Smoke General Discussion

[PrinceGoro]

The damage scaling calculations in this game are kinda strange but smoke specifically is super weird.Execution heavy combos with multiple cancles get scaled hard,and in general alot of his conversions kinda forcefully get scaled to similair damage.But his ex tele and air11 seem to have minimal scaling,doing f4 and cancling on the seconde hit into ex tele and then doing 11xxExtele,11xxExtele,112 does 517.17 damage lol

just doing a raw Extele 11xxExtele,11××EXtele,112 does like 47%

 

[Juggs]

The damage scaling calculations in this game are kinda strange but smoke specifically is super weird.Execution heavy combos with multiple cancles get scaled hard,and in general alot of his conversions kinda forcefully get scaled to similair damage.But his ex tele and air11 seem to have minimal scaling,doing f4 and cancling on the seconde hit into ex tele and then doing 11xxExtele,11xxExtele,112 does 517.17 damage lol

just doing a raw Extele 11xxExtele,11××EXtele,112 does like 47%

The more hits, the more the scaling as well. And for the most part, jump in attack combo starters do less damage unless you’re only doing a few hits or something. It’s honestly a lazy way to handle scaling imo. Instead of working on individual characters, they made a lot of things like scaling universal. Not realizing this hurts some characters far more than others. It also makes super long combos with a lot of hits that may require a lot of execution do way less damage than a simple 8 hit derpy derp combo.

 

[PrinceGoro]

The more hits, the more the scaling as well. And for the most part, jump in attack combo starters do less damage unless you’re only doing a few hits or something. It’s honestly a lazy way to handle scaling imo. Instead of working on individual characters, they made a lot of things like scaling universal. Not realizing this hurts some characters far more than others. It also makes super long combos with a lot of hits that may require a lot of execution do way less damage than a simple 8 hit derpy derp combo.

yeah really strange way to handle it,and yeah i noticed that too,jump ins nerf combo damage by a decent amount in this game compared to their other titles.there seem to be a decent amount of bugs and strange situations in many of the games aspects hopefully it gets ironed out.

 

[ShaolinGunFu]

The damage scaling calculations in this game are kinda strange but smoke specifically is super weird.Execution heavy combos with multiple cancles get scaled hard,and in general alot of his conversions kinda forcefully get scaled to similair damage.But his ex tele and air11 seem to have minimal scaling,doing f4 and cancling on the seconde hit into ex tele and then doing 11xxExtele,11xxExtele,112 does 517.17 damage lol

just doing a raw Extele 11xxExtele,11××EXtele,112 does like 47%

Landing a raw tele is risking a -30 punish so as scrubby as it seems it should be rewarded more. The cancel combos are for converting strings that cant be cancelled directly into tele

 

[PrinceGoro]

Landing a raw tele is risking a -30 punish so as scrubby as it seems it should be rewarded more. The cancel combos are for converting strings that cant be cancelled directly into tele

its not about that at all,besides f4 is a plus on block long range multi hitting string yet simply cancleing on seconde hit nets 517 dmg.

The damage scaling is just off for tele and air112.
In general like we said above the game handles damage scaling in a weired way across the board.
I think you missunderstood my post as nerf smoke post,which it is not,simply outlying a strange damage scaling situation,where its non existent for tele and air112 and he gets overscaled in other areas.

as for your statment about tele being punishable,well its not just about what damage it comes after but how,you literally do raw tele 11xxtele,11xxtele 112,and you get 47% for such a simple combo,absuing the lack of scaling.

The reward from the teleport should be the fact that there is a constant treat of it in the neutral and its a very viable way to counter projectiles as well as a mix up tool,baiting anti-airs etc(some cases more risk the others).Not insane damge conversion if an opponet makes 1 mistake which also requiers pretty much zero execution

But again this in not a nerf smokes tele thing its just the damage scaling is screwed up.Think of scorpion or other full screen teleports in past NRS titles,could you juat do ex teleport 3 times and do 47%?

