Question Raiden top 5?

[Clayman]

so this is all about 3,3,4,tele? wow wow wow i think we have to ban this gamebreaking glitch asap!

 

[GGA Jeremiah]

so this is all about 3,3,4,tele? wow wow wow i think we have to ban this gamebreaking glitch asap!

No it is all about how good PL's Raiden is. The 334 tele on some armor moves just helps.

 

[Phosferrax]

Basically if your doing a 334 string and you predict your opponent will try to armor interrupt...say sonya decides to en cartwheel interrupt, if you cancel the last hit into tele the interrupt will whiff. The same applies to B3(here)1(here)2, and you can opt to use en tele instead of regular tele. That's the big secret.

.... That's meant to be a secret?

Half the time I find that using ex-tele just ends up Raiden getting hit by the move he was trying to avoid.

 

[Clayman]

No it is all about how good PL's Raiden is. The 334 tele on some armor moves just helps.

...so this is some sort of ass-lickin thread?

 

[Deleted member 9158]

Maybe not top 5, but he goes even or better with most of the characters in the top 10. The only reason he's not top 5 is because he has less 6-4 and 7-3 matchups in his favor than other characters.

what about his interruptible strings? I remember Tom Brady showing how to interrupt his best strings (334 and that other one B312?). raiden is infinitely better online imo.

But not to take anything away from the character, he is a VERY solid character that certainly earns his spot somewhere in the top 10, but no higher than 6th.

 

[B W1zZ]

what about his interruptible strings? I remember Tom Brady showing how to interrupt his best strings (334 and that other one B312?). raiden is infinitely better online imo.

But not to take anything away from the character, he is a VERY solid character that certainly earns his spot somewhere in the top 10, but no higher than 6th.

Like I said before I place Raiden at probably around the 9th spot...and most of the top 10 he goes even with.

Interruptible strings arent as big of a deal as people make them out to be...for one you could use the "secret tech" revealed in this thread to escape a lot of characters armored interrupts, and on top of that he has other uninterruptible pressure options that lead to potential setups and build a good amount of meter.

 

[Clayman]

Raiden goes even not with only top10, but with pretty much everyone, cuz his tele disables any zoning (not kabals), gets him out of any pressure and superman punishes any unsafe moves. But his own zoning and upclose pressure suck big time, he is only scary with f+2,4 in the corner.

 

[Chaosphere]

Raiden goes even not with only top10, but with pretty much everyone, cuz his tele disables any zoning (not kabals), gets him out of any pressure and superman punishes any unsafe moves. But his own zoning and upclose pressure suck big time, he is only scary with f+2,4 in the corner.

His pressure isn't as bad as you're making it out to be. You can escape out of any character's pressure with the right counter. Raiden has some decent pressure up close... just no overhead/low mixups that are that worthwhile. But you can definitely overwhelm people with Raiden up close and force them to make a mistake.

 

[MK_Al]

...so this is some sort of ass-lickin thread?

No. This is about Raidens 334 xx teleport tech, that no one knew, but after it got revealed that its 334 xx teleport, everyone came to the conclusion that this is known for ages. Thats the reason you see so many Raiden player avoiding XRays and armor moves.

 

[Clayman]

His pressure isn't as bad as you're making it out to be. You can escape out of any character's pressure with the right counter. Raiden has some decent pressure up close... just no overhead/low mixups that are that worthwhile. But you can definitely overwhelm people with Raiden up close and force them to make a mistake.

His only real pressure is f+2,4 in the corner and tele shenanigans. It's only semi-good vs no armor slow ass character like noob saibot or ermac (and even vs them he is like 6-4, not 7-3 for sure).I can't call that decent. Please, prove me wrong.

No. This is about Raidens 334 xx teleport tech, that no one knew, but after it got revealed that its 334 xx teleport, everyone came to the conclusion that this is known for ages. Thats the reason you see so many Raiden player avoiding XRays and armor moves.

Everyone knew that, cuz every raiden player does 3,3,4,tele going for combo. That's the real reason why they avoid xrays and armor moves.

 

[FrothyOmen]

Yeah, let's blow up Raiden players for discussing 334~teleport. They must all be really fucking free.

Yeah, let's tell Chaosphere of all people that he's completely fucking wrong when it comes to Raiden.

Yeah, yeah.

 

[Clayman]

Yeah, let's blow up Raiden players for discussing 334~teleport. They must all be really fucking free.

Yeah, let's tell Chaosphere of all people that he's completely fucking wrong when it comes to Raiden.

Yeah, yeah.

go take some pills

 

[Chaosphere]

His only real pressure is f+2,4 in the corner and tele shenanigans. It's only semi-good vs no armor slow ass character like noob saibot or ermac (and even vs them he is like 6-4, not 7-3 for sure).I can't call that decent. Please, prove me wrong.

Everyone knew that, cuz every raiden player does 3,3,4,tele going for combo. That's the real reason why they avoid xrays and armor moves.

First of all, f24 isn't even pressure. It's one string. Yeah it gives pushback and puts you at good spacing, but dude raiden has pressure. It has holes in it, but so does everyone else's pressure.

