Discussion MKXL Character Learning Curve Rating System

[Boss Savage]

I'll take the time to better explain how this rating system would work in the future.

A character's variation will have a rating going from Casual: just picking up the character and using him/her online, to Competitive: Mastering the character's ins and outs. Hopefully to one day use at a tournament.

So for an example Suberzero Unbreakable would Moderate-Strict because the character itself is hard to use and to master said character requires a lot of match up knowledge.

I'd also like peoples input on how the rating system should go

Either a three tier: Low, Moderate/Medium, Strict/High

Or five Tier: Beginner, Easy, Normal, Hard, Very Hard

I'm unsure which would be the less confusing of the two. So I'd like the communities opinion on this.

 

[zabugi]

Dualist here anybody and definately demo sonya

 

[xSamuel]

It would probably be more accurate to do a 1-5 rating system because you're going to have a ton of variations. I'm sure there will be some that sit between two groups. One example I could think of is Cybernetic Kano. His combos are easy but as to how good of a character he is depends on how good the player is. I would put him in the Easy - Moderate section. Idk I just think there will be a lot of variety and having a couple more tiers would help

 

[TheGangstaFace]

You can't put a poll big enough. I think you can have 30 slots right? And there's 100 variations #rip

 

[xSamuel]

You can't put a poll big enough. I think you can have 30 slots right? And there's 100 variations #rip

I never thought of that... Would it be more feasible to just take an active high level player from each community to speak on their character via message or something?

 

[TheGangstaFace]

I never thought of that... Would it be more feasible to just take an active high level player from each community to speak on their character via message or something?

Lol good luck with that. 3/4 of these NRS competitive players are too high and mighty to talk to regular people no matter how good or knowledgeable or serious anyone is. Not speaking from salt or anything, it's just how I've seen things within the community. There's some cool people but that's it

 

[xSamuel]

Lol good luck with that. 3/4 of these NRS competitive players are too high and mighty to talk to regular people no matter how good or knowledgeable or serious anyone is. Not speaking from salt or anything, it's just how I've seen things within the community. There's some cool people but that's it

That's what I'm saying. Active members of each community on TYM. To understand and play a character is one thing but to be a good player is another. Forever Elite or Xarakamaka can comment on Liu Kang, Eddy Wang on Lao, Blake/Mitsu on Scorpion, etc. Idk just some names off the top but you get the idea. We have a great community beneath all of the random people in threads.

I dont expect Tom Brady, Reo, Sonicfox, etc to come in and give in depth analysis on their characters. They're welcome to but I doubt they would lol

 

[TheGangstaFace]

That's what I'm saying. Active members of each community on TYM. To understand and play a character is one thing but to be a good player is another. Forever Elite or Xarakamaka can comment on Liu Kang, Eddy Wang on Lao, Blake/Mitsu on Scorpion, etc. Idk just some names off the top but you get the idea. We have a great community beneath all of the random people in threads.

I dont expect Tom Brady, Reo, Sonicfox, etc to come in and give in depth analysis on their characters. They're welcome to but I doubt they would lol

Yeah I guess you're right. I just don't know if there's at least 1 person for each character lol. Even then some of the people you think of mainly play 1 variation

 

[MKF30]

Cool thread, just want to say couldn't something like this also vary from player to player? Example, player A may master a combo or fundamentals of someone alot faster than player B.

@Dankster Morgan I was thinking I was the only person out there who've always hated that dreaded PS pad.

 

[xSamuel]

Cool thread, just want to say couldn't something like this also vary from player to player? Example, player A may master a combo or fundamentals of someone alot faster than player B.

@Dankster Morgan I was thinking I was the only person out there who've always hated that dreaded PS pad.

It's true that some people are better at overcoming learning curves but the height of the curve is still relative to each character. I mean, even though they may learn something faster it is still obvious that the difficulty is different. Mastering a run cancel character vs Ninjutsu combos lol, you see my point?

 

[MKF30]

It's true that some people are better at overcoming learning curves but the height of the curve is still relative to each character. I mean, even though they may learn something faster it is still obvious that the difficulty is different. Mastering a run cancel character vs Ninjutsu combos lol, you see my point?

Yeah totally, I guess I was emphaszing more on the latter end of your point lol. Like even some people still to this day have trouble with fatality and brutality imputs(though to be fair some of the requirements for brutalities are more difficult than the fatalities) but I'm sure you know what I mean. The run cancels are fun to work on vs. Ninjitsu and Inferno which are easier, I remember getting cramps in my hand practicing the cancels lol. Like damn game is going to give me carpal tunnel lol

 

[xSamuel]

Yeah totally, I guess I was emphaszing more on the latter end of your point lol. Like even some people still to this day have trouble with fatality and brutality imputs(though to be fair some of the requirements for brutalities are more difficult than the fatalities) but I'm sure you know what I mean. The run cancels are fun to work on vs. Ninjitsu and Inferno which are easier, I remember getting cramps in my hand practicing the cancels lol. Like damn game is going to give me carpal tunnel lol

yeah I definitely remember those days
Even MIT still can't input Fatalities correctly lmao

 

[Boss Savage]

Right now the hardest thing for me is trying to write descriptions for each section listed above in the OP. That will take some time unless I get some help.

