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The Blind Swordsman - The Kenshi Discussion Thread

xxteefxx

Kenshi Moderator
Didn't know where else to put this, but has anyone else tried to stuff an opponents string with EX RK, only to have you remain blocking but still lose a meter? Is there something wrong with my execution? Or is it just a bug?
Good thing u mentioned this! me and others (Cd brothers and check) were going to make a show and talk about technicality...THIS!! in specific to kenshi, i was going to talk about!

Kenshi has 3 Main Problems that will ALWAYS STOP HIM FROM HITTING NUmber Ono in tournaments....i am Serious! a simple laggy TV will halt him down! a simple online Connection, Might halt him down! a simple bug and will halt him down

-The option select Bug:
This isnt a bug exactly to be honest. but basically, any opponent if they have fast pokes or moves, basically every and most special move has un active frame start up at a time...meaning u can hit them Nulling their move from coming out. If done on a regular special move, it will be stuffed. If done on an EX move with no armor, It can be stuffed or this Bug will Happen!
now the thing is, armor move....that should not happen :S from what i understand, armor should be active from start up? that's the only logic due to testing....though! it's treating as any other special move. by means they are stoppable.

THIS!! halts kenshi in a lot of STUFF! kenshi doesnt have fast pokes unlike others: for example, If sonya did cr+1 and standing 1 traps and u tried to do EX RK, SOMETIMES (actually like 60% of the time), the RK wont come out, instead u will be blocking and the move will be WHIFFED!
another example, jax's f+4,1,2 (though sometimes jax will get the bug of + frames). another example, Kitana's 2,1,2......and so forth

Pure nonsense......i lost a LOT of matches, tournament and casuals because of this....and simply people dont care :S

you can use such a thing for ur advantage as well, like an option select....BUT HEY!! when it happens when u dont want it, that's not cool! haha

-Projectile bug still exists! on wake up as well as on Projectile cancel spam (Reference, kabal)

-Collision bug (Will explain in details about it soon!)

--ohh and ofcourse, the pressure he can easily get. to counter this , either a good timing RK, a good timing distance stadning 1, and for cross over (dashing under or reverse RK...and this is where the collision bug happens sometimes)...anything else, the know the matchup inside out.
 

Tolkeen

/wrists
I've noticed for a lot of characters :fp is labeled as a good anti-air for jump-ins that aren't crossovers. I've been trying this a lot recently, but I can only really practice online, so its properties are unclear. Will :fp beat out jip and jik, every time, or is it only useful against people who do deep jip's and jik's?

And what about :d :fp? Is that only useful on crossovers? And I've heard that Kenshi is a high hitbox character, so will I get jip on crossover even if I :d :fp?

Thanks in advanced for the help!
 

xxteefxx

Kenshi Moderator
I've noticed for a lot of characters :fp is labeled as a good anti-air for jump-ins that aren't crossovers. I've been trying this a lot recently, but I can only really practice online, so its properties are unclear. Will :fp beat out jip and jik, every time, or is it only useful against people who do deep jip's and jik's?

And what about :d :fp? Is that only useful on crossovers? And I've heard that Kenshi is a high hitbox character, so will I get jip on crossover even if I :d :fp?

Thanks in advanced for the help!
srry for the long time to reply. i am WAAY busy tryin to graduate man haha

alright, here's the deal. I main both Reptile and Kenshi, Sadly non of them has A solid standing 1 or cr+1 anti air/ anti cross . compared to someone like noob, jax, Sonya.....etc they are really easily stuffable with Jump ins and not fast at all

standing 2 is 12 frames
standing 1 is 10 frames


i use it a lot recently, though this is a VERY matchup and mind game dependable. by means, useful more for as prediction than on reaction unlike other chars

cr+1 is REALLY not good due to kenshi's hitbox...such a waste that his cr+1 is somehow fast, but the hitbox just killed it. ur best bit against cross ups are those option

-Maneuvering with dashes, or 1 step back dash
-EX RK (reverse the driection as they land) / or EX SC reverse as well/ or /and sometimes SC on high cross overs
-Standing 1 on prediction (not anti JIK)
 

Tolkeen

/wrists
can anyone confirm this?
I tried it but it wont work.
I do it all the time in versus and ladder mode. You have to completely select a non-dlc character. So let's say, scorpion or sub-zero. Press start twice (to account for having any alternate costumes), then press back(3, x, or b depending on your preference), then select Kenshi (or any other dlc character) with the start button.

