Tiers are UNIMPORTANT!

[bipolar_shango]

Also I do believe Tier lists DONNOT matter. With the right reads, footsies, counterpokes, and well timed armored moves you can win anymatch because it is player dependant. If you make bad reads and careless errors then you will lose. People believed cage to be bottom 15 now people are considering him top 5. Same with the Jax debate when Jr started winning majors with him.

On a similar note.. I'm calling it for the 1000th time Subzero does not beat Cyber-sub! Remember this post TYM "know it all's". Its a 5-5. ciao

 

[Theme]

I could be wrong, but I think he is saying there are 3-6 very good characters in the game.

Nope, he says it himself

You tier whores and cry babies should be GRATEFUL this game has a clear-cut best character in the game and isn't swarmed with 3-6 extremely good characters fighting for the #1 spot like other games.

It sounds silly as hell when at a high level, someone would actually WANT a clear-cut best character rather than more balanced plateau of characters....

What if you mained Jax and played a bit of Kitana on the side? And you get a Cage. Do you play the Cage with your Jax character you know inside out (even though this is supposed to be a bad MU for Jax) or with you average Kitana because she is supposedly 5:5 on paper, ergo, you should have an easier time and ohh....you got blown up by the Cage because your Kitana fundamentals are nowhere near your Jax level.

I have faced that dilemma many times. You need to level up your character's, not just 1. You cannot be just good with 1 and expect to place that well in a tournament this late into the games lifespan. People will always counter pick, its just part of the game, it isnt cheating. Now if you arent that confident in your bad matchups for your main, switch to your secondary, which -SHOULD- cover your main's bad MU. Thats the purpose of secondaries, but you better be confident in your abilities with your secondary too. If your secondary isnt up to par, then I dont know why you would consider using it.

 

[Juggs]

Really? I actually would prefer the 3-6 characters fighting for that top spot. Wouldnt it be more balanced that way? And more balanced is a better game in general.

It sounds silly as hell when at a high level, someone would actually WANT a clear-cut best character rather than more balanced plateau of characters.....

Bro, REO was trolling. lol

 

[THTB]

Nope, he says it himself


It sounds silly as hell when at a high level, someone would actually WANT a clear-cut best character rather than more balanced plateau of characters....




I have faced that dilemma many times. You need to level up your character's, not just 1. You cannot be just good with 1 and expect to place that well in a tournament this late into the games lifespan. People will always counter pick, its just part of the game, it isnt cheating. Now if you arent that confident in your bad matchups for your main, switch to your secondary, which -SHOULD- cover your main's bad MU. Thats the purpose of secondaries, but you better be confident in your abilities with your secondary too. If your secondary isnt up to par, then I dont know why you would consider using it.

Please tell me you're counertrolling.

 

[Lumpymoomilk]

tiers lol like i care about those, I was playing Jax and Sonya when the game first came out and most people thought they were garbage and now I'm playing Sheeva

 

[Theme]

 

[Treadmill]

tiers lol like i care about those, I was playing Jax and Sonya when the game first came out and most people thought they were garbage and now I'm playing Sheeva

You're so alternative.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2

 

[Lumpymoomilk]

You're so alternative.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2

even though this reeks of sarcasm I enjoy being different so thanks.

 

[Treadmill]

even though this reeks of sarcasm I enjoy being different so thanks.

I enjoy being me, whether its different or not.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2

 

[Shock]

I worked on a player created opinion only hybrid tier list for UMK3, it's on UMK but the forum is closed for the time being, it'll be back eventually. The list wound up being 90% similar to the reworked Chicago-based tier list we made in 2006 for UMK originally based on science, character usage frequency, and tournament outcomes. We then did a match up based tier list that was about 75% similar, which I feel is the most accurate list of all, as I do with any game, we just never had the time and enough knowledgeable players to actually do this.

In the end, tier lists are only there to give players an idea of what they are up against with other characters based on what they use on an even playing skill level. If you're not exactly a good overall player, tiers will only help in the most extreme scenarios, like Rank 1 vs Rank last, and even in that situation, if you are good enough at a game you can beat anyone with the worst character even if they are using the best. But to even consider the tier list factor, the worse player needs to at least have an holistic understanding of the game. I'm not talking about some guy who just plays vs the CPU and never played against a person before, the tier list does not apply there.

I can't say that tier lists DON'T matter, but they exist for a reason.

 

[MashPotatoTower]

Lol the anti match up thread is Just like a mu list

 

[AREZ God of War]

I worked on a player created opinion only hybrid tier list for UMK3, it's on UMK but the forum is closed for the time being, it'll be back eventually. The list wound up being 90% similar to the reworked Chicago-based tier list we made in 2006 for UMK originally based on science, character usage frequency, and tournament outcomes. We then did a match up based tier list that was about 75% similar, which I feel is the most accurate list of all, as I do with any game, we just never had the time and enough knowledgeable players to actually do this.

In the end, tier lists are only there to give players an idea of what they are up against with other characters based on what they use on an even playing skill level. If you're not exactly a good overall player, tiers will only help in the most extreme scenarios, like Rank 1 vs Rank last, and even in that situation, if you are good enough at a game you can beat anyone with the worst character even if they are using the best. But to even consider the tier list factor, the worse player needs to at least have an holistic understanding of the game. I'm not talking about some guy who just plays vs the CPU and never played against a person before, the tier list does not apply there.

