MK11 Reversal Throw defensive options.

[KHTC Takgillo]

Can a mod close this thread it seem like it is pointless

 

[TakeAChance]

2019

where after 8 years of NRS fighting games, we learn that extended hurtboxes are a thing

future is looking bright for 2030

Just wanted to say, aside from your attitude thank you for helping me figure this out. Throws do indeed come out on the 10f on reversal, however, they still do outprioritize normals. a 10f reversal throw will beat a 10f normal.

You can test this with Cassies F2 into F2 which does not have a disjointed hitbox.

 

[TakeAChance]

Can a mod close this thread it seem like it is pointless

Just try f2 f4 as I suggested . If you're right, you should be able to succesfully reverse counter throw f4. I already know the answer but try it... in case I messed up.

Thanks for helping me with that, I assumed a reversal throw was 9f due to the reversal window...it is indeed 10f, however a 10f reversal throw will still beat a 10f normal afterwards. That you can check...with a non disjointed character.

 

[TakeAChance]

Play the tutorial man...

No he still can stagger because weapons don't have a hurtbox. So you can't hit him/throw him out of his b1 range.

Just fyi, none of the moves I showed above had the disjointed hurtbox...

 

[Sanjo]

Can a mod close this thread it seem like it is pointless

Well, I don't think it's pointless. I'm glad some people finally start labbing on their own instead of waiting for others to do the job... the guy may be wrong about stuff but that's how you learn to learn. Not by going on youtube and reaping tech without thinking, because that's NOT how you level up.

 

[Qwark28]

Just wanted to say, aside from your attitude thank you for helping me figure this out. Throws do indeed come out on the 10f on reversal, however, they still do outprioritize normals. a 10f reversal throw will beat a 10f normal.

You can test this with Cassies F2 into F2 which does not have a disjointed hitbox.

F2 is a normal.

It's 10 + 1

vs 10f + 0 reversal throw

I know this site's average lurker doesn't know anything about fighting games, but this is simple math.

 

[KHTC Takgillo]

Thanks for helping me with that, I assumed a reversal throw was 9f due to the reversal window...it is indeed 10f, however a 10f reversal throw will still beat a 10f normal afterwards. That you can check...with a non disjointed character.

Well, I don't think it's pointless. I'm glad some people finally start labbing on their own instead of waiting for others to do the job... the guy may be wrong about stuff but that's how you learn to learn. Not by going on youtube and reaping tech without thinking, because that's NOT how you level up.

I'm saying it's pointless for it to stay open since someone explained it to him

 

[KHTC Takgillo]

Thanks for helping me with that, I assumed a reversal throw was 9f due to the reversal window...it is indeed 10f, however a 10f reversal throw will still beat a 10f normal afterwards. That you can check...with a non disjointed character.

What's an example you have?

 

[Qwark28]

As stated Kabals B1 is a weapon move so dont worry, B1 is still a safe, confirmable, staggerable, no hurtbox, advancing mid with a krushing blow and built in mix up so you dont have to worry about pressing any other button besides B1 at all times

OSable too.

 

[Braindead]

Just fyi, none of the moves I showed above had the disjointed hurtbox...

IDK what you mean by that.

The point is, watch the video. You'll see how Scorpion jabs Raiden from way downtown. That's what the tutorial is trying to tell you. And that's what is happening with throws. It only looks weird with the throw because the game has to suck the opponent in for the throw animation to work.

Kabal can still stagger because b1 can't be hit. But in any case, staggers work not only because disjointed hurtboxes. They work because when you're blocking you're expecting a full string not one or two hits then stop short and catch you off guard. Throws won't miraculously save you because if you know a stagger is stopping short then you have a million other options already to use other than throw.

 

[Qwark28]

IDK what you mean by that.

The point is, watch the video. You'll see how Scorpion jabs Raiden from way downtown. That's what the tutorial is trying to tell you. And that's what is happening with throws. It only looks weird with the throw because the game has to suck the opponent in for the throw animation to work.

Kabal can still stagger because b1 can't be hit. But in any case, staggers work not only because disjointed hurtboxes. They work because when you're blocking you're expecting a full string not one or two hits then stop short and catch you off guard. Throws won't miraculously save you because if you know a stagger is stopping short then you have a million other options already to use other than throw.

TLDR for staggers

by the time you notice its a stagger, youre already several frames late

you anticipate staggers, not react. Because your opponent isnt.

 

[kcd117]

I don't think there is anything wrong with that tbh, if you think about it, it is nothing more than a high-risk low reward option against pressure.

With that said, I have been using that for a while with noob saibot after a D3 on block, as most people will try to counterpoke and have their limbs grabbed lol.

 

[@MylesWright_]

It gets even dumber on defense tho, because you can option select this on every single blocked portion...the only way it gets blown up is if a string as a true gap.

This sounds interesting. Can we get some more detail on this

 

[Blade4693]

I just wish a tech was a tech lol not a big fan of the 50/50 thing they have going on with throws in this game.

 

[KHTC Takgillo]

Thanks for helping me with that, I assumed a reversal throw was 9f due to the reversal window...it is indeed 10f, however a 10f reversal throw will still beat a 10f normal afterwards. That you can check...with a non disjointed character.

Who told you grabs don't act like specials? On reversal it act like a special so you can punish -10 with a throw reversal

 

[MsMiharo]

I want you guys to think about this.

ANYTHING that leaves a character at -3 or worse on a stagger, cannot contest with a reversal throw AT ALL unless they delay their own pressure.

So you mean you can't mash when you're minus? Don't tell the online scorpions!!!

 

[C-Sword]

Can't wait to play the google stadia version of MK11. Good luck trying to tech throw.

 

[Rip Torn]

Has anyone tested what happens when Fatal Blows trade? I'm pretty sure P1 always wins or it's just random.

 

[Matix218]

I want you guys to think about this.

ANYTHING that leaves a character at -3 or worse on a stagger, cannot contest with a reversal throw AT ALL unless they delay their own pressure.

So basically mash throw if their staggers are not plus

 

[TakeAChance]

So basically mash throw if their staggers are not plus

Pretty much, because they have to be damn near frame perfect to beat it out.

 

[TakeAChance]

@Qwark28 @Braindead

Looking for help here...

So Barakas, 2 leaves him at -9. He cannot duck a reversal throw, but it is not considered a punish. I'm assuming this is because it takes a frame to duck correct?

Reversal throw does punish -10 moves, which leads me to believe that IS infact considered a special (which was what I initially assumed).

Mind giving me a hand?

 

[Under_The_Mayo]

D'vorah relies heavily on this because she has no mids to counter pressure with. Hasn't this been known since Reo's video about it?

What's up chance.

 

[NRF CharlieMurphy]

I would say this isn't widely known

because there is literally nothing in the game that states a throw is treated like a special mid.

If NRS would just release their hitboxes.......................................................

 

[TakeAChance]

D'vorah relies heavily on this because she has no mids to counter pressure with. Hasn't this been known since Reo's video about it?

What's up chance.

I was on a quest today to see if throws out prioritized normals. My conclusion was incorrect and my Labbing continues. However, the reversal throw is a tool that beats a lot of non frame perfect junk. It's just not as tight as I initially thought (by 1 frame)

 

[TyCarter35]

Has anyone tested what happens when Fatal Blows trade? I'm pretty sure P1 always wins or it's just random.

I think the one to activate it first wins out normally due to the fact that fatal blows aren't instantly armored