MK11 Johnny Cage General Discussion

[Deleted member 35141]

Cage rage on hit is like +2 (if I remember right) it doesnt jail like I said standing 2 does but u still get some plus. Anyway man has tools. And if ur saying ur getting poked from just inside jump range when u standing 2...sorry bro u either never tried it or have no idea wtf im saying.

You are talking about s2 in 3 different scenarios, I'm baffled some of you play johnny and claim he cant get poked out of highs lol

 

[Error404]

Wait so your saying its a losing matchup for liu cause he whiffs a string yet johnny has even or winning matches against characters he whiffs against.
Hmm sounds kind of like a hypocrite

I'm saying that it's an even match and saying Cage loses badly is a lie.

 

[Rodney Quillz]

I'm saying that it's an even match and saying Cage loses badly is a lie.

I never said he loses badly I just said it wasn’t even.

I asked people to upload footage not in a way to “call them out” but to help out the community who struggles with this match up.

At the end of the day we are all cage mains and want to play this character to the fullest.

You being defensive as you are right now makes your post look like they come from a place of passion and not knowledge and insight.

 

[M.D.]

You are talking about s2 in 3 different scenarios, I'm baffled some of you play johnny and claim he cant get poked out of highs lol

I'm pretty sure they just play online in 200 ping and they think they actually jail.

And some arguments are clear giveaways that they have no clue or have not touched the character.

Caged rage on hit? +2 with half screen pushback and your fastest mid being 14? This is actually an argument? This is a tool? ROFL.
Have you people actually watched what's going on in this game? Did you even watch Evo?

THIS is a tool? Mother of God........

God help us all if the NRS balance team thinks the same as these people.

 

[Error404]

I never said he loses badly I just said it wasn’t even.

I asked people to upload footage not in a way to “call them out” but to help out the community who struggles with this match up.

At the end of the day we are all cage mains and want to play this character to the fullest.

You being defensive as you are right now makes your post look like they come from a place of passion and not knowledge and insight.

And I was never reffering to what you said exclusively. The posts about LK were in relation to forceballs whiffing and 9 frame mids alegedly making JC entirely unplayable.

 

[M.D.]

Nobody said it's unplayable, everyone said just it's not even.

 

[Deleted member 35141]

I will still play johnny but not as much as my 54-28 KL season 1 and my 65% win in 700 player matches was way too much effort. Also stopped played KL just tired of connections being so bad it looks like every time you duck your tbagging

Kompetitor made a comment in his last video of he started playing with scorpion and johnny feels like shit, how do you guys take that comment.

 

[Error404]

Not shocking really. I play JC , SZ , Skarlet , Kotal , Baraka and Scorpion ( none of them being as good as my JC obviously). But all the others seem bad compared to Scorpion. That character does not have a bad MU

 

[DrFolmer]

I would argue Cassie and Heehaw handle Scorpion quite well with superior buttons. Particularly HeeHaw as he has some of the absolute best pokes in the game. I think Reo also stated that HeeHaw does really well against Scorpion,

Anyway how's your sexlife

 

[Error404]

I would argue Cassie and Heehaw handle Scorpion quite well with superior buttons. Particularly HeeHaw as he has some of the absolute best pokes in the game. I think Reo also stated that HeeHaw does really well against Scorpion,

What a great story , Mark

 

[DrFolmer]

I cant for the living shit beat Sonya. I think I win like 1/10 sets against her. I cant fathom how I can fundamentally outplay someone's main and as soon as they switch to Sonya it's just right back to MKX. Her fucking d3 is an absolute menace and I swear that shit has low profiled shit that shouldnt be low profiled. The worst part is not even the damage. It's the constant Energy Ring bullshit that just triggers the shit out of me. Best projectile in the game, amp version knocks you back half a screen on block, makes for some stupid cheeky mixups up close. Sonya's dont even commit to the unsafe stuff, it's literally just Energy Ring on block for super pushback and back in the blender.

It's unbelievable how much stupid shit she can get away with. And when she finally commits to an unsafe mixup, it's good ole Online messing up the punish lul. I just need to level up my Flawless Blocks but it's insane how much the character can carry in the case of Sonya. And nobody has a poke game like hers. F4 low crushing is insane and it's PLUS? WTF

 

[Owerbart]

Come on people really?

This again? Wtf is this they rearranged something in the matrix?

Cetrion even? Kang even?

Did a truck of pot explode and gassed everyone?

I thought we already covered this a bazillion times. Are you actually playing Cage against those matchups? Is your opponent by any chance AFK and you think you're winning?

