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Tiers are UNIMPORTANT!

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Premium Supporter
Tier lists do not matter. Yup, I said it. Most people already know this, but lately there's been way too much stock put into tiers. What is this infatuation with tiers in the fighting game community? It isn't just us, however, in other communities it seems the top players don't care as much as our top players. Of course knowing match-ups is important, but don't you think people know it's a 7-3, or a 6-4 match-up? Even if they don't know that it's exactly 7-3, they probably know it's either a good match-up for the 7 character, and a bad match-up for the 3 character. Without knowing the numbers. Not to mention people saying it's 7-3 is subjective anyway. Doesn't matter how many top players agree, you can't objectively say it's 7-3 unless you play like 100 ft10's with players of exact equal skill.

Tiers are only important to newer players so they can learn who's good and who'd good against who before actually having much experience with the game. For the experienced player, what exactly does a tier list accomplish? Honestly, it causes more harm and headache than positivity. Sure the discussions are healthy, but you don't need a tier list thread to have healthy discussions about the game. And in those thread, it's not all healthy discussions. A lot of it is opinions on match-ups and it's completely arbitrary.

I just find it annoying all these threads that get made talking about tiers. What does it matter? I'm being serious when I ask this, it's not a rhetorical question. I think this community is putting too much time and effort into tiers and match-up lists. And they give you an easy cop out 100% of the time. If you lose a 3-7 or even a 4-6, you can just say it's a bad match-up. That makes it so easy to shift the blame from yourself, and never really improve. But even worse, when you lose a good match-up for your character, you get blown up for it. That will happen regardless, but it really derives from the amount of emphasis everyone puts on tier lists.

I hope everyone just starts playing the game. Stop worrying so much about tiers. The player is all that matters. Anyone can win at anytime. If you delude yourself into thinking the match is easy because it's a good match-up for your character, that's when you make mistakes and underestimate your opponent.

/end rant
 

REO

Undead
Well-said.

But for all the people who do care about tiers, go main Kabal. It's that easy. Otherwise, shut the fuck up and do not ever complain about tier list if you don't have the guts to go and pick up the most obvious and best character in the game.

You tier whores and cry babies should be GRATEFUL this game has a clear-cut best character in the game and isn't swarmed with 3-6 extremely good characters fighting for the #1 spot like other games.
 

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
Well-said.

But for all the people who do care about tiers, go main Kabal. It's that easy. Otherwise, shut the fuck up and do not ever complain about tier list if you don't have the guts to go and pick up the most obvious and best character in the game.

You tier whores and cry babies should be GRATEFUL this game has a clear-cut best character in the game and isn't swarmed with 3-6 extremely good characters fighting for the #1 spot like other games.
Kinda have to agree with this.

From a purely fundamental "Look what I can do" standpoint, it's kind of hard to put anyone else at number 1.
 

1man3letters

Alpha Tarkatan - Moderator
Moderator
will i agree people care a bit to much about "tiers",play the char you want to play

i dont agree people care to much about matchup numbers,
fighting games are in a way about collecting data..safe/unsafe,combos,setups,damage%,frame data etc etc
matchup numbers are just another bit of data to be there for the collecting (if they are accurate and worth collecting that is :rolleyes: )

they dont mean to much,but they are still valid for those who want to learn more, it does the game good to have people talking why this match is this number and that this, it gets people to talk about there findings of the game rather than to just think them, the number process is it like the basic good match/bad match way of thinking you talked about but seriously what state would the matchup chart discussion thread be if just had the words good and bad in it,thats all...im not to sure

so im thinking while people should talk and care about the numbers they shouldnt care were those numbers puts there char in the list,know that sounds odd :confused:
 

SunnyD

24 Low Hat!
Its too easy to make excuses with Tier lists. I always hate it when people complain about getting beat by counter picks. I once had a CSZ player rage mail me multiple times cause i beat him with Sub Zero. I guess he was more than casual cause he kept complaining about it being a 7-3 match-up. You know what? I beat you. Shut the fuck up.
 
I don't think tier lists are unimportant or invalid yet, but they are certainly heading in that direction. Most of the fighting games resealed somewhat recently have had rather compressed tier lists. I think if this trend keeps up, tier lists will be nearly impossible to make and become useless as more games start to have larger and larger percentages of their cast be viable.
 
I think some people are missing the point. I for one, have never cared or concerned myself with "tier list" BUT, it can be helpful for the "inexperienced players". It's capable of providing some basic ground work information for what a newcomer can expect from his/her chosen character.
 

Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Premium Supporter
Well-said.

But for all the people who do care about tiers, go main Kabal. It's that easy. Otherwise, shut the fuck up and do not ever complain about tier list if you don't have the guts to go and pick up the most obvious and best character in the game.

You tier whores and cry babies should be GRATEFUL this game has a clear-cut best character in the game and isn't swarmed with 3-6 extremely good characters fighting for the #1 spot like other games.
vVvTroll
 

CURBOLICOUS

Cage ban wagon?
Also I do believe Tier lists DONNOT matter. With the right reads, footsies, counterpokes, and well timed armored moves you can win anymatch because it is player dependant. If you make bad reads and careless errors then you will lose. People believed cage to be bottom 15 now people are considering him top 5. Same with the Jax debate when Jr started winning majors with him.
 

Ninj

Where art thou, MKX Skarlet?
Well-said.

But for all the people who do care about tiers, go main Kabal. It's that easy. Otherwise, shut the fuck up and do not ever complain about tier list if you don't have the guts to go and pick up the most obvious and best character in the game.

You tier whores and cry babies should be GRATEFUL this game has a clear-cut best character in the game and isn't swarmed with 3-6 extremely good characters fighting for the #1 spot like other games.
Weird, I was thinking the same about skarlet

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Juggs

Lose without excuses
Lead Moderator
Premium Supporter
Also I do believe Tier lists DONNOT matter. With the right reads, footsies, counterpokes, and well timed armored moves you can win anymatch because it is player dependant. If you make bad reads and careless errors then you will lose. People believed cage to be bottom 15 now people are considering him top 5. Same with the Jax debate when Jr started winning majors with him.
I agree with this. Match-up charts just tell you what can happen based on the tools available before the match. It takes ZERO into account as far as the player is concerned OR the circumstances.
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
I'll run over any reptile offline. Don't you dare say that. People considered that Kitana vs cage being 6.5-3.5 kitanas favor. Now its considered a 5-5. I hate when people say reptile beats cage when in reality he can get fucked by cage.
8-2 reptile bro
 
I'll run over any reptile offline. Don't you dare say that. People considered that Kitana vs cage being 6.5-3.5 kitanas favor. Now its considered a 5-5. I hate when people say reptile beats cage when in reality he can get fucked by cage.
I can't lie about this matchup, denzell runs through my reptile on the regular lol. Once cage gets in, all reptile got is an ex dash and armor slide, both of which can be punished.