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The most recent Shang Tsung match up chart

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eskuAdradit0

"Thanks" button abuser.
If we're not giving .5s for matchups, then I'd say this is a mu chart we all can agree on.

If we were to use .5s, I'd like a little more info on the following matchups.
Jade (slightly in shang's favor as she doesn't take the damage she could)
Jax, JC (slightly in JC's favor? Jax? what can you say about him? specially after fighting CD Jr's)
Kabal (specially the zoning here.)
Kitana (slightly in kitana's favor?)
Raiden (slightly in raiden's favor?)
 
D

DetroitBalln

tupac aint dead
eskuAdradit0 said:
If we're not giving .5s for matchups, then I'd say this is a mu chart we all can agree on.

If we were to use .5s, I'd like a little more info on the following matchups.
Jade (slightly in shang's favor as she doesn't take the damage she could)
Jax, JC (slightly in JC's favor? Jax? what can you say about him? specially after fighting CD Jr's)
Kabal (specially the zoning here.)
Kitana (slightly in kitana's favor?)
Raiden (slightly in raiden's favor?)
Click to expand...
I don't believe in .5's in match up charts. Either it's a 6/4 or a 5/5.
 
Khaotic_xShangx

Khaotic_xShangx

Fear the Skulls
Please explain the Ermac MU because it seems if ermac stays at 3/4 to 1/2 screen shang cant do crap but eat a force push that he cant punish from that distance.
 
OZZYGUITAR

OZZYGUITAR

Back-dash Adam
DetroitBalln said:
I think the match against Sektor is slightly in Shangs favor because Shang can easily out zone him. Ground skulls catch him out of his iTU.
IKizzLE - What do you think about this match up?

He goes even with Cage because Shang can keep him out, but it's a pain once Cage gets in. Cage really has no answer to Shang Tsung's corner game. EX nut punch is extremely easy to bait.

The match up against Cyrax is extremely difficult because Shang has absolutely NO answer to anything Cyrax does.
You can't zone him AT ALL.
- All of Shang Tsung's combos rely on meter.
- One net from Cyrax = 50%+.
- Shang Tsung needs to break, and he needs meter for his combos.
Click to expand...
not to mention ex net can drain you of your meter
 
Metzos

Metzos

You will BOW to me!
DetroitBalln, I dont know, i dont think Ermac vs ST being an even MU man. Seeing you play both Ermac and ST, i would really like to hear your opinion on this MU. I ve never had any problem dealing with Shang players tbh, but ofc we have never played against each other. Midscreen Shang cant do anything vs Ermac's zoning, except EX SS, and that is not worth it imo cause you need your meter for damage or breaker. Even on reaction all of Shang's special moves are beaten by Ermac's TKP. Up close Ermac can deal against Shang with his fast low pokes. Only problem i see here is Shang's ground skulls, but as i said TKP on reaction can win against all of Shang's specials. Also Shang's wake up game is really weak, which means he is succeptable to cross ups which allow Ermac to get his pressure and spacing going. Even if you do a successful SS max range TKP can be punished by Ermac which means you cannot "spam" it like other specials. Ofc that goes the same for me also. I have to be careful, but still it doesnt give you the advantage. I can agree the MU being an even though.


Post edited.
 
Lt. Boxy Angelman

Lt. Boxy Angelman

I WILL EAT THIS GAME
Cyrax + 3/7 = I'd put it at 4-6, but I could agree with this.
Cyrax has way too many no-meter-necessary tools compared to Shang's. Command Grab, ghetto resets, blocked 1/2 into Throw shenanigans, safe Buzzsaw, the works...
And given that meter conservation is key against said Cyrax, that takes a leg out from under the sorcerer as a great deal of his big damage comes from EX Skull bombardment, while any damage Cyrax manages to eat along the way is just gonna build him a bigger bar with which to destroy him, which IMO is the only downside to Shang's unbreakable damage tricks - if your Cyrax opponent isn't planning on spending a Breaker, then he's probably planning to use that bar for an EX Net to keep you trapped, an EX Ragdoll to interrupt pressure, or maybe even a surprise EX Teleport to disorient you whilst in mid-attack just to get under your skin.
Mindgames, mindgames, mindgames. And that's what changes/unevens the fight.
Two characters who specialize in psychological warfare. But the robot does it better.
 