If you do this online, you have to do it quickly, otherwise your opponent will select their character, and then you're stuck with scorpion :(
 

Tolkeen

/wrists
Hey guys, had a quick question, but didn't want to start a new thread. I've been toying around with :r:bp :bp :l:bp into :d:fp (possible into RK) And I was wondering if the :d:fp would come out fast enough to stuff reptiles dash, since normally his dash beats out the SC frame trap?

I checked Teef's info/video thread and couldn't find anything about it, so if anyone has any experience with this string, or any knowledge of it's usefulness (either in the reptile match-up, or in any match-up at all), that would be greatly appreciated, thanks.
 

myth

Noob
Shouldn't Strykers X-Ray not work on Kenshi because the flash light wouldnt blind Kenshi?

Hes already blind I mean, what are we to believe, that this is some sort of a... (sniggering) magic flashlight or something? Boy, I really hope somebody got fired for that blunder.
 

Tolkeen

/wrists
What are Kenshi's best blockstrings and blockstring set-ups?
You can find all the best Kenshi information in Vilen's "Kenshi Living Guide" thread, and Teef's "Kenshi Tutorial/Guide:project Learning Lab" Thread (Which contains very informative video's by Under the Mayo.
 

xxteefxx

Kenshi Moderator
will ty tolkeen :)

I want to up date the guide cause REALLY! kenshi simply is way more better with a LOT of tools. just i want to wait after REV X and i guess i will release them to the public.

i dont mean to be rude, but to correct u on something , rofl...the videos , one of them is completely mine (the first one on top). the second is Underthemayo's with colaboration with Project learning lab (by means, some of my help....mostly all his ). so one video mine and one video his ROFL


Be prepared for an update soon as well as another video for kenshi...i have it recorded and done already but...waiting for the perfect time to release it
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
will ty tolkeen :)

I want to up date the guide cause REALLY! kenshi simply is way more better with a LOT of tools. just i want to wait after REV X and i guess i will release them to the public.

i dont mean to be rude, but to correct u on something , rofl...the videos , one of them is completely mine (the first one on top). the second is Underthemayo's with colaboration with Project learning lab (by means, some of my help....mostly all his ). so one video mine and one video his ROFL


Be prepared for an update soon as well as another video for kenshi...i have it recorded and done already but...waiting for the perfect time to release it
hold it till FR

.....please :)
 

xxteefxx

Kenshi Moderator
haha okay....i think your happy huh? ^_^
and for sure, sounds good ....you bettaah give me credit boooyh! haha....keedin :p
 

Tolkeen

/wrists
haha okay....i think your happy huh? ^_^
and for sure, sounds good ....you bettaah give me credit boooyh! haha....keedin :p
Okay, sorry about that. Will remember next time... also, feel free to share whatever secrets you have with me too... I'll write you a sign that says win courtesy of Teef!! if you do!
 

xxteefxx

Kenshi Moderator
Okay, sorry about that. Will remember next time... also, feel free to share whatever secrets you have with me too... I'll write you a sign that says win courtesy of Teef!! if you do!
ohh tolkeen u mis understood...that wasnt toward you man...lol that was toward the reply from piggy to me :)
haha it's something between us (me and him)
 

LEGEND

YES!
Premium Supporter
just want to see if any good kenshi players have any input on a few things i've been toying with

1) D4-Ex Rising Karma. pushes opponent back, deals chip and can catch them off guard (hit confirm RK with spirit charge)

2) 21B2-Rising Karma. I have not had anyone punish me yet, besides things like raiden's superman and reptiles dash. is it generally safe vs most characters?

3) F22B1, F22B1, D1 rising karma, F32 spirit charge 36%. most practical high damage punish?