I can't say that tier lists DON'T matter, but they exist for a reason.

I personally liked the newer one better...I think it was a little more accurate ftmp, but TBH, I would place a few characters differently on both lists, but then again, I don't think there are ANY characters I play at the highest level possible....I'm just using science and deductive reasoning and MU-experience, so it's 6 of one, half-dozen of the other I guess.

Tier lists aren't nearly as important as MU-charts, IMO.....knowing who counters who is much more useful to a player than "who is better overall". Something you also have to consider is that tier lists don't tell you how to play certain characters against others, most notably those who have game-changing strategies that you really have to customize your tactics and play a totally different game than you are used too. CHaracter A may be #1 based on momentum and brute-force, but take a Sub-Zero player (rank Sub as #9 arbitrarily) where momentum and brute-force does little to nothing.....if you don't have some finesse and patience, you're gonna feel like a Palsy-victim performing Brain-surgery with a pipe-wrench. Contrary to popular belief, Dairy Queen marketing, etc....




ICE CLONES TASTE LIKE SHIT!!!

 

[Juggs]

2 years and 8 months later, and not much has changed. I knew I made a thread like this but didn't realize it was in April of 2012, jeez. Necro bump infraction incoming!

 

[orochiDragon]

@Juggs I don't really think that tier lists are absolutely trash, but I do think they adversely affect the community. You can't deny that a character with better normals, specials, etc is a better character. Or, that most fg's have a few top characters that kinda body many of the lesser ones.

I said that to say, if you use a tier list to learn who you need to lab up against, it's a valuable tool. I main a low tier character and at first I would use it as an excuse, but I stfu and learned my character lol. Now my Ares is beast and I don't think the sups, black Adam, or zod match up are really that bad.

Plus, it might just be me but I know some people but a ton of effort into their tier lists and I just can't discredit hard work.

 

[Eddy Wang]

Ah the good days of Growth here on TYM with MK9, most of the ppl on this thread really matured, i'm feeling nostalgic.

 

[CrimsonShadow]

Whoa, bipolar_shango was here

 

[LiangHuBBB]

ye every fighting game got the same tier list

top tier: characters that pwn me
mid tier: characters I sometimes win and sometimes lose to
garbage tier: characters I always pwn easily <3

 

[Kakashi]

I don't care about the tier list, but if I have learned something about fighting games of this generation is that you must have a secondary character for tough fights.
(Lex vs Zod, Kenshi vs Sheeva)

 

[Cossner]

Lol AREZ god of war remember that guy? What a tool

 

[Konqrr]

Tier lists do not matter. Yup, I said it. Most people already know this, but lately there's been way too much stock put into tiers. What is this infatuation with tiers in the fighting game community? It isn't just us, however, in other communities it seems the top players don't care as much as our top players. Of course knowing match-ups is important, but don't you think people know it's a 7-3, or a 6-4 match-up? Even if they don't know that it's exactly 7-3, they probably know it's either a good match-up for the 7 character, and a bad match-up for the 3 character. Without knowing the numbers. Not to mention people saying it's 7-3 is subjective anyway. Doesn't matter how many top players agree, you can't objectively say it's 7-3 unless you play like 100 ft10's with players of exact equal skill.

Tiers are only important to newer players so they can learn who's good and who'd good against who before actually having much experience with the game. For the experienced player, what exactly does a tier list accomplish? Honestly, it causes more harm and headache than positivity. Sure the discussions are healthy, but you don't need a tier list thread to have healthy discussions about the game. And in those thread, it's not all healthy discussions. A lot of it is opinions on match-ups and it's completely arbitrary.

I just find it annoying all these threads that get made talking about tiers. What does it matter? I'm being serious when I ask this, it's not a rhetorical question. I think this community is putting too much time and effort into tiers and match-up lists. And they give you an easy cop out 100% of the time. If you lose a 3-7 or even a 4-6, you can just say it's a bad match-up. That makes it so easy to shift the blame from yourself, and never really improve. But even worse, when you lose a good match-up for your character, you get blown up for it. That will happen regardless, but it really derives from the amount of emphasis everyone puts on tier lists.

I hope everyone just starts playing the game. Stop worrying so much about tiers. The player is all that matters. Anyone can win at anytime. If you delude yourself into thinking the match is easy because it's a good match-up for your character, that's when you make mistakes and underestimate your opponent.

/end rant

Tell that to Jade vs Kenshi in MK9

 

[THTB]

Tier lists aren't the big thing. MATCHUP CHARTS, however, are a different story.

 

[xenogorgeous]

tier lists have a certain room in overall discussions envolving match-ups ..... there is no doubt about that

 

[Juggs]

You don't need tier lists or MU numbers/charts to discuss match-ups. A bad match is a bad match, a good match is a good match, an even match is an even one. Sure there's a difference between a 4-6 MU and a 2-8 MU, but they both are still bad MU's. What does labeling it a 2-8 over a 4-6 actually accomplish other than in regards to a tier list?

 

[IMakeItL00kC00L]

Ur face is unimportant

 

[Juggs]

Ur face is unimportant