Phosferrax

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
DetroitBalln said:
The match up against Cyrax is extremely difficult because Shang has absolutely NO answer to anything Cyrax does.
You can't zone him AT ALL.
- All of Shang Tsung's combos rely on meter.
- One net from Cyrax = 50%+.
- Shang Tsung needs to break, and he needs meter for his combos.
Click to expand...
Shang can't zone him? What? You can just stand there and GS as soon as he throws anything at you so his bomb pressure mid-screen is nullified. If he's trying to his AA grab to get in you can just soul steal him.

The only thing cyrax has to get out of GS pressure with is his d1 which is only +1, he can't even d3 for respectable frame advantage on hit. Cyrax basically has to come to Shang, and Shang beats him upclose as well. The only thing is that Cyrax has is better footsies and damage.

I haven't played the MU enough to claim that it is in Shang's favour, but if it is in Cyrax's favour it certainly isn't a 7-3 MU.
 
Phosferrax

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
Metzos said:
DetroitBalln, Midscreen Shang cant do anything vs Ermac's zoning.
Click to expand...
It's true that at midscreen Shang can't punish ermac's TKP, but ermac can't just keep doing that. After a blocked TPK at any range ermac must block any of shang's specials which allow's Shang frame advantage once that option is respected. I won't argue though that ermac does out-zone Shang, just that is isn't so simple for ermac at midscreen.

Up close, I do think that Shang has the advantage; all ermac has to escape GS pressure with is d1 that only leaves him at +1 and a d3 that leaves him at -2 (iafb is too slow once shang is at advantage) meaning shang doesn't have to respect ermac up close once he is in.

Ermac still has advantage at full-screen and mid-screen however.
 
Metzos

Metzos

You will BOW to me!
Phosferrax said:
It's true that at midscreen Shang can't punish ermac's TKP, but ermac can't just keep doing that. After a blocked TPK at any range ermac must block any of shang's specials which allow's Shang frame advantage once that option is respected. I won't argue though that ermac does out-zone Shang, just that is isn't so simple for ermac at midscreen.

Up close, I do think that Shang has the advantage; all ermac has to escape GS pressure with is d1 that only leaves him at +1 and a d3 that leaves him at -2 (iafb is too slow once shang is at advantage) meaning shang doesn't have to respect ermac up close once he is in.

Ermac still has advantage at full-screen and mid-screen however.
Click to expand...
Up close Ermac can still compete though and thats my point. Its not that he is completely helpless. Also if Ermac hits ST once he is crouching with d3 he is at +5f if i remember correctly. And Ermac's d3 is at 7f. ST's F4 has a 10f startup and after a blocked GS comes out at 8f which is still slower than Ermac's d3 though. Even if i m at a disadvantage after a hit confirmed d1 or d3 (if i hit my opponent while standing), this enables me to cut off his pressure and backdash. That was my point. About the TKP arguement, dont forget that TKP on block has a small pushback also. Thats all i can think of atm.
 
Khaotic_xShangx

Khaotic_xShangx

Fear the Skulls
Phosferrax said:
Shang can't zone him? What? You can just stand there and GS as soon as he throws anything at you so his bomb pressure mid-screen is nullified. If he's trying to his AA grab to get in you can just soul steal him.

The only thing cyrax has to get out of GS pressure with is his d1 which is only +1, he can't even d3 for respectable frame advantage on hit. Cyrax basically has to come to Shang, and Shang beats him upclose as well. The only thing is that Cyrax has is better footsies and damage.

I haven't played the MU enough to claim that it is in Shang's favour, but if it is in Cyrax's favour it certainly isn't a 7-3 MU.
Click to expand...
most cyrax players abuse the net than using bombs at any point on the screen. gs for net trades are not fun. i get 8% and he gets a possible 75% with one bar. Now do you see why cyrax can zone shang and not the other way around.
 
