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mook

Mortal
Man people really want that second story crap to be true huh? Aftermath gave an ending and set up the reboot, why would they go like "Oh actually here‘s some story that happened before/after all this"?
 

Vslayer

Juiced Moose On The Loose
Lead Moderator
Man people really want that second story crap to be true huh? Aftermath gave an ending and set up the reboot, why would they go like "Oh actually here‘s some story that happened before/after all this"?
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Ptehu

Prince of Edenia
The only reason why I'm waiting for ANOTHER MK story (whatever if it's KP3.5 in MK11 or MK12 itself) it's that I still wait for a GOOD storymode without plot-holes, forced fights, shitty decisions and certain bad guys acting like a punching-bags. They introduced sooo many cool-looking characters throughout the game, with amazing movesets and powers and yet, we never had the chance to PLAY AS many of them and feel them being developed. Most recent example? They introduced crazy-ass looking Kollector and the only thing when he is present in the story is where he gets his butt kicked. Same with Erron. Let's take also example of Skarlet - let her shine for a moment, not being a jobber and dumb bitch that is acting like 'haha I love Shao Kahn, come on defeat me fast'. Damn, Kotal is the guy who needs redemption like anyone in the MK Universe! We have Ermac, Reptile and many more that are either unused at all or are used like 'hey Johnny need another fight in his chapter - who else can he beat?'. Let's at once have some different approach in the story. Not only good guys vs bad guys (and, oh shit, in MK11 it was more like good guys vs good guys turned bad - THAT'S THE MOST LAZY THING I CAN IMAGINE). And yes, while I appreciate D'Vorah's chapters it's still a drop in the ocean.

There is so much potential there. So much to be done and so much I can think about. And then here I'm reading about Mr. Canciolo or other "creative person" that is "NOT INSPIRED BY PERSONA OF RAIN". And then here I'm seeing fights like Sonya beating 9328239432-years old golem Geras, Jacqui beating Elder God - Cetrion (well, she is introduced as one of the most powerful being and then she is dumped to the trash like random Tarkata) and in the end the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen in MK - Kung Jin beating emperor Kotal Kahn and making him beg for his life xDDDDD

Yes, I desperately need another story, because I feel like FINALLY they need to come up with something decent. No way they go worse than what we received in MKX (especially) and MK11 with Aftermath. Peace Out!
 

Nickolaidas

Agent of Chaosrealm
The only reason why I'm waiting for ANOTHER MK story (whatever if it's KP3.5 in MK11 or MK12 itself) it's that I still wait for a GOOD storymode without plot-holes, forced fights, shitty decisions and certain bad guys acting like a punching-bags. They introduced sooo many cool-looking characters throughout the game, with amazing movesets and powers and yet, we never had the chance to PLAY AS many of them and feel them being developed. Most recent example? They introduced crazy-ass looking Kollector and the only thing when he is present in the story is where he gets his butt kicked. Same with Erron. Let's take also example of Skarlet - let her shine for a moment, not being a jobber and dumb bitch that is acting like 'haha I love Shao Kahn, come on defeat me fast'. Damn, Kotal is the guy who needs redemption like anyone in the MK Universe! We have Ermac, Reptile and many more that are either unused at all or are used like 'hey Johnny need another fight in his chapter - who else can he beat?'. Let's at once have some different approach in the story. Not only good guys vs bad guys (and, oh shit, in MK11 it was more like good guys vs good guys turned bad - THAT'S THE MOST LAZY THING I CAN IMAGINE). And yes, while I appreciate D'Vorah's chapters it's still a drop in the ocean.

