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Sub-Zero Match-ups

Endeavor

I'll live a villain, before I die a hero.
Premium Supporter
Sub's 6f D1 is sexy. Now give him that 6 frame low Shinnok had in MKX!! Was it 6 frames? It's been so long. ;(
Lmao Stop, if that happened TYM would go into full on ainal devastation mode. They say he was broken, and they would be right. He’s doing fine how he is now. He needs nothing else.
 

Bliss

Noob
Lmao Stop, if that happened TYM would go into full on ainal devastation mode. They stayed he was broken, and they would be right. He’s doing how he is lol. He needs nothing else.
TYM has a lot of "opinions" that don't hit the board. Who cares what some people with limited vision think? :DOGE:DOGE

Some guy told me Kabal, Cyrax and Sonya Blade were broke in MK9. They don't know what broke is!
 

Endeavor

I'll live a villain, before I die a hero.
Premium Supporter
TYM has a lot of "opinions" that don't hit the board. Who cares what some people with limited vision think? :DOGE:DOGE

Some guy told me Kabal was broke in MK9.
Kabal was broken in MK9.
 

Rpgz

Fraudguad/Weeb?
TYM has a lot of "opinions" that don't hit the board. Who cares what some people with limited vision think? :DOGE:DOGE

Some guy told me Kabal, Cyrax and Sonya Blade were broke in MK9. They don't know what broke is!
You sound delusional or maybe typo...back to reddit for sum1 soon i hope
 

Bliss

Noob
You sound delusional or maybe typo...back to reddit for sum1 soon i hope
Back to Reddit? Is that a wish or a command. And why do you command it (I've never been on Reddit website)? Kabal wasn't broke in MK9. Anyone thinking so sees the grass as blue and sky as green.
 

Rpgz

Fraudguad/Weeb?
Back to Reddit? Is that a wish or a command. And why do you command it (I've never been on Reddit website)? Kabal wasn't broke in MK9. Anyone thinking so sees the grass as blue and sky as green.
A Wish...Ill just ignore you if u annoy me...Welcome to TYM :)
 
Anyone got good responses to Jaqui's stagger pressure? I can never figure out when or how I'm consistently allowed to interrupt.
 

HapHaxion

"Knowledge" - Taio Cruz
So it'll be a month after the game's release tomorrow (or today, if you're in europe, africa, or asia). What characters do y'all have the most issues against as Sub, and which ones do you think he does the best against? I've heard alternating stories between "he's top tier" and "he's alright" so I wanna take a census of sorts
 

Snoop88

Noob
I think Jade is pretty much a bad match-up for Sub-Zero. She can easily outzone him and be immune to his projectiles. He must get in to do shit to her but that isn't easy do to all her projectiles etc.

Other one is Jacqui. I have hard times playing with my friend who mains her. Once she gets in it is a horror to get out. Sub's zoning game can't do much to her. Can't really punish her on anything, she's safe on most of her strings, must bait and look for whiff punishes which ain't easy against a patient player.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
Premium Supporter
I think Jade is pretty much a bad match-up for Sub-Zero. She can easily outzone him and be immune to his projectiles. He must get in to do shit to her but that isn't easy do to all her projectiles etc.

Other one is Jacqui. I have hard times playing with my friend who mains her. Once she gets in it is a horror to get out. Sub's zoning game can't do much to her. Can't really punish her on anything, she's safe on most of her strings, must bait and look for whiff punishes which ain't easy against a patient player.
Can’t really speak to the Jade MU, but I play a Jacqui main pretty often. I’d recommend Dead of Winter for her. Since her move speed is so high, slide isn’t really any more effective than something like b1 so you might as well keep your damage competitive.

Understanding her options will limit the damage you take more than some other characters. She’s more interactive as far as opponents go.
  • Her throw break reversals can be throw broken themselves, and since that KB is so massive you’ll have to look out for it. It triggers if LEG break happens AFTER arm break. Most Jacqui’s will go for the reversal arm first to load the KB for later. Tech whatever at first, but if she gets your arm, tech the leg break for the rest of the match.
  • Her clinch KB loads once she’s used the clinch knee and clinch suplex once each. Use the defensive meter to fall out and avoid one and the other when you can. Once the clinch elbow KB is loaded, save your meter to fall out of that.
Her f31 stagger pressure is not hit confirmable. If she’s using f31 xx grease kick on block, ez punish. If she’s staggering f31~feint, mash d1. Set the precedent that she’s going to have to go for grease kick on block or finish the string, otherwise you’re taking the turn. The full string does a little more than a throw BUT it resets the neutral. Sometimes you’ll have to spend your health bar as a resource like this to disable her strengths.

Her b3(?) low > elbow string gives her + frames but has a pretty big gap you can jab out of for a full combo. You can d1 poke, but that’s leaving a lot of damage on the table. Play to your own comfort level.

In the neutral, she’ll use her speed to walk you down. Stick b1’s out to keep her honest. Once she respects your b1 range she’ll look to contend with something else. She has the HIGH raw dash fist (neutral duck) and the mid b22 (block) which she’ll sometimes cancel into dash fist. B22 doesn’t jail, so neutral duck the third hit if she tries to punch. Eventually, a real footsie game will develop. Here, you can use f4 to close distance and gain frame advantage.