There is no sane person in the world that would think Cetrion is even. As I said before and it has been discussed endlessly with shitton of proof:

No 9 frame mid character is an even matchup.
No forceball whiffing hitbox character is an even matchup.

couldn't agree with this more. this is why f3 needs to become a mid. It's already a telegraphed string that against anyone with a working brain will just do some chip and thats it. it doesnt mix into anything because anyone seeing the animation that lasts like a full second, has the time of processing that the mixup ends up there. It's not like Kang's f4, which itself can continue or end there, but it takes like half of the time, giving your opponent less time to process. jax has his f3, same as scorp, jacqui has the cancels, cassie has f4. unfortunately until f3 isn't changed to be a mid, he is doomed to play an extremely weak neutral game at a disadvantage. any smart player knows that he can just crouch and johnny is done. B34 has a tortoise speed, and f4 is so slow that it will even get stuffed in neutral.

also people here apparently aren't seeing that most of the cast outdamage johnny by a wide margin, and they don't even have to spend bars. This kharacter has no krushing blows so he's bottom tier in the damage department.

also, please stop praising on the plus strings like 124 and 34u3 like they are an amazing tool. They are good, but you know what? Due to the pushback they have, and because YOU DON'T HAVE MIDS it means that in reality, they guarantee you fucking nothing. Any player knows that there's nothing he/she should respect afterwards. They might as well be 0 on block and nothing would change.

i please require you to stop making seem this kharacter is any good, or anyone that has a say in the development of this game is gonna read this forums and think "oh cage is ok, he doesn't need anything".

up play him in 6 months when this game loses any support from NRS, but until then, don't waste the chance to voice all the fatal flaws he has.

 

[ShepherdOfFire]

How is Geras a favorable match up ? I played like 5 Geras since the game launched, so I only know what I labbed, I have very little experience against him.

 

[Name v.5.0]

i please require you to stop making seem this kharacter is any good, or anyone that has a say in the development of this game is gonna read this forums and think "oh cage is ok, he doesn't need anything".

Is anyone actually upplaying Cage? I'm pretty sure our disagreements are over whether he's bad or if he's really bad. TYM knows that. NRS likely knows it too.

 

[Owerbart]

Is anyone actually upplaying Cage? I'm pretty sure our disagreements are over whether he's bad or if he's really bad. TYM knows that. NRS likely knows it too.

Saying that he doesn't lose to Kang, or that his buttons aren't shit tier is already too dangerously generous imo

 

[ReoSpeedwagon]

We found some tech, but no patch yet.

Can I get the Cliffnotes? Also is Kombat League just about grinding points? Watched some replays of the higher tiers just now and it didn't seem too crazy. Kung Lao spins into uppercuts vs a Scorpion punishing with grabs

 

[Name v.5.0]

Saying that he doesn't lose to Kang, or that his buttons aren't shit tier is already too dangerously generous imo

Welp he doesn't lose to Kang, so I guess I'm generous.

What happens when people hear Cage beats Geras? Doesnt that sound generous too? Maybe we should just blow smoke up everyone's ass and lie until maybe NRS buffs our crappy character.

 

[Owerbart]

Welp he doesn't lose to Kang, so I guess I'm generous.

What happens when people hear Cage beats Geras? Doesnt that sound generous too? Maybe we should just blow smoke up everyone's ass and lie until maybe NRS buffs our crappy character.

the small difference is that him beating Geras is actually true. geras' main string whiffs on johnny and his hitbox os so fucking huge that nothing whiffs. Geras is not that good and zoning and johnny gets a chance to get in. Kombat had no issues using Johnny only to beat Grr who has a very scary Geras. Geras isn't that good at playing neutral and that's why johnny has a chance.

 

[DeftMonk]

You are talking about s2 in 3 different scenarios, I'm baffled some of you play johnny and claim he cant get poked out of highs lol

I said one scenario that can lead to several guaranteed offensive possibilities afterwards. Hence why it is a good button. Name me one other character that has a button that fast, hit box well in front of hurtbox, that+ on hit and that fast recovery. Thus it and like many of his buttons have uses that you have to be creative about. Don’t come around here saying shit like “roflomgz man don’t have anything faster than 10 frames I can use when he’s on my nuts that isn’t a high! I get uppercutz by the top tiers all day!” Shit ain’t useful. Cage isn’t top 5 but he isn’t ass either. If u still don’t believe me let me know I’ll happily post vids of me in KL using the tech cuz I catch all kinds of fools with that shit everyday. They use advancing button sametime I press 2... I buffer dash they think throw let go of block catch 12 nutpunch.

 

[Owerbart]

I said one scenario that can lead to several guaranteed offensive possibilities afterwards. Hence why it is a good button. Name me one other character that has a button that fast, hit box well in front of hurtbox, that+ on hit and that fast recovery. Thus it and like many of his buttons have uses that you have to be creative about. Don’t come around here saying shit like “roflomgz man don’t have anything faster than 10 frames I can use when he’s on my nuts that isn’t a high! I get uppercutz by the top tiers all day!” Shit ain’t useful. Cage isn’t top 5 but he isn’t ass either.

i think is much more useful to clearly warn anyone playing johnny that the neutral is going to be an uphill battle rather than selling smoke saying that you can use non-advancing highs in neutral to put pressure on an opponent when any strong player knows that johnny is extremely weak to just crouching.

