Lord Raiden General Discussion Thread

[KH_Seraph]

I'm talking about Raijin Raiden mostly. I got absolutely rolled by one and was completely afraid to press any buttons because it felt like every go-to blockstring was punished by discharge; dealing with that on top of his b1 and b31 staggers/cancels, getting hit randomly by damn overheads and thrown all over the place- He's pretty good. I've played Liu Kang, Cassie, Johnny, Jacqui, Frost, and Kollector so far, but Raiden has been the most interesting overall to play for me. His second fatality is also the GOAT, haha.

Loving him so far, really fun.

 

[Marlow]

Is it not possible to cancel 243 into Storm Cell? Mostly I've been messing around with Raijin, so I don't have much experience with Thunder Wave. Even if you can't cancel 243 into Storm Cell, you can still cancel it into Electric Fly for decent damage and great corner push.

 

[KH_Seraph]

People make him sound like the worst character of all time, but I'm not convinced.

I agree, I just don't see it. He strikes me as highly technical, and just because you have to use a few more braincells than usual to be successful with him doesn't mean he's the worst character in the game. I picked him up, labbed for an hour, and then went on like an 8 win streak with Raiden online the other day just doing staggers, throws, and unoptimized combos, haha; literally just a 1 hr Raiden w/ fundamentals. He's really fun actually if given the chance.

@Marlow should be able to do it in the corner at least? I know 243 into his one anti-air call lightning move works in the corner.

 

[rainuS]

ok he is hidden top tier we are just downplayig fishes who wannts him S+++ tier

 

[Trustful_Whale]

we complained and they nerfed raijin by making not punish everything and told us to love it.

What? They buffed Raijin.

Is he really that bad? He's probably not in the top half, but I didn't think he was awful by any stretch.

He's not, just the sky falls a lot around here.

 

[ExpectFlames]

Is it not possible to cancel 243 into Storm Cell? Mostly I've been messing around with Raijin, so I don't have much experience with Thunder Wave. Even if you can't cancel 243 into Storm Cell, you can still cancel it into Electric Fly for decent damage and great corner push.

Raidens damage isnt an issue you can easily get 35 to 40 percent for a bar. Problem is he has no way to open you up all of his string are unsafe all of his pokes are unsafe are of his specials are unsafe does he have tool yeah hell yeah are they applicable no.

 

[ExpectFlames]

I'm talking about Raijin Raiden mostly. I got absolutely rolled by one and was completely afraid to press any buttons because it felt like every go-to blockstring was punished by discharge; dealing with that on top of his b1 and b31 staggers/cancels, getting hit randomly by damn overheads and thrown all over the place- He's pretty good. I've played Liu Kang, Cassie, Johnny, Jacqui, Frost, and Kollector so far, but Raiden has been the most interesting overall to play for me. His second fatality is also the GOAT, haha.

Loving him so far, really fun.

Rajin doesnt have any stagger pressure raiden in general doesnt. None of his options are safe on block sure you have discharge, but after that if you want to remain safe you have to give up your turn with either f4 or f32. Raiden has phenomenal tools but none of them are any better than the sum of their parts stormcell is death on block low pole is death on block EF death on block b12 death on block b12 death on block s1 high f1 worste move in the entire game. No AA jab terrible zoning tools GOD AWFUL B2. Raiden isnt secret anything hes not better than kotal and once kano gets a mid hes not better than him either.

 

[Trustful_Whale]

Problem is he has no way to open you up all of his string are unsafe all of his pokes are unsafe

This isn't even close to accurate.

 

[Marlow]

Raidens damage isnt an issue you can easily get 35 to 40 percent for a bar. Problem is he has no way to open you up all of his string are unsafe all of his pokes are unsafe are of his specials are unsafe does he have tool yeah hell yeah are they applicable no.

What are you defining as safe or unsafe? D1 and D3 are -3. F4 is -3. His 243 string is -3. F3 is -6, which is safe. F32 is also -6. Again, safe. If you're playing as Raijin and you have quick charge activated he has access to a safe special.

 

[ExpectFlames]

What? They buffed Raijin.


He's not, just the sky falls a lot around here.

They gave him an unsafe launcher.
They gave d2 amp with buff push back

They took away the reason to use low pole in the first place
They took away your ability to punish anything that's only slightly negative
They took away your ability restand mid screen from some some combos

All the while still not fixing buff going away during any type of CS.

Did Rajin change yes, there is an argument to be made weather or not its ostensibly better.

 

[Marlow]

They took away the reason to use low pole in the first place

How did they do that? I didn't think anything really changed with that move other than it launches on amp.