There is so much potential there. So much to be done and so much I can think about. And then here I'm reading about Mr. Canciolo or other "creative person" that is "NOT INSPIRED BY PERSONA OF RAIN". And then here I'm seeing fights like Sonya beating 9328239432-years old golem Geras, Jacqui beating Elder God - Cetrion (well, she is introduced as one of the most powerful being and then she is dumped to the trash like random Tarkata) and in the end the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen in MK - Kung Jin beating emperor Kotal Kahn and making him beg for his life xDDDDD

Yes, I desperately need another story, because I feel like FINALLY they need to come up with something decent. No way they go worse than what we received in MKX (especially) and MK11 with Aftermath. Peace Out!
This will never happen as long as MK story modes work in chapters of the same character fighting 3-5 times in a row. Every character you control in story mode is in 'God Mode'. Which is why Cyrax beats everyone when you play as Cyrax, D'Vorah beats everyone when you play as D'Vorah, Kung Jin beats everyone when playing as Kung Jin, etc.

They subtly tried to fix this by making jobbers do a couple of cool things. For example, even though Baraka doesn't win a single match in MK11 (because you always play against him), they made him look more badass than MK9/X by showing him KO'ing nameless mooks in one hit (a badass kill is still a badass kill even when vs a nameless mook), Sheeva telling Kitana she needs him if she ever hopes to advance the plot, Kitana honestly trying to work with him (making the viewer subconsciously realize Baraka's actually useful), and him being the only one who saw past Shang Tsung's morphing skillz. Subtle things which made him look better than Erron and Noob without him needing to win a single match.

Or Reptile in MKX being the spark that began the civil war by openly refuting her claim to the throne (even though it made no sense once you think about it).
 

Ptehu

Prince of Edenia
Well, then why not take a step ahead and change this chapter-based story mode? As it's clearly destroying the bad guys and is giving temporal plot armor to good guys. But that has to be a part of next MK game, not possible for any additions to MK11 for obvious reason.

I mean, chapter-based story IMO worked really good in MK9 - but mainly because the scenario was decent. There were still minor plot holes and unnecessary fights (can't remember out of the top of my head now but Johnny vs Jax for example), but as a whole it ended up a good story that also let less known (for majority) characters shine! And of course, for ONE game we could have bad guys as a jobbers - Unterstand that we can't give the spotlight to everyone at the same time for sure. But now what we have? 3rd game in a row we have Jax, Sonya, Johnny, Scorpion, Sub-Zero in the spotlight. 2 out of 3 games - Jade, Kitana, Liu, Kung Lao, Cassie, Jacqui, Raiden. Maybe I missed someone but you get the point that I need more diversity!

There are soooo many options to be explored: Edenia freedom, more Black Dragon vs Red Dragon part, war for Netherrealm, Outworld civil war, Chaosrealm, Orderrealm, Reptile seeking for his race, D'Vorah and other Outworlders things, hell, even Ferra/Torr's & Kollector's race exploration! I'm not trying to create another Game of Thrones here but hey, if we are that faaaar away of MK being only a tournament to prevent merging the realms, let's not have Earthrealm vs everyone as a main plot in 4th game in a row, please :)

It's really not that hard having all these possibilities in your hand already. Just the matter of how to use it with proper balance.
 

MK Dragon

Apprentice
The way NRS sets up the story chapter wise is fine to me. Since it's the first thing I do, it allows me to learn a character over a few matches, gives us a chance to fight against or as newcomers and such. With the addition of Aftermath it also finally put you in the shoes of 'evil' or bad characters for once. It's always going to be viewed pre-dominantly from the side of earth realm, special forces and their allies.

However Boon admitting they revolve the story around certain fight matchups is an issue and probably has more of an effect on the overall story than we might assume. It is probably the reason Noob feels forced into the story for example, but even more so might be the reason we got another time travel story. It's the easiest way to get the match-ups you want, like Kotal vs. Shao Kahn, Kitana vs. Shao, Sindel vs. Kitana, Noob vs. Sub-Zero, Raiden vs. Shang Tsung, Liu vs. Shang Tsung. These are all classic battles or battles that are of great significance and I'm sure everyone wanted to see if NRS had asked who you want to see fight in the next MK, since we either hadn't seen them before or just not recently.

The easiest way to do this is time travel since a few have to brought back to life or out of their revenant state. Even just revolving the story around certain characters and not necessarily the fights to me is a bit cheap, since it stifles creativity and I cannot totally fault the writers for the story when the boss wants certain things. I rather writers get total creative freedom to come up with a plot outline and then look at which characters are significant. I'm sure it would not have been a time travel story if a person was asked to come up with a story with X in particular in mind.