 

[Rodney Quillz]

I said one scenario that can lead to several guaranteed offensive possibilities afterwards. Hence why it is a good button. Name me one other character that has a button that fast, hit box well in front of hurtbox, that+ on hit and that fast recovery. Thus it and like many of his buttons have uses that you have to be creative about. Don’t come around here saying shit like “roflomgz man don’t have anything faster than 10 frames I can use when he’s on my nuts that isn’t a high! I get uppercutz by the top tiers all day!” Shit ain’t useful. Cage isn’t top 5 but he isn’t ass either. If u still don’t believe me let me know I’ll happily post vids of me in KL using the tech cuz I catch all kinds of fools with that shit everyday. They use advancing button sametime I press 2... I buffer dash they think throw let go of block catch 12 nutpunch.

Post them.

 

[DeftMonk]

i think is much more useful to clearly warn anyone playing johnny that the neutral is going to be an uphill battle rather than selling smoke saying that you can use non-advancing highs in neutral to put pressure on an opponent when any strong player knows that johnny is extremely weak to just crouching.

Bro character is not some liu Kang mkx every matchup plays the same jail them to death. But there’s loads of tools and some characters advancing tools are better than Johnny. Get in range and if u expect that button hit 2. Johnny is a kind of yolo character for real everything he does almost can get fucked but if u guess right you can reap something. The problem is most people don’t want to add more guessing tools to their toolkit instead just get posts like “lol f3 I get d2’d it sux”

 

[Hor_PeT]

I play more Johnny Cage for fun..he is so bad compared to other high tier character.

But fun as I can really focus on fundamentals as there is no good hitconfirmable mid in the tools Even need to fight for "free F3" lol (and straight force ball can whiff).

That's fun.

 

[FoughtDragon01]

Can I get the Cliffnotes? Also is Kombat League just about grinding points? Watched some replays of the higher tiers just now and it didn't seem too crazy. Kung Lao spins into uppercuts vs a Scorpion punishing with grabs

@Wigy found Amp'd Nut Punch tech that leaves us +17 if spaced right. Irish Mantis expanded on it more on his Twitter.

Guaranteed pressure after NP

When spaced correctly np mb will whiff at the end of a juggle. For instance. You can do off d2 antiair into d1 np As you can see the opponent is set to jump out, and f3 still connects

testyourmight.com

+17 on hit Nut Punch Restand by Irish Mantis!

Amazing find by IrishMantis on Twitter! At the cost of another bar, you can get a restand that lets you jail ANY normal!

testyourmight.com

Then there was some nice flash parry tech that uses his Fatal Blow armor, but it sounded like some people already knew about it.

Johnny Cage Flash Parry Concept from MonkeyBizness

After Kombat's crazy showing last weekend at CEO, Johnny Cage has been back on people's radar. If you were looking to see what he's capable of for yourself, scope out this flash parry setup using his Fatal Blow cancel. For you newer faces, a Flash Parry is when a character uses an armored...

testyourmight.com

There was also some sorta-universal pressure guide made by Killabyte. It revolved around Scorpion, but it doesn't seem impossible to try and apply some of the concepts to Johnny.

Scorpion: Perfect Pressure Tutorial (Advanced Tech)

Hello. This is some really high level dirt, explained and demonstrated in detail. Anyone who would like to optimize their offense with Scorpion, watch this video, and feel free to ask me any questions you have here in the forums, on twitter @FGMonkeyBizness, or on the Youtube video comments...

testyourmight.com

As for Kombat League, yeah, it's mostly about grinding points to try and get access to the higher tier cosmetics at Demi God and above. I think there's a Jade brutality in the reward pool for this season. And yeah, it's not that bad if you can look past the plug pullers, and the inconsistent WiFi connections, and having to fight the same top tiers over and over and over again. It definitely rewards time sunk, though. Since you nearly always gain more points per win than you lose per loss, you can have a 50% winrate and still climb to the upper tiers.

 

[heildan]

Calm down, fellas. This thread escalated so quickly that I got confused.

Anyway. I mostly agree with what you said M.D, apart from his matchup against Kang, which in my experience SEEMS 5-5, even if he has some kind of a 9 frame mid, but that doesn't mean we don't have to work to beat him. Not galaxy brain level work, like most top tiers, but we have to work somehow, and it does work. I find Kung Lao much more difficult in comparison because of the reach and pushbacks from his strings, air control, setups, aa's and great wakeups.

However, there's absolutely NO WAY you can count on ducking that Kang string mid match. Its fast, it comes out before you can even think, you don't expect it, I've tried. Its not an honest thing to say we can count on it, people may end eating up an 34% combo just because.

(OBS: Saying Cage beats Cetrion is madness).