I would say my fighting game knowledge and terminology is severely lacking, so it will take me some time until I brush up on it some more.

I'm hoping by the weekend this thread will be about 90% complete with far better descriptions and most if not all the variations rated. I'm really looking forward to this communities input.

 

[Zionix]

Cyrax is my vote for absolutely hardest variation.

His hardest combos require not only strong execution but in depth knowledge of the different conversion and sometimes you need to change the conversion with very little time to react.

His neutral is weak and his low pokes are non existent. His mids are easily low profiled and you often need to play very outside the box to catch opponents out.

There are quite alot of easy characters but some can be hard to master. I'd put slasher in as the easiest now his corner combos have gone, really not much to master.

 

[Matix218]

As far as characters i use:

Ninjutsu Scorpion: very easy combo execution (possibly easiest in the game?). At an advanced level against good players it becomes much more difficult to win because it requires very strong spacing to be successful but overall fairly easy character to use and understand.

Hellfire Scorpion: Has some more difficult execution requirements due to fbrc and tight links on flame aura, i would say somewhere in the middle of the cast execution wise, possibly harder. Gameplan is more difficult with hellfire as well. Requires knowledge of other characters because the character requires punishment and momentum as well as post combo mixups with fbrc pressure to be successful.

Smoke: Relatively simple basic bnb combo execution so somewhat easy to pick up and play. Very strong character but requires complex string/phase mixups to successfully pressure and press offense against good players (outside of straight vortex which nets relatively low damage). B2 is pretty much easy mode as far as normals go though. Overall fairly easy gameplan and execution.

GM Subby: Combos are fairly simple, probably somewhere in the middle compared to the rest of the cast. It takes lots of lab time to learn all of the optimal corner setups and gender specific combos and setups in order to be successful at high level gameplay. Clone can certainly be a crutch to help mask weak players when it comes to the neutral. I would say he is avarage in terms of execution and gameplan difficulty IMO.

 

[MrArcher15]

I want to see where this goes

 

[Dankster Morgan]

@Boss Savage I think the 5 tier system is the better choice.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

Based on the 5 tier system here is an example of each category imo
Beginner: Bojutsu Kung Jin
Easy: Ninjutsu Scorpion
Normal: Grandmaster Sub-Zero
Hard: Aftershock Tremor
Very hard: Brood Mother D'Vorah

 

[Zionix]

Based on the 5 tier system here is an example of each category imo
Beginner: Bojutsu Kung Jin
Easy: Ninjutsu Scorpion
Normal: Grandmaster Sub-Zero
Hard: A-List Johnny Cage
Very hard: Brood Mother D'Vorah

A-list isn't hard anymore, just normal.

 

[Dankster Morgan]

A-list isn't hard anymore, just normal.

I haven't played Cage in a while but it took me a pretty long time to jail with him. What changed so much?

 

[Zionix]

I haven't played Cage in a while but it took me a pretty long time to jail with him. What changed so much?

You not having to jail into a jail into a jail. His combos are mostly dash cancels now. Jailing is also not necessary with the armored launchers gone.

Focus has shifted to staggers and throws, although some would argue you should have always done this. The changes to Blockstun has made F3 cancel into throw insane.

It still works but its doesn't have the creativity and conversion it used to

 

[Dankster Morgan]

You not having to jail into a jail into a jail. His combos are mostly dash cancels now. Jailing is also not necessary with the armored launchers gone.

It still works but its doesn't have the creativity and conversion it used to

It's not as satisfying, that's for sure. Aftershock would probably be a better example of a high execution character.

 

[Plymarco]

Beginner: Scorpion Ninjutsu
Easy: Kitana Royal Storm
Normal: Sub Zero Grandmaster
Hard: Tremor Aftershock
Very Hard: Tanya DN

As a new player i didn't realize i was picking a hard variation in DN to play.lol

 

[TyCarter35]

Characters I play learning curve:
Ninjutsu: straightforward BnB's, however at higher levels, spacing out the opponent is key as u can't always go f2/f2~takedown mixup and getting whiff punishes through is important. with two hit armor being a thing now, u hv to play smarter with oki and armor breaking strats are MU dependent. must learn which AA options to use against jumps however as Ninjutsu has plenty but some are meant for specific situations.
CT Kano: medium. combos are easy to do. it's being able to open ur opponent up with b1 as now u can't bail out with db1 or the whole b121 string and b1 being fairly minus on block. EX DD1 got nerfed so u can't really over abuse Kano in that sense. The nerfs forces CT players to play smarter and make him more neutral based with d3 and d4. His AA options are great and his knife throw is still pretty good.
FA Jacqui: Medium to Medium Hard. Her combos are somewhat hard to do with RC being involved though if u can RC fine then it's easy. being able to utilize Stanky Leg in the neutral is the hardest thing to learn with Jacqui as SL can be frustrating with the inputs as her buttons are awful in the neutral with meh pokes. Zoning is braindead af with easy mixups and add f3/f4 cancelled into b2. wakeups are trash so there's that too.

 

[Boss Savage]

I added ratings to some of the characters based off of what people in this thread considered their entry level to be. Of course over time this will change.

I'm still not even close to completing the initial OP. This will honestly take quiet a bit of time. Hopefully everyone will stay patient.