D4 is a strong normal here as well. On hit, pressure like normal. On block, it pushes SZ back far enough to back dash and COMMIT to a normal without Jacqui being able to reach you even though it’s technically her turn. Using b14 here is safe and confirmable. If she takes her turn with f31, she’ll miss and you’ll interrupt. You can use b32, which will catch both her d1 and f31 but the spacing is scary. It’s important to commit to your normal though, otherwise her f31 will catch up to you.

Jacqui has a powerful KB punish, and the perfect place to apply it in this MU is after blocking SZ’s f24/ f2 xx deep freeze. Unless you’ve comfortably conditioned your Jacqui, or you have spare DEF bars for breakaway, don’t commit to an f2 conversion. Use raw f2 to feel them out instead. Even though it’s -2 on hit, players aren’t anxious to hit buttons after being opened up. You can try to steal a turn or back dash/ shimmy to a comfortable distance and reapply your pressure.
 
Can’t really speak to the Jade MU, but I play a Jacqui main pretty often. I’d recommend Dead of Winter for her. Since her move speed is so high, slide isn’t really any more effective than something like b1 so you might as well keep your damage competitive.

Understanding her options will limit the damage you take more than some other characters. She’s more interactive as far as opponents go.
  • Her throw break reversals can be throw broken themselves, and since that KB is so massive you’ll have to look out for it. It triggers if LEG break happens AFTER arm break. Most Jacqui’s will go for the reversal arm first to load the KB for later. Tech whatever at first, but if she gets your arm, tech the leg break for the rest of the match.
  • Her clinch KB loads once she’s used the clinch knee and clinch suplex once each. Use the defensive meter to fall out and avoid one and the other when you can. Once the clinch elbow KB is loaded, save your meter to fall out of that.
Her f31 stagger pressure is not hit confirmable. If she’s using f31 xx grease kick on block, ez punish. If she’s staggering f31~feint, mash d1. Set the precedent that she’s going to have to go for grease kick on block or finish the string, otherwise you’re taking the turn. The full string does a little more than a throw BUT it resets the neutral. Sometimes you’ll have to spend your health bar as a resource like this to disable her strengths.

Her b3(?) low > elbow string gives her + frames but has a pretty big gap you can jab out of for a full combo. You can d1 poke, but that’s leaving a lot of damage on the table. Play to your own comfort level.

In the neutral, she’ll use her speed to walk you down. Stick b1’s out to keep her honest. Once she respects your b1 range she’ll look to contend with something else. She has the HIGH raw dash fist (neutral duck) and the mid b22 (block) which she’ll sometimes cancel into dash fist. B22 doesn’t jail, so neutral duck the third hit if she tries to punch. Eventually, a real footsie game will develop. Here, you can use f4 to close distance and gain frame advantage.

D4 is a strong normal here as well. On hit, pressure like normal. On block, it pushes SZ back far enough to back dash and COMMIT to a normal without Jacqui being able to reach you even though it’s technically her turn. Using b14 here is safe and confirmable. If she takes her turn with f31, she’ll miss and you’ll interrupt. You can use b32, which will catch both her d1 and f31 but the spacing is scary. It’s important to commit to your normal though, otherwise her f31 will catch up to you.

Jacqui has a powerful KB punish, and the perfect place to apply it in this MU is after blocking SZ’s f24/ f2 xx deep freeze. Unless you’ve comfortably conditioned your Jacqui, or you have spare DEF bars for breakaway, don’t commit to an f2 conversion. Use raw f2 to feel them out instead. Even though it’s -2 on hit, players aren’t anxious to hit buttons after being opened up. You can try to steal a turn or back dash/ shimmy to a comfortable distance and reapply your pressure.
This is great stuff. Thanks.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
Premium Supporter
how do I punish erron Bs drop kick?
You kinda have to anti air it? It’s possible to block and buffer dash > d1, but it’s like frame perfect. Flawless block > u2 tends to whiff also. He’s an absurdly safe character.

If you’re cornered, you can punish it normally. As normal as normal gets for EB anyway.
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
Premium Supporter
My friend plays Jacqui and I never want to see him flourish or win ever cuz he a bish made ninja

 

SubZeroIce

Runway
How are you Guys dealing with Jax? I'm just getting mauled
Did we play the same Jax cause I just came in here to ask the same thing.

I tried poking him out of random shit and it wouldn't work. His jab into overhead throw vs his jab into regular throw is like impossible to predict. And then that Fatal Blow DESTROYS ice ball/Slide
 

RM Ree

Shiba Tamer
Premium Supporter
How are you Guys dealing with Jax? I'm just getting mauled
His main pressure tools are f2 1+3 (OH) and f2 d4 (low). It’s usually a bad idea for Jax to go low since it’s super punishable, does no damage and doesn’t heat up his arms. Just always block high. When you block the OH from any string, it’s -7 and d1 will punish, giving you enough advantage to start your own pressure.

His dash punch can AMP into a full screen throw, but it’s a high so you can duck/ punish. This becomes a lot more potent when he has fatal blow and can threaten a fast, damaging mid at the same range.

He basically controls all neutral when below 30%. If he hits with FB, he’s threatening two KB’s on wake up between f2 1+3 and f-throw.

Also, his command throw is a mid so the only way to avoid it is by jumping. The only string he can tic throw from is d12 which doesn’t combo into anything. You can avoid the mix up between d12 > command throw/ strike by releasing block, taking the 2nd hit, and blocking again. You’ll be in hitstun to avoid the throw and recover in time to block/ punish whatever he uses to try and catch jump outs.