Phosferrax

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
Khaotic_xShangx said:
most cyrax players abuse the net than using bombs at any point on the screen. gs for net trades are not fun. i get 8% and he gets a possible 75% with one bar. Now do you see why cyrax can zone shang and not the other way around.
Click to expand...
The point is that you wait for him to throw something a full screen, not just spam fireballs at him. If you're clever about your zoning then Shang doesn't have to worry about the net until cyrax gets mid-screen. Keeping him at full screen means you easily outzone him.
 
Khaotic_xShangx

Khaotic_xShangx

Fear the Skulls
Phosferrax said:
The point is that you wait for him to throw something a full screen, not just spam fireballs at him. If you're clever about your zoning then Shang doesn't have to worry about the net until cyrax gets mid-screen. Keeping him at full screen means you easily outzone him.
Click to expand...
dont you think the cyrax player will know this at a high level so they will always stay at midscreen and never try to zone fullscreen. think about what you are saying cause no high level person in there right mind will play like that with cyrax. Or explain how you are going to keep him at full screen cause i would like to know this theory fight.
 
Phosferrax

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
Khaotic_xShangx said:
dont you think the cyrax player will know this at a high level so they will always stay at midscreen and never try to zone fullscreen. think about what you are saying cause no high level person in there right mind will play like that with cyrax. Or explain how you are going to keep him at full screen cause i would like to know this theory fight.
Click to expand...
Maxter does this all the time; he just sits full screen throwing bombs and nets. Shang wins from full screen because as soon as you see cyrax's chest open you GS and once he respects that you can go for an US. You win this trade simply because you do chip damage and cyrax doesn't. Once Cyrax realises he can't play the zoning game he is forced to come up close.

When he comes to mid-screen can watch him to see if it's a net or a bomb. The point is that you can react to cyrax's projectiles from mid-screen as well, and if he throws a bomb you can punish or at least keep him pushed back with SS. Because he has to block Shang's projectiles he can't just stand there and throw shit at you.
 
Khaotic_xShangx

Khaotic_xShangx

Fear the Skulls
Phosferrax said:
Maxter does this all the time; he just sits full screen throwing bombs and nets. Shang wins from full screen because as soon as you see cyrax's chest open you GS and once he respects that you can go for an US. You win this trade simply because you do chip damage and cyrax doesn't. Once Cyrax realises he can't play the zoning game he is forced to come up close.

When he comes to mid-screen can watch him to see if it's a net or a bomb. The point is that you can react to cyrax's projectiles from mid-screen as well, and if he throws a bomb you can punish or at least keep him pushed back with SS. Because he has to block Shang's projectiles he can't just stand there and throw shit at you.
Click to expand...
watch egp krayzie's cyrax then come back and say the same thing. Just asking was maxter fighting a shang player when he was doing this stuff you are talking bout or another character cause you play certain ways you play different character matchups
 
Phosferrax

Phosferrax

Original Liu Kang cop.
Khaotic_xShangx said:
watch egp krayzie's cyrax then come back and say the same thing. Just asking was maxter fighting a shang player when he was doing this stuff you are talking bout or another character cause you play certain ways you play different character matchups
Click to expand...
Are you even thinking about anything I've just said? Krayzie plays cyrax upclose, Shang beats Cyrax at that range. At jump distance he throws nets, they don't do chip so you have nothing to be scared about. You can even make Cyrax respect GS after a blocked net at that distance.
 
HGTV DrFlash44

HGTV DrFlash44

Quan Cheese!!!
You have 5-5 quan, which is what I thought but I have been told by numerous people that quan chi looses to shang tsung. Can someone explain this to me.
 
Khaotic_xShangx

Khaotic_xShangx

Fear the Skulls
Phosferrax said:
Are you even thinking about anything I've just said? Krayzie plays cyrax upclose, Shang beats Cyrax at that range. At jump distance he throws nets, they don't do chip so you have nothing to be scared about. You can even make Cyrax respect GS after a blocked net at that distance.
Click to expand...
ive read everything you have said and have played this match up too. just show some footage of you using this tactic and being effective with it by keeping cyrax full screen and we as a community will believe you but as others have written this is either 7-3 or 6-4 cyrax.
 
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