Here's an instance of some pressure that I do. Assume they are just blocking and have no meter... I lock people down all the time. 334, d1~vb, dash f23, backdash b312. If they don't block 334 you get a full combo. If they try to jump when you d1~vb then you get an anti air combo. If f23 hits you can get a 1bar of meter full combo. If b312 hits you get a full combo. If they block everything, then you just built a SHIT TON of meter. Yeah there are ways out of it. They can jump after the blocked vb, or d1 after 334, or possibly poke out of b312. I get that, but that's why you condition them to not do those things, or you have to know all of your options and make a good read.

There are tons of variations. 1212~tele which leaves you at -6, or even without the tele it's -13 but gives really good pushback so it can really only be punished with a fast advancing special.

You can also 121, back dash then either anti air if they jump or whiff punish with b3.

His pressure isn't like cage's or anything but raiden has completely viable options. Don't say that he doesn't without being FULLY confident because this stuff works for me all the time. And I didn't even mention d3 or throw yet.

 

[Might Tested]

First of all, f24 isn't even pressure. It's one string. Yeah it gives pushback and puts you at good spacing, but dude raiden has pressure. It has holes in it, but so does everyone else's pressure.

Here's an instance of some pressure that I do. Assume they are just blocking and have no meter... I lock people down all the time. 334, d1~vb, dash f23, backdash b312. If they don't block 334 you get a full combo. If they try to jump when you d1~vb then you get an anti air combo. If f23 hits you can get a 1bar of meter full combo. If b312 hits you get a full combo. If they block everything, then you just built a SHIT TON of meter. Yeah there are ways out of it. They can jump after the blocked vb, or d1 after 334, or possibly poke out of b312. I get that, but that's why you condition them to not do those things, or you have to know all of your options and make a good read.

There are tons of variations. 1212~tele which leaves you at -6, or even without the tele it's -13 but gives really good pushback so it can really only be punished with a fast advancing special.

You can also 121, back dash then either anti air if they jump or whiff punish with b3.

His pressure isn't like cage's or anything but raiden has completely viable options. Don't say that he doesn't without being FULLY confident because this stuff works for me all the time. And I didn't even mention d3 or throw yet.

I should play your Raiden...

 

[1man3letters]

i dont play the char but radien being top 5 is very possible imo,
when a radien player plays flawless its a scary thing

 

[Chaosphere]

I should play your Raiden...

you should. add me on xbl TYM Chaosphere. Or go to season's beatings. I'll be there.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

you should. add me on xbl TYM Chaosphere. Or go to season's beatings. I'll be there.

I'm definately going.

 

[Chaosphere]

You can even not link the tele after 334 and just do it after you recover from 334's block stun and avoid ALL xrays/armored moves instead of just some.

 

[Clayman]

First of all, f24 isn't even pressure. It's one string. Yeah it gives pushback and puts you at good spacing, but dude raiden has pressure. It has holes in it, but so does everyone else's pressure.

Here's an instance of some pressure that I do. Assume they are just blocking and have no meter... I lock people down all the time. 334, d1~vb, dash f23, backdash b312. If they don't block 334 you get a full combo. If they try to jump when you d1~vb then you get an anti air combo. If f23 hits you can get a 1bar of meter full combo. If b312 hits you get a full combo. If they block everything, then you just built a SHIT TON of meter. Yeah there are ways out of it. They can jump after the blocked vb, or d1 after 334, or possibly poke out of b312. I get that, but that's why you condition them to not do those things, or you have to know all of your options and make a good read.

There are tons of variations. 1212~tele which leaves you at -6, or even without the tele it's -13 but gives really good pushback so it can really only be punished with a fast advancing special.

You can also 121, back dash then either anti air if they jump or whiff punish with b3.

His pressure isn't like cage's or anything but raiden has completely viable options. Don't say that he doesn't without being FULLY confident because this stuff works for me all the time. And I didn't even mention d3 or throw yet.

f24 is the only real pressure string, cuz it gives +frames on block and the pushback makes these+frames fully abusable only in the corner. All ur pressure options are even or neutral on block, so that's not better than scorpion's 111 pressure or smth like that. Backdash b312 is good insome matchups though, but d1~vb is a sure way to get urself killed, if i'm blocking low, btw it can be jumped out after 334. Vb is even on block, so i don't get why r u trying to dash after it to my face, cuz most players will try to lowpoke or smth like cage's/shang's knee after that.
LBSH, raiden sucks balls upclose, but it sucks to attack raiden too, cuz he has lots of armor and tele. Think of kano's upclose pressure it's much like raiden's without good armor or tele.

 

[trustinme]

anyone remember that thread "new game changing raiden tech" it was 121 followed by ex lightning on block,fucking hilarious stuff.it wasnt so much the idea,i dont think theres anything wrong with sharing your ideas no matter how stupid they are,i mean tbh ive come up with plenty myself,it was just the name of the thread i found so funny.anyway i'll stfu now,not really sure why im posting tbh.