 

[Soprohero]

Any tips on how to get 1+3 to connect in the F12 1+3 string in his bnb combos? The grab is whiffing too much of the time for me after the 2nd 32.

 

[Cobainevermind87]

Any tips on how to get 1+3 to connect in the F12 1+3 string in his bnb combos? The grab is whiffing too much of the time for me after the 2nd 32.

After the first 32, dash and try to hit the second 32 early so that the second hit of 32 whiffs. The loss of damage is worth never dropping it again

 

[Juggs]

Any tips on how to get 1+3 to connect in the F12 1+3 string in his bnb combos? The grab is whiffing too much of the time for me after the 2nd 32.

After the 2nd 32, don’t dash, just walk slightly forward and then do the F12. You’re essentially wanting to hit the opponent as high as you can as they’re falling. I have a demonstration recorded showing a few different combos, including starting from just a raw 32, and all the F12’s connected. If this advice doesn’t help let me know and I’ll post that video.

 

[Soprohero]

Ok thank you. I'll give it a shot next time I'm on tomorrow!

And btw one more thing I guess I might as well ask. I also am getting whiffs on 11 xx ex db4 in the air. Any tips there?

 

[PrinceGoro]

Ok thank you. I'll give it a shot next time I'm on tomorrow!

And btw one more thing I guess I might as well ask. I also am getting whiffs on 11 xx ex db4 in the air. Any tips there?

depends on how much gravity you have spent.
if you land a raw ex teleport,the 11 needs to be delayed decently,if some gravity is spent slightly delay 11,if its a long combo with alot of gravity spent then you have to do 11 immidietly.

 

[Juggs]

Ok thank you. I'll give it a shot next time I'm on tomorrow!

And btw one more thing I guess I might as well ask. I also am getting whiffs on 11 xx ex db4 in the air. Any tips there?

You typically have to do it really quickly. Meaning press 11 then ex db4 as fast as you can. That’s what has worked best for me.

 

[Cobainevermind87]

depends on how much gravity you have spent.
if you land a raw ex teleport,the 11 needs to be delayed decently,if some gravity is spent slightly delay 11,if its a long combo with alot of gravity spent then you have to do 11 immidietly.

This is the way.

If you've already done whatever opener into two 32s into f12grab, then @Juggs would be correct. You can only do two ex teles after said combo, followed by an instant air112 after the second ex tele

But if you're going into ex tele after a grounded punish with no juggles or straight up yolo (That's what PrinceGoro means by raw), then @PrinceGoro's advice would do you well. You'd have to let them fall a bit

What's your opener when this happens? So we can understand better

 

[Soprohero]

Ok thanks guys, I am able to land the ex db4 consistently now!

I'm still struggling with F12 1+3 to hit constitently tho. But I been using a work around now where if one of the kicks whiff in the second 32, I'll go for the F12 1+3 because it always connects then. But if I am hitting with all the kicks I'll just jump in the air and do 112. Similar damage but I lose the ability to use ex db4 to extend the combo but not the end of the world atm.

I'll keep working on it though!

 

[Kindred]

Ok thanks guys, I am able to land the ex db4 consistently now!

I'm still struggling with F12 1+3 to hit constitently tho. But I been using a work around now where if one of the kicks whiff in the second 32, I'll go for the F12 1+3 because it always connects then. But if I am hitting with all the kicks I'll just jump in the air and do 112. Similar damage but I lose the ability to use ex db4 to extend the combo but not the end of the world atm.

I'll keep working on it though!

When both 32-strings hit, F12(1+3) does have a chance of whiffing. I found what helps me land it consistently is that after the second 32-string connects, I walk a little bit forward (Not dash) so that my F1 hits them at the highest point. When you practice to get that point down, the F12(1+3) connects more consistently.

