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Starfire Matchup Chart Ver. 2.0 (Now In WIP)

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
I ran a set with Laos boi and Zero. I'm definitely convinced Ivy and Starfire is even.

What really helps Starfire out here is her trait can check ivy while her trait is out meanwhile Ivy has the superior footsie game.
 

Invincible Salads

Seeker of knowledge
fast gun or not, pretty sure joker doesnt beat her...

i know u put starfire as winning the MU dash, im just commenting on what other people have said in this thread.
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
First version done after intensive grinding. I've taken everyone's opinions and matchup notes into consideration.

Let me know if there is anything that should be changed.
 

Espio

Kokomo
She doesn't do any better than 5-5 versus Beetle. She definitely doesn't out zone him. Cheetah doesn't lose to her either.
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
She doesn't do any better than 5-5 versus Beetle. She definitely doesn't out zone him. Cheetah doesn't lose to her either.
Care to explain? Seems like she wins the zoning war and shuts down his air mobility. Cheetah's pounce game doesn't seem to get started either and pushblocking hurts her a lot.
 

Espio

Kokomo
Care to explain? Seems like she wins the zoning war and shuts down his air mobility. Cheetah's pounce game doesn't seem to get started either and pushblocking hurts her a lot.
I'm just going to repost what I posted months ago.

Blue Beetle's ground zoning out damages hers, meaning most damage trades are in his favor. MB blast is extremely useful in this match up as well as it knocks her down and even if you happen to do trait, you have to hold the blast and get punished. Once you eat your 10-11% off that, we regain zoning advantage again. We also have a unique ability to get around her beams that many other characters do not possess at all and can force zoning hesitation. She has options to deal with flight, but you still force her to have to make a lot of additional reads to snipe you and he can bait her with empty jumps, flight cancelled into fall down etc.

Then there's the up close game. Her post blocked shield bash game isn't good at all. Forward 2 and standing 3, her two fast advancing buttons lose to down 1 shield bash or alternatively if he decides to launch for a full combo he can if you attempt those. She can just walk away and the down 1 whiffs, but then there's no challenge involved.

Her air dash is meh too and Beetle's projectile recovery is so fast that it can be very hard for her to navigate in on his zoning without simply walking in on a life lead.

Up close he does fine against her since he can chip her safely and he is very good at armor breaking her MB back 3/forward 3 and her hitbox is weird so sometimes he passes right through her making them both whiff so there's no risk in that exchange since she is in recovery frames too, he can recover to be safe.


There's no real reason for her to win. Having some options to counter his options just means it's not a body, not that she wins. There is no shut down of flight, he just has to space and think while using flight. He also doesn't have to be constantly flying to deal with her and in fact, I think mostly ground game with flight intermixed from time to time is the key.



As for Cheetah, I feel like this is another case of a linear view of the character. She has entirely too many ways to make you guess on her jump ins. She has pounce cancels, close pounce, far pounce, different jump normals that require different timings to blow up, she can use your anti-air attempts to simply walk you down and when people say her neutral is bad or she has bad footsies, they're not comprehending that this character has a full screen leap that is plus on block and leads to 400ish damage for a bar, more with trait. Her footsies are certainly not non-existent. Her lacking range on her ground normals is completely offset by her insane mobility and reward for catching you slipping with leap into damage.

Now I will say that Starfire has way better options than a lot of other zoners and Cheetah has to play more in depth footsies, but that's why it's even and not in her favor like how she beats Ivy and Fate.

Then there's some other problems Starfire runs into: Cheetah can low profile her MB back 3 and of course since her forward/back 3's are a notable part of her offsetting her highs and so-so mids, it allows Cheetah to get more opportunities to abuse armored forward 3 to crush her armor. Cheetah can also go under strings canceled into up close starburst while taking no damage. She can have a hard time waking up versus Cheetah as well. This seems more like your traditional rushdown/zoner fight.

You can't operate under the assumption that you have some options that check them so now they're shut down. Beetle and Cheetah players that are playing a complete version of them aren't shut down. The good players are going to frustrate you and mix it up.
 

Crusty

Retired forever; don’t ask for games.
So I’m reading Red Hood’s my notes, turns out you wrote 23.

Did you mean b23?

Because red hood doesn’t have a 23 string.
 
Dr fate is possible her worst mu. Probably a starfire main as of a few days ago. When red hood gets bombs going it is hard for her to get her turn back.

Still exploring.
 

TrulyAmiracle

Loud and Klear~
Another patch means another update to the chart.

Any character immediately stand out with changes made?

@Tweedy
@xKhaoTik
@Espio
@PLAYING TO WIN
@TrulyAmiracle
@EMPRESS_SunFire
Supergirl, Fate and Arrow are her worst MUs now, in that order imo.
DS now is 5-5 or might even be in our favor, haven't played too many after the patch.