4) for spacing i try and keep my opponent outside Spirit charge's range, keep them guessing with the B2/F3 mix up and throw out an occasional overhead spirit slash thing (close one). This keeps them reluctant to get in past half screen which opens up more safe options for kenshi to deal damage. Plus, i've found that standing 1 works nicely as an AA starter so using an unsafe Rising Karma isn't really necessary any more, still good against Jump-in-kicks though

5) i'm starting to think a run away Kenshi does work that well, he is very bad in the corner ime. His footsies mix ups and defense is what makes him strong, i see no reason to run away/Sit on life lead

6) Ex Reflect is a matchup specific move and should be use situationally, i'd rather keep the pressure on and have the breaker option, but once again, Situational
 

Tolkeen

/wrists
just want to see if any good kenshi players have any input on a few things i've been toying with

1) D4-Ex Rising Karma. pushes opponent back, deals chip and can catch them off guard (hit confirm RK with spirit charge)

2) 21B2-Rising Karma. I have not had anyone punish me yet, besides things like raiden's superman and reptiles dash. is it generally safe vs most characters?

3) F22B1, F22B1, D1 rising karma, F32 spirit charge 36%. most practical high damage punish?

4) for spacing i try and keep my opponent outside Spirit charge's range, keep them guessing with the B2/F3 mix up and throw out an occasional overhead spirit slash thing (close one). This keeps them reluctant to get in past half screen which opens up more safe options for kenshi to deal damage. Plus, i've found that standing 1 works nicely as an AA starter so using an unsafe Rising Karma isn't really necessary any more, still good against Jump-in-kicks though

5) i'm starting to think a run away Kenshi does work that well, he is very bad in the corner ime. His footsies mix ups and defense is what makes him strong, i see no reason to run away/Sit on life lead

6) Ex Reflect is a matchup specific move and should be use situationally, i'd rather keep the pressure on and have the breaker option, but once again, Situational
1) I think that's mentioned in teef's guide, if not, he should add it as that is a pretty good way to get some space. Although another option mentioned is d4-f22b2, this gives you the option to get chip, and gives your opponent a guessing game of either more pressure or sc, or step back to give yourself some room.

2) Covered in the guide, relatively safe against most of the cast HOWEVER, there are people who may be able to punish it pretty hard since we don't have exact recovery/block frame data on it (as far as I know), exrk at the end is safer.

3) The guide lists f22b1, f32>rk, f32 sc as the go to punish, It's either the same percentage or a percentage more and is much easier timing wise.

4) standing 1 is an AA tool that I think should be more utilized with kenshi players, I feel the majority of us are too reliant on rk and sc against jump ins.

5) Kenshi is just as bad as anyone else in the corner, just remember to use exsc for crossovers instead of ex RK because the corners love to glitch inputs.

6) No one will argue that EXreflect is not situational, however, It can also play as a mind game trick against certain characters. Nothing says "I don't care you have the life lead" like exreflecting a zoners projectile. Reflect in general has the capability to intimidate some players, just make sure to keep your eyes open for other events, like teleports.
 

LEGEND

YES!
Premium Supporter
1) I think that's mentioned in teef's guide, if not, he should add it as that is a pretty good way to get some space. Although another option mentioned is d4-f22b2, this gives you the option to get chip, and gives your opponent a guessing game of either more pressure or sc, or step back to give yourself some room.

2) Covered in the guide, relatively safe against most of the cast HOWEVER, there are people who may be able to punish it pretty hard since we don't have exact recovery/block frame data on it (as far as I know), exrk at the end is safer.

3) The guide lists f22b1, f32>rk, f32 sc as the go to punish, It's either the same percentage or a percentage more and is much easier timing wise.

4) standing 1 is an AA tool that I think should be more utilized with kenshi players, I feel the majority of us are too reliant on rk and sc against jump ins.

5) Kenshi is just as bad as anyone else in the corner, just remember to use exsc for crossovers instead of ex RK because the corners love to glitch inputs.

6) No one will argue that EXreflect is not situational, however, It can also play as a mind game trick against certain characters. Nothing says "I don't care you have the life lead" like exreflecting a zoners projectile. Reflect in general has the capability to intimidate some players, just make sure to keep your eyes open for other events, like teleports.
thanks for the info,

few things:
f22b1, f32>rk, f32 sc is 35% and much easier to do then my combo. However, The more i practice it the less likely i am to drop mine. . . I think i'm going to stick with the 36% for now

#5 was more a question about how best to play Kenshi with my input thrown in, are you saying i should play the life lead and not care about the corner?