 

[Kindred]

Is there a trick to land the air 1 (or 2) when you drop down from being invisible after DB2(EX)? Or is it just a timing issue?
Also, I never noticed but do I need meter for DB2 on wake up to be armored? I find sometimes I turn invisible when I dont want to. Am I enhancing it without realizing like a scrub lol

 

[PrinceGoro]

Is there a trick to land the air 1 (or 2) when you drop down from being invisible after DB2(EX)? Or is it just a timing issue?
Also, I never noticed but do I need meter for DB2 on wake up to be armored? I find sometimes I turn invisible when I dont want to. Am I enhancing it without realizing like a scrub lol

if you ex but the armor doesnt activate,meaning you didnt get hit,you will go into the invisable variation,if you get hit as you did the wake up EXdb2 you will have armor and you dont go invisable

 

[Juggs]

This is the way.

If you've already done whatever opener into two 32s into f12grab, then @Juggs would be correct. You can only do two ex teles after said combo, followed by an instant air112 after the second ex tele

But if you're going into ex tele after a grounded punish with no juggles or straight up yolo (That's what PrinceGoro means by raw), then @PrinceGoro's advice would do you well. You'd have to let them fall a bit

What's your opener when this happens? So we can understand better

Exactly. My bad I thought he was referring to it at the end of a combo

 

[Krankk]

And btw one more thing I guess I might as well ask. I also am getting whiffs on 11 xx ex db4 in the air. Any tips there?

The advice was to dial it in as fast as possible... I'm not sure if that works.

What works for me for extended Teleport combos is doing a late 21 instead of a 11. I get the 21 with a slight delay much more often to work.
With that being said though, I'm not sure how effective those 2x or 3x Smoke Port combos really are. Even just ONE (like after a 32, 32, 121+3, EX Port 112) does only slightly more damage than just ending with a regular Smoke Bomb.

I like saving the meter for Breakers, because if you're not landing your Vapor Cancels online and you're playing without Sareena, you won't do as much damage as plenty of the other roster.

 

[Juggs]

The advice was to dial it in as fast as possible... I'm not sure if that works.

What works for me for extended Teleport combos is doing a late 21 instead of a 11. I get the 21 with a slight delay much more often to work.
With that being said though, I'm not sure how effective those 2x or 3x Smoke Port combos really are. Even just ONE (like after a 32, 32, 121+3, EX Port 112) does only slightly more damage than just ending with a regular Smoke Bomb.

I like saving the meter for Breakers, because if you're not landing your Vapor Cancels online and you're playing without Sareena, you won't do as much damage as plenty of the other roster.

Doing the air 11 EX TP super quickly after EX TP or after pop up combo into 11 EX TP is if it’s towards the end of a longer combo, aka there’s more gravity so you have to do it as quickly as possible. If you’re doing it raw or after only a couple hits, you have to delay it. Essentially the timing depends on the combo done before getting to that point. There’s no “one timing fits all” to it, but that’s how most combos are.

 

[OceanOne]

How are you guys feeling about Smoke's Kameos after ECT? I've been using Scorpion and having success online but it seems like Kameos like Sektor or Lao truly makes him compete better against higher tier characters.

I'm thinking about learning Sektor.

 

[G82Boost]

 

[ShaolinGunFu]

Any tremor tech that makes him better than the other smoke kameos?

 

[ShaolinGunFu]

Any kameos combo off a back throw? I get scorp fire to connect sometimes but cant continue after

 

[Juggs]

Any kameos combo off a back throw? I get scorp fire to connect sometimes but cant continue after

Sorry, I haven’t used Smoke in awhile. I might start using him again at some point, but as of now Scorpion is the only character I really have fun using (even though he struggles, he’s just been my main in so many MK’s that I feel the most comfortable and fun using him)

 

[Cobainevermind87]

Any kameos combo off a back throw? I get scorp fire to connect sometimes but cant continue after

What happens if you try going into f12grab string after the up balls?