somehow better than them or viable with them

Kabal
Kenshi
Cyrax
Sonya
Kung Lao
Cage
Jax
Sub Zero
Sektor
Mileena
Kitana
Liu Kang
Freddy
Shang
........im sure there are more.
wafflez doesnt travel anymore

xsmokex cant travel when he competes w reo he loses 3-2 and almost wins and gets 2nd

There aren't any smoke players honestly who travel
 

HD Smoke

Mortal
Wait what. Reptile's pressure isn't scary at all. His fastest normal is 11 frames and his pokes don't get him anywhere. Saying that all you can do is poke out is crazy, just 21~sb.
Reptile can punish nearly any SB whether making it whiff or on block....thats pressure that reptile can only get on Smoke because of the way his projectile works. His D4 out ranges and beats Smokes (a tool Smoke uses always) than he gets more pressure. He can bait shake with forceball set ups and he can do all of this while getting in Smokes face fast and pressuring him. Its a certain rushdown reptile only gets on Smoke. Smoke cant use his Smoke away, Smokebomb, Smoke towards, Shake, Invis, and cant try to throw out b2 for spacing all because Reptiles dash blows them up......how is that a even MU??????? If this MU was played more it would be 6-4 Reptile like it will oneday. Smokes gameplan in this MU is to block and punish LMFAO
 

HD Smoke

Mortal
wafflez doesnt travel anymore

xsmokex cant travel when he competes w reo he loses 3-2 and almost wins and gets 2nd

There aren't any smoke players honestly who travel
I know and honestly i didnt mention how good Smoke has done before

Wafflez top 3 at seasons beatings
KT Smith made a good amount of top 8's and 5th at MLG
CDJR won MLG and APEX with Smoke
CDJR took Smoke into top 8 at Final Round and at Winter Brawl 2012
XSMOKEX took 3rd at torukyen

but as far as just Smoke mains and using him all tournament i doubt youll see much....this MU's that he does lose he loses them pretty bad and is limited. As the game evolves Smokes poke set ups, anti airs, and overhead set ups wont evolve. his tools are good but very predictable
 

THTB

Arez | Booya | Riu48 - Rest Easy, Friends
wafflez plays this game all the time and is our best Smoke by far and Chris G with a 2011 Reptile made him switch to cage.....why? because its not a comfortable match up for Smoke.
Wafflez has NEVER been accustomed to fighting Reptile, despite having Han. He is a decent ways ahead of me...even was at MLG Columbus, but he definitely struggled a decent amount.

When it came to playing DetroitBalln's Smoke, though, it was a LOT harder, for sure.

The matchup is in no way Reptile's favor, though. Reptile has to play the entire match using forceballs like once in a blue moon, in any given situation, even on wakeup. He loses a chunk of his game vs Smoke.
 

HD Smoke

Mortal
Wafflez has NEVER been accustomed to fighting Reptile, despite having Han. He is a decent ways ahead of me...even was at MLG Columbus, but he definitely struggled a decent amount.

When it came to playing DetroitBalln's Smoke, though, it was a LOT harder, for sure.

The matchup is in no way Reptile's favor, though. Reptile has to play the entire match using forceballs like once in a blue moon, in any given situation, even on wakeup. He loses a chunk of his game vs Smoke.
Probably because Detroit isnt a Smoke main....Wafflez is the better Smoke but detroit has played countless characters against Reptile. Im not downplaying or complaining but Smoke doesnt go even against Reptile its clear. Reptiles tools beat Smokes and that makes it 6-4...dash is just too effective against Smoke unlike it is against the rest of the cast
 

HD Smoke

Mortal
If Smoke was a better character you would see people randomly use him or pick him up all of a sudden like Kabal, Kenhi, Sonya, Cyrax, Cage, Lao, etc. People arent gonna do that trust me