#2, i'd rather not spend the meter, i use that string to build meter and create spacing. i guess i'll keep using it until i get blown up or we have solid frame data on it

Thanks again,
 

Tolkeen

/wrists
thanks for the info,

few things:
f22b1, f32>rk, f32 sc is 35% and much easier to do then my combo. However, The more i practice it the less likely i am to drop mine. . . I think i'm going to stick with the 36% for now

#5 was more a question about how best to play Kenshi with my input thrown in, are you saying i should play the life lead and not care about the corner?

#2, i'd rather not spend the meter, i use that string to build meter and create spacing. i guess i'll keep using it until i get blown up or we have solid frame data on it

Thanks again,
If you're consistent with the 36%, then by all means continue to use it, I play online a lot (unfortunately) and thus must stick to the more lenient combos.

I don't think that there is an easy way to describe how to play Kenshi to his fullest, I believe that his close game is underutilized because his zoning is so strong. I personally don't agree with ever putting yourself in the corner, but you can play a slow keep away game to bait your opponent to jump or be caught off guard by your f2 strings or f3 strings, the latter keeps you from getting backed up, and pisses off your opponent pretty strongly.

As for RK, if you're not getting punished, don't change. Just be mentally prepared in case you do get punished and you'll be fine.
 

xxteefxx

Kenshi Moderator
awsm tolkeen did a nice job!! am happy seeing people playing kenshi more and more!! really awsm..a beautiful char

first off, i wanna update this guide BADLY!! though i wont do that because i promised someone that i wont do anything until after FR. releasing TONS and TONS of new techs for kenshi, a video (the last) and the guide update with TONS and TONS of info.

sadly because of work and school, i have to drop MK9!! so i am just a casual player now until i find time.

as for ur questions, i just wanna make some remarks.

#1 i dont think i mentioned this in my guide...this is Mayo's approach not mine. and that was back when kenshi was released haha. for a starter tactic, it aint bad. THOUGH!! this is a dump of meter...total no no!
meter = EX SC and anti Cross over...thats it!! this is kenshi, period! and in some situation, ex reflection for survival
so yes!! d+4~ex rk is useless. instead i recommend those ...here are new cakes for some people who didnt know

A) After EX SC, it's another guarenteed SC no matter wut! unless opponent used armor. hence in corner, EX SC, SC, RK! is a legit frame trap of more than 1 frame trap....u got tons of options. i am not gonna say any for now, but think outside the box...u SERIOUSLY have Low, and high and med options

B) SC~ RK is a legit frame trap. can be escaped by armors and some certain char specifics (NW shoulders, Cage Kick, Reptile Dash, Raiden Superman...etc)
to use this frame trap to its fullest potential. cr+3~ SC is another LEGIT 100% frame trap...cannot be even armored in between.
thus making cr+3~ SC, and then frame trap of RK a legit strategy!!


#2 2,1,b+2 is EVERYTHING!! and i mean EVERYTHING for kenshi!! 2,1,b+2 has a Multiple range of multi setups and they are all legit!

A) 2,1 ~ pause ~ f+3,2 (high low mix up)
B) 2,1~ f+2,2,b+2 (after b+2 or f+2,2,b+2, a SC is a Frame Trap!! escape by armors only...100%)
C) 2,1~ jump over extra mix ups
D) 2,1,b+2 ~ RK frame trap (escapable by some certain chars as i mentioned above). this is the DISTANCE that u have to master with kenshi...u always need to be in this range of the distance


#3 whats the point? 1 percent extra? no need...save ur energy for mastering kenshi's corner game and spacing/frame traps!

#4 Correct on everything except for Using TKS in such range...this is a pure no no!. with kenshi u have to be patient and at the same time, when ur in the correct distance, very aggressive. TKS punishable in a lot of use....not BAD though...but again, not preferable (whether on hit or block)

#5 kenshi doesnt have a bad corner game.....and it doesnt matter EX SC or EX RK because against certain chars both of them bug...though, EX SC has better chance slightly.
and to be precise, it's not a bug and not releated to input....it's a Hurtbox Issue*
PS: kenshi is ONE of the few char in the game that has AMAZING control in corner...just FYI* might take time to get it, but kenshi has no problem being in corner...

#6 agree but at some urges it's very useful...i made A lot of come backs because of EX reflect, especially on turtling...were kenshi excels the most


conclusion = meter = everything for kenshi!! and he builds it fast too!! thus never waste it but on frames traps, Reverses and some scenarios of keep away gake with EX SC...and ofcourse on some certain matches (the best to say is cyrax)...save for breaker