 

[xInfra Deadx]

f24 is the only real pressure string, cuz it gives +frames on block and the pushback makes these+frames fully abusable only in the corner. All ur pressure options are even or neutral on block, so that's not better than scorpion's 111 pressure or smth like that. Backdash b312 is good insome matchups though, but d1~vb is a sure way to get urself killed, if i'm blocking low, btw it can be jumped out after 334. Vb is even on block, so i don't get why r u trying to dash after it to my face, cuz most players will try to lowpoke or smth like cage's/shang's knee after that.
LBSH, raiden sucks balls upclose, but it sucks to attack raiden too, cuz he has lots of armor and tele. Think of kano's upclose pressure it's much like raiden's without good armor or tele.

I can already tell that you don't play Raiden at all.

 

[NKZero]

Can we just clarify one thing here, Raiden is not designed to be an offensive character. He's got solid defense and he is a great turtle. He is a defensive footsie character with great whiff punishing moves to capitalise on opponents' mistakes/impatience. Then he can run away with the life lead. The only pressure option available to him is hoping you jail someone with F23 and mix it up with F23 or F23-vicinity blast (which gives a safe jump on hit and is safe on block). With Raiden it's about getting the opponent to respect your strings (just teleport if they are armour happy and whiff punish). He is the ultimate king of mind games too because the teleport is a game changer. Use it at the right moments and Raiden is very difficult to play against. Anyways here imo are his pros and cons....

Pros:
1) very good damage mid-screen and in the corner
2) good whiff punishing
3) very good turtle
4) best teleport in the game
5) armour on EX shocker which can lead to a full combo (although unsafe on block)
6) strong corner game
7) generally useful EX moves (EX shocker, EX lightning bolt, EX teleport, EX electric fly)
8) doesn't lose many MU's (maybe only 2)

Cons:
1) slow mobility (abuse of teleport can lead to punishment)
2) fairly slow normals (can't really take advantage of a D3 on stand hit)
3) sometimes struggles to catch someone with a life-lead (good turtle but can be turtled effectively as well)
4) doesn't dominate the "lesser" MU's like the other top tier characters do

Now is this character top 5? He definitely has the potential to be. As 1man3letters said, a Raiden player who is on point is very scary. When you fight Raiden, you have to play this game. The standard game plan with your character is thrown right out of the window because of his teleport. I'm thinking that as of now, he's top 7 or 8 (top 5 in order for me: Kabal, Kenshi, Kung Lao, Sonya, Cyrax). That's my $0.02 on the matter anyways.

 

[Chaosphere]

f24 is the only real pressure string, cuz it gives +frames on block and the pushback makes these+frames fully abusable only in the corner. All ur pressure options are even or neutral on block, so that's not better than scorpion's 111 pressure or smth like that. Backdash b312 is good insome matchups though, but d1~vb is a sure way to get urself killed, if i'm blocking low, btw it can be jumped out after 334. Vb is even on block, so i don't get why r u trying to dash after it to my face, cuz most players will try to lowpoke or smth like cage's/shang's knee after that.
LBSH, raiden sucks balls upclose, but it sucks to attack raiden too, cuz he has lots of armor and tele. Think of kano's upclose pressure it's much like raiden's without good armor or tele.

First of all, f24 is 0 on block so... you just argued against yourself as far as moves that end at 0 go. Sure you can block d1~vb low... just like you can block d1~cutter low. I'm not saying d1~vb is as good as d1~cutter, but the concept is the same. And no, you can't jump out after blocked 334 if I d1... unless every single person I've ever done it to is jumping late. Either way, I could opt to do standing 1~vb which will hit them if they are standing or if they are blocking low then just 12 will come out and 1 will whiff but they'll have to block the 2 since it hits mid. Or if I think you're going to hold block at all I'll just throw. I dash after blocked vb to put my other moves in range to hit them in instances where I try to do a string starting with f2 or if I try to d3.

Anyways, the point is... you condition your opponent to block. That series of moves I posted up there was just 1 random example. Everybody's pressure has holes. Everybody's. The point is that you condition your opponent to do what you want them to do before you just run in blindly and Raiden definitely has every ability to do that. He has very viable pressure options.

 

[Chaosphere]

With Raiden it's about getting the opponent to respect your strings (just teleport if they are armour happy and whiff punish). He is the ultimate king of mind games too because the teleport is a game changer. Use it at the right moments and Raiden is very difficult to play against.

This

 

[Clayman]

First of all, f24 is 0 on block so... you just argued against yourself as far as moves that end at 0 go.

Damn, that makes raiden even worse....

Anyways, the point is... you condition your opponent to block. That series of moves I posted up there was just 1 random example. Everybody's pressure has holes. Everybody's. The point is that you condition your opponent to do what you want them to do before you just run in blindly and Raiden definitely has every ability to do that. He has very viable pressure options.

Everybody's pressure has holes, but raiden's has much more than say shang or baraka, that's all i'm trying to say. And that's not a bad thing, raiden is a well-balanced character that goes 5-5 with 90% of the cast due to his unique tools. If he had real pressure (like he had pre-patch), he'd be at least top5 for sure.