That being said, it worked for me this time. It brought back some of my favourites and story wise they found a way for it to make sense. Baraka is a great example of this and he has become a significant character and as Nickolaidas pointed out, he's much more than a jobber even without really winning a fight. I don't care for their reasoning behind it, it's obvious he is relevant and not just a dumb monster anymore. Same for Sheeva who is now the leader of the Shokan and greatly respected.

It did relegate others like an Erron Black & Skarlet to just filler status, but not everyone can be relevant. Still with regards to characters just used for fights, even someone like Kotal, is just poor writing. In Kotal's case probably simply because the team loves Shao and decided it would be awesome for his glorious return to be that he's stronger than Kotal. In MKX it didn't work at all for me as the spawn of veteran characters' seed were pushed into every part of the story along with their parents. It felt like Shinnok's part was only used to set-up in the inevitable death of Quan Chi at Scorpion's hands and somehow after the Trilogy reboot using parts of MK4 just naturally followed.

The ending of X set up Dark Raiden - Deception - story and the teaser did seem to have a bigger role for him and Shinnok to play, but that was left out or left unfinished, which is really the biggest problem I have with MK11. In general it's funny though how convoluted they made everything with the titans, changed status of gods and elder gods, turning everything into a simplistic familial relationship. Then there's a great concept like Geras turned into an irrelevant man who can be beaten and thrown into a bottomless sea. The Greek mythology in general is just very poor, feels forced and there was no need for it.

Writing in MKX and MK11 in general is really paradoxical, at least partially work of a writer who has only followed a Hollywood Script 101 and Greek mythology 101 course and watched time travel movies like Avengers to help him. Dominic actually admitted doing the latter. With Boon's claim that MK's story mode are on the level of Hollywood movies I'm sure it's again not just the writers fault. He or they want certain fights, want the chapter based setup, seen from the protagonists POV, maybe even forced them to use time travel and then expect a great story as well. That's just not going to happen.

Both games had strong parts, but at this point I feel like Dominic and the new writing team are just trying to put their own stamp on the MK franchise.. And not in a good way. I do not see a Tobias or Chard doubling down this hard on time travel and one part of established characters' characteristics. Johnny is now a perv, Sindel a soulless witch, Shao Kahn a dumb brute, Sonya a cool military female cliche, Kano a disgusting pig, Kung Lao oozing pure arrogance (in an American way), Nightwolf the token 'I brought shame to my family honour' character etc. It's simplistic and quite silly.

But then you have these beautiful moments in both games, from Kung Jin's backstory to Fujin's struggle with connecting to humans as a god. There's also great writing by Kittelsen in the comics, so I really wonder who's responsible for some of the major flaws in characters and the overall story. In general I'd prefer a more loose style - like most people - that focuses less on individual characters, but have the fights serve the story so go nuts with it and have good guys get into it over ego, have evil characters fight each other for dominance. I would've loved to see a throwback scene where you need to fight Kintaro as Sheeva for the rule of the Shokan. Or Skarlet and Kollector battle it out over who's really Shao's second in command.

Now, with regards to another story, I'd welcome it with open arms IF it takes on a new twist to one of the two endings. Not just ow they had the wrong crown, which makes no sense given the two endings. Now given the first ending makes most sense for MK12, going back to the beginning, Shang's ending with chaos and order realm would make the most sense for another expansion. This would involve Havik, Hotaru and could just set up a crazy story that just ends in Raiden and or Fujin breaking loose of the spell and defeating Shang. However, I am 100% convinced another story expansion is just not going to happen.
 
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Ptehu

Prince of Edenia
@MK Dragon Even though I don't agree with some of the points - that's exactly the type of posts I'd love to read on this forum! Coming from minds passionate about the MK lore and not only casul players who are picking characters because "hey, they have easy combos" and are begging for more guests. HUGE Kudos for that!!
 