Might just be me but I feel Flash is hard as well, like once he's on starfire it's crazy hard to do anything.
Also are you sure trait beats RMS? coz I swear I tried stardust cancel into trait yesterday and he just went right through both into RMS 1.
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
Supergirl, Fate and Arrow are her worst MUs now, in that order imo.
DS now is 5-5 or might even be in our favor, haven't played too many after the patch.

Might just be me but I feel Flash is hard as well, like once he's on starfire it's crazy hard to do anything.
Also are you sure trait beats RMS? coz I swear I tried stardust cancel into trait yesterday and he just went right through both into RMS 1.
Yeah, you can throw a projectile and then cancel it into trait if you think he'll try to advance. Hell, if you want to spend a bar, you can just flat out knock him down with trait and throw a stardust on his wake-up.
 

AkioOf100

I play Raph
DB3 makes it hard for Beetle to set anything up on her but she loses up close completely at this point (assuming the beetle is using blades), we counter-zone her very well. D2 trades w/ d1 is in our favor (both 6 frames).

I'm pretty sure the matchup is still 5-5 but I think it could possibly be 4-6 in beetle's favor since she doesn't really have a consistent way to challenge shield bash on block and on whiff she has issues punishing it, especially with the new recovery buff. Mandible Strike (bf3 in trait) low profiles her trait & starbolts to an extent. She has very little answer to Beetle's pressure, but we have to respect her d1 if we don't have out power blades to out-range her.

all our traited jump-ins beat hers out as well, removing all of her air control up close.
 

Tweedy

Champion
Supergirl is her worst mu free imo. Fate is managable imo. I try to play from the range where she can duck df1.
 

TrulyAmiracle

Loud and Klear~
Supergirl is her worst mu free imo. Fate is managable imo. I try to play from the range where she can duck df1.
100% agree on this supergirl is such a shit MU for her, you have no control in the air, ground, upclose or fullscreen. SG dominates Starfire at all ranges I've started going Adam when I see that Supergirl counterpick, not even worth the effort to try to fight SG at this point.
 
supergirl is even or at worse a 4-6. starfire does not have a mu worse that 4-6. it all depends on your ability to poke the gaps. she is a completely viable character
 
Another patch means another update to the chart.

Any character immediately stand out with changes made?

@Tweedy
@xKhaoTik
@Espio
@PLAYING TO WIN
@TrulyAmiracle
@EMPRESS_SunFire
I expect one more major balance patch with the turtles and probably the last one in the game.


The only things I really want... is for a full screen star dust to combo. If you hit them, they can block the last hit for some reason. That takes away some trade damage potential from her.

Speed up d2 or b2 or make d2 low profile like flash's

She is in a really good spot. Having the best player in the world publicly say she sucks and the fact that many people do not use her means she will be exempt from nerfs and may even get some buffs. I know tweedy won a weekly or two with her and I took second in the ESL thing.. other than that she is MIA in tournament play as far as I know. I consider her my main. I am a loyalist and will use her win or lose. Plan on traveling again after all DLC is out.

Every character has to have a weakness. That is why supergirl or catwoman perplex me. Let star fires neutral be sub par but at least make her up close AA game better. You will NEVER her me complain about her dragon punch though. It is my favorite move in the entire game lol. AA from half screen. Really keeps a lot of airborn players in check.

She actually does have mix but not in the traditional sense. Her trade game is top tier when utilized correctly. Recently been playing a lot of great players and it works on them. Once its respected it opens up a lotttttttt pressure wise. Go ahead and mash a poke vs her you will eat 500dmg.
 

Vengeance135

Saltiest Joker Player
@DarksydeDash my comments on the starfire/joker MU. Before she got normalized, she obliterated joker and the joker community pretty much agreed on this.

Now with the most recent patch, she still wins but it's a 6-4 her favor.

She can outzone joker with her projectile game

she does outdamage joker

she has better buttons (better neutral)

she can deal with jokers jump ins relatively easy. I can't remember what the inputs are but the move where she throws some green shit in the air and can b3 off the conversion. That move is super effective.

She is also one character that can still bully joker when he gets knockdown.

None of jokers buffs really affected the outcome of this MU imo. Basically it's her playing keep away, utilizing pushblock and delayed wake up and forcing the joker to play unsafe and reckless to get in.

If you want to run this MU just add me:

PSN: Vengeance135

@Vex anything to add to this?
 

Cashual

PSN: Cansuela
I agree with the GL number being 6-4 in favor of Starfire.

Lantern struggles in MUs against effective zoners in genetal.
 

GLoRToR

Positive Poster!
How is Starfire and "effective zoner" ? You can duck or jump over her projectile and her trait, sparks are negative af on block and lead to very little damage on hit. The orb is pretty useless altogether as well. It's negative on block upclose and gets jumped over anywhere else and if you tag her she won't be able to use trait to blow it up. IF she has trait left that is, because that's literally her answer for everything and it runs out.
No.
GL is 5-5, if he gets in she's fucked and if by some miracle she keeps him out she might or might not lose.