 

[ExpectFlames]

What are you defining as safe or unsafe? D1 and D3 are -3. F4 is -3. His 243 string is -3. F3 is -6, which is safe. F32 is also -6. Again, safe. If you're playing as Raijin and you have quick charge activated he has access to a safe special.

S2 is a high. f3 is ok at best but not stagger able its 11 frames. Landing f3 or f32 gives up your turn. D134 are solid pokes sure but what does it culminate to? Like I said raiden has a shit ton of tools to use. Absolutely none of them add up to anything he doesnt have a single winning matchup in game currently.

 

[ExpectFlames]

How did they do that? I didn't think anything really changed with that move other than it launches on amp.

I played a lot if Rajin before it was cool. Low pole is a fullscreen projectile catch people trying to whiff punish f11

 

[Marlow]

I played a lot if Rajin before it was cool. Low pole is a fullscreen projectile catch people trying to whiff punish f11

Is it not still a projectile after you activate Quick Charge?

 

[ExpectFlames]

Is it not still a projectile after you activate Quick Charge?

Nah it's still the same but to support my argument its the principle of the change. Sure now it launches but should it

 

[Marlow]

S2 is a high. f3 is ok at best but not stagger able its 11 frames. Landing f3 or f32 gives up your turn. D134 are solid pokes sure but what does it culminate to? Like I said raiden has a shit ton of tools to use. Absolutely none of them add up to anything he doesnt have a single winning matchup in game currently.

S2 jails off of F3 on hit. I'd say F3 is a stagger because you can either stop at the F3, which is safe, or continue with the F32, which is also still safe. You give up your turn, but that's true of any move that's negative on block. D1 and D3 can lead to F4 or F3, both safe. If you're point blank and the opponent is respecting your D1 and D3 pokes by blocking, you can go with a standing 3 which is +3 on block.

He doesn't have any automatic safe fast mids into safe launcher, but that's not the only way to play a character either.

 

[ExpectFlames]

S2 jails off of F3 on hit. I'd say F3 is a stagger because you can either stop at the F3, which is safe, or continue with the F32, which is also still safe. You give up your turn, but that's true of any move that's negative on block. D1 and D3 can lead to F4 or F3, both safe. If you're point blank and the opponent is respecting your D1 and D3 pokes by blocking, you can go with a standing 3 which is +3 on block.

He doesn't have any automatic safe fast mids into safe launcher, but that's not the only way to play a character either.

You haven't said anything wrong. We agree raiden has tools. But tell me who does he best. I can't think if a single matchup R has any edge in. Any other game raiden would be rock solid just not this one close range he can't contest most of the cast mid range he loses and fullscreen he loses easily.

 

[Marlow]

I think what I am disappointed about is that his coolest looking move was that floating stance thing he got, so I was really hoping he'd get that in his 3rd variation.

 

[ExpectFlames]

I think what I am disappointed about is that his coolest looking move was that floating stance thing he got, so I was really hoping he'd get that in his 3rd variation.

I don't hate what they choose, I think this might be cast wide but a lot if the moves kinda function similar to one another. All if his variations have essentially the same gameplay loop super unsafe move big damage or big loss.

 

[Black Chapters]

I think what I am disappointed about is that his coolest looking move was that floating stance thing he got, so I was really hoping he'd get that in his 3rd variation.

that move is horrible though

 

[rainuS]

I don't hate what they choose, I think this might be cast wide but a lot if the moves kinda function similar to one another. All if his variations have essentially the same gameplay loop super unsafe move big damage or big loss.

The thing is bo push is less damage and switches sides and obviously is unsafe. Why would I use it instead of V1 or v2? You get 292 damage one bar ending in superman.

 

[Marlow]

that move is horrible though

I think Mustard was showing off some interesting stuff with it in his possible 3rd Variation Idea series he was doing.

 

[rainuS]

I think Mustard was showing off some interesting stuff with it in his possible 3rd Variation Idea series he was doing.

he gave him lightining storm, that air stance where he can shoot air projectiles do an overhead and so on. But instead NRS gave us bo push this move is trash

 

[Black Chapters]

I think Mustard was showing off some interesting stuff with it in his possible 3rd Variation Idea series he was doing.

No, not really

For one, it can be hit out the air by high projectiles.

The timing is very tight to AA, you damn near need to guess.

The diagonal shot is slow enough that a few characters can punish it (Jacqui for one)

Unlike everyone else with air projectiles Raiden is forced to fire from a fixed position everytime.

 

[Marlow]

he gave him lightining storm, that air stance where he can shoot air projectiles do an overhead and so on. But instead NRS gave us bo push this move is trash

Yeah, it looks pretty boring to me. The lightning rod thing could be interesting, depending on how some other stuff shakes out. Probably not going to change his fortunes overnight though.