Nickolaidas

Agent of Chaosrealm
Well, then why not take a step ahead and change this chapter-based story mode? As it's clearly destroying the bad guys and is giving temporal plot armor to good guys. But that has to be a part of next MK game, not possible for any additions to MK11 for obvious reason.

I mean, chapter-based story IMO worked really good in MK9 - but mainly because the scenario was decent. There were still minor plot holes and unnecessary fights (can't remember out of the top of my head now but Johnny vs Jax for example), but as a whole it ended up a good story that also let less known (for majority) characters shine! And of course, for ONE game we could have bad guys as a jobbers - Unterstand that we can't give the spotlight to everyone at the same time for sure. But now what we have? 3rd game in a row we have Jax, Sonya, Johnny, Scorpion, Sub-Zero in the spotlight. 2 out of 3 games - Jade, Kitana, Liu, Kung Lao, Cassie, Jacqui, Raiden. Maybe I missed someone but you get the point that I need more diversity!

There are soooo many options to be explored: Edenia freedom, more Black Dragon vs Red Dragon part, war for Netherrealm, Outworld civil war, Chaosrealm, Orderrealm, Reptile seeking for his race, D'Vorah and other Outworlders things, hell, even Ferra/Torr's & Kollector's race exploration! I'm not trying to create another Game of Thrones here but hey, if we are that faaaar away of MK being only a tournament to prevent merging the realms, let's not have Earthrealm vs everyone as a main plot in 4th game in a row, please :)

It's really not that hard having all these possibilities in your hand already. Just the matter of how to use it with proper balance.
The problem with having bad guy chapters is the fact that it's hard to make narrative sense of them sparing their opponents. I mean, with D'Vorah, she needed Cassie to be all 'down, girl!' whenever she was about to kill her opponent. Noob, Baraka, Scarlet ... these aren't the type of characters to let their opponent breathing if they win. It's not impossible to think of something, but it's much easier to write a story with the good guys winning the matches.

I remember NRS admitting that they didn't like certain characters having less screen time on the story mode, which is why they enjoyed the intro dialogues on vs matches, since those were able to flesh out lesser characters to the eyes of the fans (which I agree completely - the vs matches gave you a much better understanding of Erron Black's personality than the story mode ... considering he talks for three seconds there ... even though he had a slight better treatment in Aftermath).
 

trufenix

bye felicia
what does it mean? Asking seriously - not into the datamining or anything like that?
It means that placeholder entries have been made in the Steam store database for new DLC entries, at least three are the solo characters, and another for the time warriors pack. Two unknown.
 

Ptehu

Prince of Edenia
thanks for explanation. Anyway I'll tell you one thing. EVERY TIME when I expected something unexpected from NRS (hidden characters, surprising announcement during Kombat Kast, secret chapters in the story, secret unlockables, well - literally ANYTHING) I ended up empty-handed.

So, my expectations are as low as the Dead Sea :)
 

Vslayer

Juiced Moose On The Loose
Lead Moderator
It's probably the three characters in two different region-locked codes.
That's what I was thinking, the character's codes are already in the game so of course they would start to add them now. It's nearly 3 weeks till release.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
If one of these three make it in, I'll be happy. ^^



Sareena is overrated tho.
I still think Sareena will never be out there again, unless she teams up with her sisters.
The variation system it's a perfect way to give us Kia Jataaka and Sareena all in one character with different looks tho.
 

Benlo

PrayforSareena
I care for the 3 lol, and i think Jataaka and Kia have a lot more in them than Sareena alone, she is that type of character that it's a 3 for 1, if you do one you have to do all 3, kinda like tri-borg now.
But Sareena has a biggest story arc, ties with Noob and Sub Zero, compared to Kia or Jataaka. She could be a great, alone, fighter, in my opinion.
 

KCJ506

Kombatant
Sareena is overrated tho.
I don't see how a character can be "overrated" when they don't have a fanbase outside of people that post on internet message boards. And we're in the minority. The average MK fan doesn't even know who she is. If anything Sareena's underused and hasn't been used to her full potential and taking the variation system into account which she'd benefit from a lot.